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Unofficial Michel Thomas courses project | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Language Programs, Books & Tapes |  | |
| Random review Diglot Senior Member United Kingdom Joined 5781 days ago 781 posts - 1310 votes  Speaks: English*, Spanish Studies: Portuguese, Mandarin, Yiddish, German | Message 33 of 97 10 September 2011 at 3:23am | IP Logged | |||||
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Hi, Kugel. Interesting post. Can you explain what you mean in a bit more detail, please?
I don't know much about this whole area. 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| Kugel Senior Member United States Joined 6536 days ago 497 posts - 555 votes Speaks: English* | Message 34 of 97 10 September 2011 at 8:34am | IP Logged | |||||
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I haven't progressed further than basic propositional and predicate logic so I'm not the one to ask the details about(I'm right about to take Modal Logic next semester if it makes any difference). But my point was that it's the logical operators that determine the flow of the course, not the particular ways that each idea can be translated. A simple example in English to demonstrate ways to construct the conditional:
MT ⊃ I 1. Michel Thomas rollerskates 2. I rollerblade. 3. If MT rollerskates, then I rollerblade 4. If MT rollerskates, I rollerblade 5. When MT rollerskates, I rollerblade 6. Should MT rollerskate, I will rollerblade 7. I will rollerblade provided that MT will rollerskate Edited by Kugel on 10 September 2011 at 8:37am 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| Chris Heptaglot Senior Member Japan Joined 7119 days ago 287 posts - 452 votes Speaks: English*, Russian, Indonesian, French, Malay, Japanese, Spanish Studies: Dutch, Korean, Mongolian | Message 35 of 97 12 September 2011 at 2:37pm | IP Logged | |||||
Neil, you really need to check with Hodder (now Hachette) and see exactly where you stand with regard to creating these courses and using references to Michel Thomas before going any further. We're talking trademarks and copyrights here, so I would be very surprised if Hodder allowed you to trade off MT's name, even for courses you are planning to distribute free. You're even going to copy the format of the courses. Bear in mind that Ginny was head of languages, not the legal department, so she may have given you the impression that what you are planning is OK, without knowing that it wasn't. Ginny retired just over a year ago, around the time Hodder was bought out by Hachette. The new head of languages is a Robert Williams. Why not drop him a line and tell him what you propose? You never know what might come of it. It is a Noble undertaking indeed, though. (Noble - get it? LOL) 2 persons have voted this message useful | ||||||
| Neil_UK Tetraglot Groupie United Kingdom Joined 5260 days ago 50 posts - 64 votes Speaks: English*, German, Esperanto, Welsh Studies: Polish, Italian, Spanish, Russian, Mandarin, Japanese, Scottish Gaelic, French | Message 36 of 97 16 September 2011 at 8:11pm | IP Logged | |||||
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Thanks again for all your responses. I'll give everything some thought and I'll update
you soon. 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| Cainntear Pentaglot Senior Member Scotland linguafrankly.blogsp Joined 6009 days ago 4399 posts - 7687 votes Speaks: Lowland Scots, English*, French, Spanish, Scottish Gaelic Studies: Catalan, Italian, German, Irish, Welsh | Message 37 of 97 20 September 2011 at 3:01pm | IP Logged | |||||
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Sorry I've not been about, but I've been busy moving to an island to become a full-time student of Gaelic and Irish, while simultaneously trying to get the final work done for the French part of my degree in French and Spanish (with a side study in English and a little bit of Welsh). I'm also trying to brush up my Polish to impress a local barmaid.
Does that sound like showing off? Well...
...this. Look, I've paid over 10 grand to universities, spent hundreds on learning materials, a couple of thousand on films, novels and music in various languages, another thousand on a CELTA certificate. All in all, that probably comes to over 10% of the money I earned during my 9 year career in IT, which I have given up in order to move into the somewhat less well-paid field of language teaching. I've dedicated untold hours to studying languages; reading linguistics texts and pedagogical guides; helping others with their language problems; and (crucially) deconstructing what MT did and applying it to my own learning and the teaching of others. I have a genuine passion for languages, but that doesn't mean I'm willing to work for free. I would love to be able to work for free, but the problem is that butchers, bakers and candlestick makers don't work for free, and from time to time I'm going to want to eat a steak sandwich by candlelight. Or preferably electric light, but that's not free either. Language teaching is my profession, and I need to be able to turn a profit from it. Moreover, I've already thrown my hat in the ring for Paul Noble's series on lesser studied languages, so releasing a free course now would jeopardise that source of income in particular. After 7 years and tens of thousands of pounds I want to start getting a few quid back, but 7 years and tens of thousands of pounds doesn't sound like a "quick buck".
As I understand it, the MT patent really revolves around the use of the pause button. I'm not a lawyer, but it reads to me as though simply adding in programmed pauses (as much as I hate them) would do the trick. On the other hand, remember that this is a US patent, and while there is some limited international protection for patents, if something's unpatentable in the UK, the US patent cannot be enforced here. It is up to the individual to decide how much of a risk they're willing to take. If it's an iffy case, the product is free and it's not interfering with the sales of MT products, would the patent holders risk a court case that might rule the patent invalid? That's the sort of question only a lawyer could answer, and I'm sure Neil_UK knows one or two of them. Edited by Cainntear on 20 September 2011 at 3:03pm 4 persons have voted this message useful | ||||||
| langguru Newbie Germany Joined 4814 days ago 1 posts - 3 votes Speaks: German | Message 38 of 97 20 September 2011 at 3:40pm | IP Logged | |||||
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@Neil,
i would like to help you ! please send us the template .i am ready to help in Tamil. Tamil is spoken in 4 countries ,mainly in India(Tamil Nadu),Sri lanka , Malaysia , Mauritius and significant minorities of Singapore. And i have couple of my friends who study linguistics , it would a very interesting project for them. i already have couple of them signed up for Hindi. i would like to try something first before i shoot it down , so give me a chance to shoot your idea down ;) regards Kumar 3 persons have voted this message useful | ||||||
| Kugel Senior Member United States Joined 6536 days ago 497 posts - 555 votes Speaks: English* | Message 39 of 97 21 September 2011 at 10:33pm | IP Logged | |||||
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Why not just get rid of the MT brand altogether if the program doesn't use the pause bottom or the extra 2 students who only periodically add some benefit to the course? Adding "MT" to a course when it's not needed is going to needlessly create all sorts of headaches down the road.
And just for a little exercise, could someone please tell me how it would be possible for programs like Assimil, Lingaphone, Pimsleur, and Living language to claim patents on their methods? The only one that comes close is Pimsleur, and yet the "Spanish Like Crazy" series is very similar, but no complaints from the owners of Pimsleur(as far as I know). Just don't copy the content or the silly mnemonics in any MT course. The possible constructions in language is infinite, so why the problem? 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| Spanky Senior Member Canada Joined 5954 days ago 1021 posts - 1714 votes Studies: French | Message 40 of 97 22 September 2011 at 12:26am | IP Logged | |||||
I can use a little exercise, but I am not aware of any of those programmes claiming a patent.
I believe the specific MT use of students is an important component of the MT patent, rather than the content (which would be copyright-protected) or the use of mnemonics. The problem, accordingly, is patent infringement regardless of whether the content is changed, if the same use of students is present. And if it is not present, then what is proposed is not a series of new MT language projects, but just new language projects. 2 persons have voted this message useful |
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