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What’s the difference between זאת and זו? | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Specific Languages |  | |
| zecchino1991 Senior Member United States facebook.com/amyybur Joined 5249 days ago 778 posts - 885 votes  Speaks: English* Studies: Italian, Modern Hebrew, Russian, Arabic (Written), Romanian, Icelandic, Georgian | Message 1 of 5 14 May 2012 at 7:24pm | IP Logged | |||||
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I have been learning Hebrew for quite a while, and I must admit I still can't figure out the difference between
these two words! When are you supposed to use זו and when are you supposed to use זאת? Also, is there a difference between the "proper" way to use these words and the way people use them in real life? 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| tiyafeh Pentaglot Newbie Israel Joined 4769 days ago 12 posts - 31 votes Speaks: English, Modern Hebrew*, Portuguese, Spanish, Latin Studies: Biblical Hebrew, Arabic (Written), German, Greek, Aramaic, Arabic (Levantine) | Message 2 of 5 14 May 2012 at 8:46pm | IP Logged | |||||
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There's no difference at all between the two, except that זאת is of biblical origin and
זו is slightly later. However, in 'proper' use, while זאת and זו (zo) are indeed synonyms, זו (zu) has the same meaning as אשר or ש-, but in practice no-one ever uses it that way. Most people aren't even aware of this distinction. In fact, I had to look it up to be sure. 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| zecchino1991 Senior Member United States facebook.com/amyybur Joined 5249 days ago 778 posts - 885 votes Speaks: English* Studies: Italian, Modern Hebrew, Russian, Arabic (Written), Romanian, Icelandic, Georgian | Message 3 of 5 15 May 2012 at 6:41am | IP Logged | |||||
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So they're completely interchangeable? No wonder I couldn't tell the difference! :)
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| Tarshish Diglot Newbie United States Joined 4686 days ago 13 posts - 34 votes Speaks: English*, Modern Hebrew | Message 4 of 5 15 May 2012 at 7:06am | IP Logged | |||||
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In usage we only use the ה''א הידיעה in front of the word זאת and not in front of the
word זו. So הדירה הזאת גדולה יותר מהדירה ההיא This apartment is bigger than that apartment. but נערה זו היא בתו של המורה (This girl is the teacher's daughter) Both are also used as feminine subject pronouns and it seems to me that you can almost always use זאת in place of זו and vice versa (the exception being certain phrases like גם זו לטובה or מה זאת אומרת). However, while זאת can be used as a direct object pronoun like זה I do not think זו is ever used this way. So אני חוזר ומדגיש זאת כדי למנוע בלבול "I am going over and emphasizing this to prevent confusion." but not אני חוזר ומדגיש זו כדי למנוע בלבול In any case זאת as an object pronoun is pretty rare and people will generally use זה in speech even if the object is technically female. זאת as an object is generally reserved for the written register. 2 persons have voted this message useful | ||||||
| tiyafeh Pentaglot Newbie Israel Joined 4769 days ago 12 posts - 31 votes Speaks: English, Modern Hebrew*, Portuguese, Spanish, Latin Studies: Biblical Hebrew, Arabic (Written), German, Greek, Aramaic, Arabic (Levantine) | Message 5 of 5 17 May 2012 at 5:10pm | IP Logged | |||||
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Since the responses you've received seem to be slightly contradictory, let me try to
clear this up again:
This is more of a stylistic suggestion than a rule which reflects common usage (this is supported by the website of the Academy of the Hebrew Language). I'd say it's comparable to the English "rule" of ending a sentence with a preposition, meaning in writing some people take it seriously (and many don't), but in speech few people do. Your last two examples are idiomatic (and I wouldn't say גם זו לטובה is particularly common), and as such don't really represent the grammar of the language. I'll add that the use of a demonstrative adjective with an indefinite noun (as in נערה זו) is also quite rare and reserved almost exclusively for writing. Edit: A Google search gives 15,800,000 results for הזאת and 13,500,000 for הזו, which confirms that this distinction has all but disappeared.
Thanks for bringing that up. This is indeed the . However, as you say, other than in some stock phrases perhaps, no native speaker, not even older people, would use זאת that way except in formal literary language. I suppose that's why it didn't occur to me. I might write: אני חוזר ומדגיש זאת כדי למנוע בלבול but I'd never say it. If I had to say it during a conversation, I'd say: אני חוזר ומדגיש את זה כדי למנוע בלבול or better yet: אני שוב מדגיש את זה בשביל למנוע בלבול since the חוזר ו- construction to mean 'again' is also rather literary. So, unless you intend to make a formal speech or write a novel or an academic paper in Hebrew, it would probably be wise to be able to recognise this usage, but I can't see any situations where you'll actually need to produce it yourself. Edit: Another Google search confirms that "עשה את זה" gets 5,230,000 results, whereas "עשה זאת" gets only 1,660,000, and this drops to just 428,000 if you show only the results without the stock phrase "עשה זאת בעצמך" (do it yourself). Edited by tiyafeh on 17 May 2012 at 5:25pm 2 persons have voted this message useful |
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