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Unusual Pimsleur claim | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Language Programs, Books & Tapes |  | |
| leosmith Senior Member United States Joined 6549 days ago 2365 posts - 3804 votes  Speaks: English* Studies: Tagalog | Message 1 of 14 22 February 2008 at 9:40am | IP Logged | ||
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In a previous thread, a member quoted a vender selling Pimsleur products. The quote essentially stated that Pimsleur teaches 2500 words in its 90 lesson programs. I know this to be false, so I assumed the vender had been taken in by Pimsleur's misleading advertising.
In the past, Pimsleur has stated that 2500 words are needed to reach everyday proficiency in a language. They never called it fluency, or even the 95% vocab mark. They went on to talk more about their product, but never made the specific claim that they teach 2500 words. In reality, the 90 programs teach 500 words. This new vender claim annoyed me, because I felt they had crossed the line from misleading to lying. So I wrote to the vender stating that I thought they had been misled. They were actually very polite and cooperative. They ended up emailing Pimsleur support about it, and forwarded this reply to me: __________________________ Dear Cristian, Thank you very much for your e-mail. If you were to say complete all three levels of Spanish (I, II, and III) you will then have the knowledge of over 2500 words. This is basically the amount of words you currently use in your everyday life. Also, upon completion of each level, you will gain about 33% fluency in Spanish (or the language of your choice). So after all three levels have been completed, you will be at about 99% fluency! __________________________ In my opinion, this is a blatant lie. I'd like to convince Pimsleur to stop making these claims. Any suggestions? 4 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| rob Diglot Senior Member Japan Joined 6164 days ago 287 posts - 288 votes 2 sounds Speaks: English*, Japanese Studies: French, Spanish, Dutch, Portuguese, Norwegian, Mandarin | Message 2 of 14 22 February 2008 at 10:26am | IP Logged | ||
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I believe Pimsleur is a US company, right? If so, you have the Federal Trade Commission as the main authority on consumer protection and false advertising. You can file a complaint here (hopefully that will work, if not, just look up the FTC website, under Consumer Protection -- File a complaint).
I've got no idea about how it works in the US, but I know the UK regulation authority is very powerful, and have removed false advertisements from such large companies as Mac. I assume the US authority is similarly powerful. Similarly, I believe you have a good claim, some of the statements in the email are just ludicrous (99% fluency), and complaining to the FTC is much more likely to achieve results than trying to do anything directly. It might be helpful, though not essential, if you could provide concrete evidence on the vocabulary taught in the average course. Edited by rob on 22 February 2008 at 10:28am 3 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| Svengali Diglot Newbie United States Joined 6145 days ago 14 posts - 14 votes Speaks: English*, Spanish | Message 3 of 14 22 February 2008 at 1:48pm | IP Logged | ||
Where does the 500 words claim come from? 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Seth Diglot Changed to RedKing’sDream Senior Member United States Joined 7223 days ago 240 posts - 252 votes Speaks: English*, Russian Studies: Persian | Message 4 of 14 22 February 2008 at 2:39pm | IP Logged | ||
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That 2500 words is basically all one uses "in everyday life" is also ridiculously false. It's a shame that such a quality product has sellers that will absolutely distort the truth.
Also, where in the world did they figure that knowledge of a language could be quantified in the way they responded to you? Edited by Seth on 22 February 2008 at 2:41pm 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| leosmith Senior Member United States Joined 6549 days ago 2365 posts - 3804 votes Speaks: English* Studies: Tagalog | Message 5 of 14 22 February 2008 at 3:03pm | IP Logged | ||
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rob, you're probably right on. It might just call for a complaint to the better business bureau.
Svengali, many on this forum, including myself, have actually made word lists for Pimsleur. It's an established fact that they teach about 500 words for 90 lessons. Seth, it sure is a shame. I would think a good marketing department would be able to sell such an excellent product without lying about it. Incidently, that letter was not to me. It was to Cristian, a vender, who forwarded the message to me. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| zorglub Pentaglot Senior Member France Joined 6999 days ago 441 posts - 504 votes 1 sounds Speaks: French*, English, Italian, Spanish, Portuguese Studies: German, Arabic (Written), Turkish, Mandarin | Message 6 of 14 22 February 2008 at 5:44pm | IP Logged | ||
As excellent as Pimsleur can be I exactly know where 3 levels of Spanish/poriuguese and Italian lead you. Very good for survival and impressing natives,very far from fluency. An excellent start for any language. Although I may have foiund even better at least for difficult laguages, with Michel Thomas. Only Assimil brought me some fluency with a rich vocabulary. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| mcjon77 Senior Member United States Joined 6610 days ago 193 posts - 248 votes Speaks: English* Studies: Spanish, Arabic (Egyptian), French | Message 7 of 14 28 February 2008 at 4:26am | IP Logged | ||
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About 10 years ago, Pimsleur made a much more substanative, and testable claim. They claimed that using there course would put you at a specific level of the ACTFL oral proficency scale. Level 1 would take you to "Intermediate Low", level 2 would take you to "Intermediate Mid", and Level 3 would take you to "intermediate high". They even offered a money back garuantee if you could not test at that level with ACTFL.
I don't know how valid it was, or if such claims still hold true, but at least it was more concrete than claiming "33% fluency" or "99% fluency". What in the world does that mean? 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| reineke Senior Member United States https://learnalangua Joined 6446 days ago 851 posts - 1008 votes Studies: German | Message 8 of 14 01 March 2008 at 7:58pm | IP Logged | ||
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This is apparently an old claim.
http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/lofiversion/index.php/t13410.h tml Vocabulearn seems to count words both ways - English AND target language. 1 person has voted this message useful |
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