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Languages Without Rolling ’R’s?? | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Specific Languages |  | |
| WentworthsGal Senior Member United KingdomRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 4888 days ago 191 posts - 246 votes  Speaks: English* Studies: Swedish, Spanish | Message 33 of 41 24 November 2011 at 3:35pm | IP Logged | ||
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Thanks Arekkusu. The thing is I've been trying for many years to roll my Rs - I'm now 30. I did read on Ellen Jovin's Blog that she suddenly managed to roll them when she was in her 40s - so I do have hope now that it might come to me one day :o) I don't have the money to seek professional linguistic help, and to be honest, I'd rather spend that money on general language learning materials and accept that it may or may not happen one day. If it doesn't happen, I'm fine with that as long as people can still understand me :o)
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| floydak Tetraglot Groupie Slovakia Joined 4854 days ago 60 posts - 85 votes Speaks: Slovak*, English, German, Spanish Studies: French | Message 34 of 41 01 December 2011 at 8:11pm | IP Logged | ||
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Me neither can roll correct the "R" as I should in my language. I never could and I
probably never will :).. However I never really tried to fix it, when I was young I went couple of times (2-3) to specialized person who should teach it, but I was young and lazy and I gave up. ("Logoped" is called the profession in slovak, no idea if this word exists in English) . It's not that really uncommon, I would estimate that 5% of slovak population can't say it properly. My r sound sounds much more french alike, I cant make the sound with my tongue like I should but I make that sound more in throat. At least I have much less problems with speaking french r:) . I was surprised listen http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_pxeRT8pcTo at 0:09 when Sir Humphrey say word "series" how rolled is that, I would never expect that in English language, this is probably due to his old heavy british accent. Edited by floydak on 01 December 2011 at 8:15pm 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| vonPeterhof Tetraglot Senior Member Russian FederationRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 4772 days ago 715 posts - 1527 votes Speaks: Russian*, EnglishC2, Japanese, German Studies: Kazakh, Korean, Norwegian, Turkish | Message 35 of 41 01 December 2011 at 11:59pm | IP Logged | ||
And yes, Sir Humphrey speaks with an old-fashioned RP ("Received Pronunciation") accent, which has a rolled R between vowels. There are other British accents where the R is rolled or flapped, like Welsh, Scottish and some northern English accents. 2 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| Lianne Senior Member Canada thetoweringpile.blog Joined 5115 days ago 284 posts - 410 votes Speaks: English* Studies: Esperanto, Toki Pona, German, French | Message 36 of 41 04 December 2011 at 7:35pm | IP Logged | ||
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I find it interesting that people suggest French as a language without rolled 'r's. It's obviously a very regional thing. I'm learning French, and I'm going to keep rolling my 'r's, even if that's gone out of style in some places, because that's how I was taught growing up. In St. Boniface people still roll their 'r's. My dad (a native French speaker) was surprised when I told him that there were places where the 'r's weren't rolled anymore. So I'm choosing to speak as people here do, and accept having a slight accent in France. (Also, I have no idea how to pronounce an 'r' in my throat, so I'm taking the path of least resistance. :) )
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| flydream777 Triglot Senior Member United States Joined 6491 days ago 77 posts - 102 votes Speaks: English*, Spanish, French Studies: German, Russian, Portuguese, Mandarin, Greek, Hungarian, Armenian, Irish, Italian | Message 37 of 41 08 December 2011 at 10:29pm | IP Logged | ||
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There's a difference between "rolling" your Rs and "tapping" your Rs...
Spanish does both. I think southern French and southern German tap them, right? 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Марк Senior Member Russian Federation Joined 5056 days ago 2096 posts - 2972 votes Speaks: Russian* | Message 38 of 41 09 December 2011 at 2:59pm | IP Logged | ||
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I think southern French and southern German tap them, right?
They roll. Alveolar trill becomes uvular trill, tap doesn't. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| WentworthsGal Senior Member United KingdomRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 4888 days ago 191 posts - 246 votes Speaks: English* Studies: Swedish, Spanish | Message 39 of 41 09 December 2011 at 4:09pm | IP Logged | ||
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Well, when I initially posted this question, I had no idea how many different Rs there were..! I was thinking just 2 existed - rolling R and English R. How wrong I was lol!!I think R is officially now my least favourite letter, I seem to have trouble with any variation. My mission: to keep practicing the sounds by copying how natives pronounce them :o)
Thanks everyone for replying :o) 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Arekkusu Hexaglot Senior Member Canada bit.ly/qc_10_lec Joined 5381 days ago 3971 posts - 7747 votes Speaks: English, French*, GermanC1, Spanish, Japanese, Esperanto Studies: Italian, Norwegian, Mandarin, Romanian, Estonian | Message 40 of 41 09 December 2011 at 4:16pm | IP Logged | ||
In Québec, people who roll their R's are either old enough to be retired or have spent a significant portion of their lives in a fairly rural area. It's actually a slightly stigmatized pronunciation as it tends to signify rurality, or lack of education. It's fairly rare to hear it in the media, for instance. I have a really large family scattered around Montreal and North of Montreal. Most of my aunts and uncles are in their 60's and roll their r's, except those who spent more time around Montréal. The vast majority of my cousins (40's and under) do NOT roll their R's, except for a few people and I'd say they all grew up on farms. One cousin in particular has a strong rolled R, yet has post-doctorate degrees... it's quite disconcerting to hear, actually, as it runs against the assumption that a rolled r would mean less education. However, as you suggest, this change happened earlier in Québec than in most other places in Canada. In St. Boniface, as you mention, most people do roll their R's, but certainly not everyone. A lot of French speakers in Winnipeg come from various French-speaking villages and in some villages, people do NOT typically roll their R's. I'm guessing it has to do with when and where immigrants settled there. In some places, for instance, there was a significant Belgian immigration. Most French speakers in Europe use the (usually approximant) uvular r -- not rolled or trilled. This feature spread across languages to most neighbouring countries, such as Dutch, German, Danish and Southern Norwegian, around the second half of the 19th century. Some data suggests that this form was seen as the prestigious form quite early on, as some words like "chaise" are derived from "chair" (both coexist today with different meanings), presumably because people had a hard time pronouncing the r accurately. Edited by Arekkusu on 09 December 2011 at 4:21pm 3 persons have voted this message useful |
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