FSI French Drills: What Am I Missing? (Language Programs, Books & Tapes) Language Learning Forum

FSI French Drills: What Am I Missing?
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Language Learning Forum : Language Programs, Books & Tapes

24 messages over 3 pages: 1 2 3

Jeffers
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Message 17 of 24

02 September 2011 at 7:30pm | IP Logged

liddytime wrote:

Cainntear wrote:

The philosophy behind FSI stems from the "Army Method" and doesn't appeal to me.
Basically, they believed that enough parroting will teach you anything. The problem is, you can say whatever they
want you to say, but they rarely give you any reason to say it.

This method works for some folks (like me) and is useless for others. It depends on your learning style. I tend to
be a much better aural learner than a visual one so FSI ( usually) works well for me; probably not so well for folks
like Cainntear.

The trick is NOT to simply be a parrot. Anticipate what the drills are going to ask and answer them BEFORE they
give the answer back to you; then repeat using the best pronunciation you can muster. This gets you thinking in
the language and not just parroting. When I think of true "parroting" Assimil comes to mind. People on this
forum love Assimil, but for me it just feels like mindless "parroting". At least FSI drills the learner on the
language structure. I had great success using the FSI Turkish and Greek courses.

Some FSI courses are much better at arranging their courses for interaction than others. French is actually pretty
good. The key is to get through Unit 6 or so. Up to this point the material is so basic and mindless, you may feel
like a parrot. Go through it quickly, you'll get the gist of it. It gets more challenging afterwards.

I'm surprised you thought of Assimil before Pimsleur when you thought of parroting.

Anyway, I'm sure there is some truth to Cainntear's criticism, but that is why it is useful to combine methods. I've noticed very few people on these forums learn using one textbook, course or method. It takes longer to use several, but each makes up for the weaknesses of others.

Concerning learning styles, not being a type of learner doesn't mean you shouldn't use that learning style. A learning style preference means you enjoy a particular style. It is true that if you enjoy learning in a style, you will work harder and retain more. But also using other styles as much as you can stand will improve your learning.
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dbag
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Studies: Spanish

Message 18 of 24

02 September 2011 at 11:59pm | IP Logged

liddytime wrote:

When I think of true "parroting" Assimil comes to mind.

An excellent point, and one Im surprised Ive not seen raised before. I dont think FSI is JUST minindless parroting, although it cant be denied that there is a lot of it involved.

Usually, if you havent understood a lesson properly, you wont be able to do the drills.I find they really require you to think, and quickly. I am not sure how far the French version differs from that of the Spanish, but maybe you are finding the initial drills easy because your comfortable with that level of French? This was the case for me with Spanish, but I quickly found that the drills became difficult.
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Random review
Diglot
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Message 19 of 24

03 September 2011 at 3:19am | IP Logged

Cainntear, that's just my main point about FSI, it is based on flawed psychology
and is supposed to work by repetition...but that's not how the courses actually
pan out (at least not the ones I am familiar with). It is a mystery to me that they are
as good as they are given the above, one I can only explain by assuming that in
actually designing individual courses they got a lot of input from good teachers. They
are chock full of devices to warn you when your attention wanders and you start
parroting mindlessly (for instances most of the drills are so designed that you will
start getting them wrong as soon as you drift off), and there are bridges between
structures and the context you will use them in (e.g. the conversation stimulus
section, or the fact that most of the transformation drills start with a sentence from
one of the dialogues).

The one exception that I know of is the Spanish Programatic Course, which is exactly
what Cainntear describes, though still worth a quick look because of the clear way it
explains some grammar points.
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kanewai
Triglot
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justpaste.it/kanewai
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Speaks: English*, French, Marshallese
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Message 20 of 24

03 September 2011 at 6:11pm | IP Logged

I have a couple friends in Foreign Service training right now, and the courses (used full time) will bring them to
proficiency in three months in the target language. They won't get posted otherwise. So ... I don't know that we
can say that the FSI courses are based on "flawed psychology" when they are demonstrably effective.

That doesn't mean that they are the best for home study, or that everyone will enjoy them. My friends in training are
suffering, actually. But FSI most definitely does work
1 person has voted this message useful

Random review
Diglot
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Message 21 of 24

03 September 2011 at 6:19pm | IP Logged

kanewai wrote:

1) They use a completely different model now.

2) My whole post was about how the old method could be very effective (which they are)
even though they were explicitly based on behaviourist psychology, which I
personally think is flawed for language learning.

Edited by Random review on 03 September 2011 at 6:20pm
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JasonUK
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learnalanguagein1yea
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Speaks: English*, Mandarin, French
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Message 22 of 24

04 September 2011 at 12:42pm | IP Logged

I've tried FSI in 4 different languages so far and I have to say the French FSI is the worst (or the least best). It
doesn't seem to be as good as the others. I listened to almost all the recordings and I didn't feel my french
improved that much. It has gotten a lot better since then through other means.

This french course is about 80 hours long. So will take a lot of your time.

Another problem is the sound quality. it's not great and I feel that is so important.

1 person has voted this message useful

pigsonfire
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Message 23 of 24

05 September 2011 at 4:36am | IP Logged

JasonUK wrote:

I've tried FSI in 4 different languages so far and I have to say the French FSI is the worst (or the least best). It
doesn't seem to be as good as the others.

I actually thought French was one of the better FSI courses. You hear it in your sleep at night... if that is a good thing ...
1 person has voted this message useful

HenryMW
Tetraglot
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Speaks: English*, German, Spanish, French
Studies: Modern Hebrew

Message 24 of 24

05 September 2011 at 6:46am | IP Logged

I love FSI. It's the first thing I go to for a language. The French course is certainly daunting in size, but that isn't necessarily a bad thing. Out of French, German, and Spanish, I would say Spanish was their best, though.

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