|
 |
Is this a good way to learn a language? | ||
Share with:
| ||
 Language Learning Forum : Questions About Your Target Languages |  | |
 jeff_lindqvist Diglot Moderator SwedenRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 6917 days ago 4250 posts - 5711 votes  Speaks: Swedish*, English Studies: German, Spanish, Russian, Dutch, Mandarin, Esperanto, Irish, French Personal Language Map | Message 9 of 19 20 June 2009 at 3:44pm | IP Logged | |||||
|
Antelope, it's not that the site (or method) isn't popular, but rather that everybody doesn't agree 100% with the Steve Kaufmann (the founder, and a member of this forum). There have been numerous discussions over the years.
1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| Lizzern Diglot Senior Member Norway Joined 5917 days ago 791 posts - 1053 votes Speaks: Norwegian*, English Studies: Japanese | Message 10 of 19 20 June 2009 at 7:44pm | IP Logged | |||||
I think there's a distinct difference between translating rigidly in an attempt to figure out your L2/target language based on what it translates into in your L1, vs using translations merely to aid you in grasping what the word in your L2 means without labelling it according to what you already know. I hope that made sense. That's how I see it anyway, some courses like Assimil manage to do this well by trying to teach you to 'feel' the target language as it is, and it works out in such a way that you approach L2 in a fresh way without bringing in the framework of thinking that you've already established in your native language (which usually doesn't fit anyway). If we get too caught up in translations then we'll just end up being L1'ers who manage to tweak L2 more or less to fit what we'd say in L1. I've seen some horrid results from this, because essentially it keeps you thinking in your L1 and the outcome is just not nice to look at. From what I've seen, a good course will give you a good framework to start learning things from L2. You'll be missing huge amounts of vocabulary and nuance but huge amounts of input will help you along, translations can be a guide but as soon as you have the basic grammar and vocabulary down and you can leave them behind it's actually really cool - and that's when the real fun begins, imho :-) (Oh and you sound a little apologetic about being a newbie at language learning - don't be! Maybe we've been dorky about languages longer than you or maybe we haven't, but don't be afraid to ask questions. We all love good discussions about this sort of thing.) Liz 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| la_vida_l0ca Diglot Newbie United Kingdom Joined 5808 days ago 3 posts - 3 votes Speaks: French, Spanish Studies: Esperanto | Message 11 of 19 20 June 2009 at 8:52pm | IP Logged | |||||
|
I think this is a good explanation /idea of what Lizzern means about not 'translating'
http://www.fluentin3months.com/the-best-online-dictionary-fo r-learning-any-language- google-image/ sorry if that isn't what you meant, but it is still a helpful tool :D xxx 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| Cainntear Pentaglot Senior Member Scotland linguafrankly.blogsp Joined 6019 days ago 4399 posts - 7687 votes Speaks: Lowland Scots, English*, French, Spanish, Scottish Gaelic Studies: Catalan, Italian, German, Irish, Welsh | Message 12 of 19 20 June 2009 at 9:47pm | IP Logged | |||||
I've been thinking a lot about this same thing. I had a Spanish tutorial today and we had to do an exercise translating conditionals from English to Spanish. It really wasn't that far removed from what Michel Thomas does, but while I like Michel Thomas, this exercise wasn't much fun for anyone in the class. So what is it that makes the difference between a good translation exercise and a bad one? As far as I can see, it's how much you have to think about it. Too much thinking and too little thinking are both a problem. In today's lesson, our tutor introduced three different types of conditional sentence in one go, we had to chose which conditional we were to use, we had to conjugate verbs and we had to recall all sorts of vocabulary (and the vocabulary fairly random -- we had to use "to get wet" at one point). In every case we had to think too much -- there was no opportunity to let the language settle in and become automatic. On the opposite extreme, if you do so-called "substitution drills" (taking a sentence and changing it for I, you, he, she, etc.) you don't have to really think -- you just parrot most of the sentence from memory and change the bit that the teacher wants you to change. In both cases, the mistake made by teachers is to assume that completing the task indicates having learnt the rules -- in both cases the rule remains superficial. So the middle point is something where prompts are varied enough that you have to think, but similar enough that you're not switching to a completely different rule every time. 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| TheBiscuit Tetraglot Senior Member Mexico Joined 5931 days ago 532 posts - 619 votes Speaks: English*, French, Spanish, Italian Studies: German, Croatian | Message 13 of 19 22 June 2009 at 12:38am | IP Logged | |||||
|
I think understanding the gist of what something means in your TL is infinitely more productive that working out some kind of rigid translation (unless you happen to be doing one), especially if you're just starting out. Getting the gist is enough. The same goes for listening. The instinctive process (getting the gist) is the one you'll have to rely on should you need to function in your TL.
1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| pgadey Diglot Newbie Canada Joined 5643 days ago 10 posts - 10 votes Speaks: English*, Esperanto | Message 14 of 19 24 June 2009 at 4:19pm | IP Logged | |||||
|
My only comment on the original post is that in some (rare) cases the grammar used on Wikipedia is far from perfect, and the vocabulary used is quite unidiomatic. If you're not able to detect these things, I don't think it would be good to read WP just yet. My recommendation would be: if you're going to use with "reading texts with a dictionary" approach, make sure you're reading stuff by native speakers for native speakers, that is contemporary, and professional. For example, I think news paper articles would be good, or school textbooks. Perhaps this is an overly cautious approach, but it's just my two cents.
1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| William Camden Hexaglot Senior Member United Kingdom Joined 6280 days ago 1936 posts - 2333 votes Speaks: English*, German, Spanish, Russian, Turkish, French | Message 15 of 19 01 July 2009 at 1:29pm | IP Logged | |||||
|
I use Wikipedia quite a lot, in several languages.
You can't be 100% sure about grammatical accuracy in any of the languages, but it is pretty good and has broadened my mind considerably. 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| slucido Bilingual Diglot Senior Member Spain https://goo.gl/126Yv Joined 6683 days ago 1296 posts - 1781 votes 4 sounds Speaks: Spanish*, Catalan* Studies: English | Message 16 of 19 02 July 2009 at 7:36pm | IP Logged | |||||
I don't know if this is a good way of learning, but this is my first approach. I began learning English by reading websites and using online dictionaries. My goal was to read interesting content and not to learn English, but that was the side effect. After that I began listening to audio books, TV series and studying more actively. "Interesting content" are the key words. If this method keep you interacting with your L2 without been aware, it's the best method for you. Sure. 1 person has voted this message useful |
|  | 
Printable version
|
| Copyright 2024 FX Micheloud - All rights reserved No part of this website may be copied by any means without my written authorization. |
