|
 |
Fluent in Mandarin in 3 months? | ||
Share with:
| ||
 Language Learning Forum : Polyglots | ( Topic Closed) |  |
| irishpolyglot Nonaglot Senior Member Ireland fluentin3months Joined 5632 days ago 285 posts - 892 votes  Speaks: Irish, English*, French, Esperanto, Italian, Spanish, Portuguese, German, Sign Language Studies: Mandarin | Message 25 of 69 06 January 2012 at 11:13pm | IP Logged | ||||||||
|
Thanks for the interesting discussion everyone! Apart from jetlag issues (it's bloody 5:30 AM and I still haven't gotten to sleep :-S ) everything is going swimmingly so far! Those of you in my email list will have received a blow-by-blow description of my first day and I'll adapt a blog post to describe my first days or my first week, to be posted next week, so you can see the (quick) baby steps I'm taking.
To reply to a few points some of you have made here: * After reading the intro to Heisig's book and studying 20 or so characters briefly, I am more than ever confident in reaching my reading goals. He says: "If you were to study them full time, there is no reason why all 1,500 characters in Book 1 could not be learned successfully in four to five weeks". I won't be studying them full time, but am putting lots of work into them, and people tell me that even 500 characters may be sufficient for what I described in the video (as someone suggested here, perhaps B1/B2 level of reading). We'll see, since I'd like more for the long term investment, but thanks to mnemonic techniques described in the book, which are very similar to those I've used myself, I am not in the least bit intimidated by the writing system. Yes there are challenges I haven't foreseen, but I'll deal with them and conquer them. A bit of confidence really wouldn't go astray in some of you, you know ;) * Yes, I am absolutely sick of Steve Kaufmann. About once a year I give in to his cage rattles and answer him back, and regret it every time. His convenient swiss cheese memory means we go back to the same tired points and I have to repeat myself ad nauseum. I find him terribly annoying, and it's a pity he wasn't in Vancouver when I passed through. If we just met up for a tea or something he'd see that I'm a real person and he'd cut back on all this trolling. This is the ugly side of the Internet I quite dislike, and it's another major reason I am all for in-person exchanges, both for language learning and for life. I've met some of my biggest Internet skeptics in person and everything changes dramatically when they see me beyond a blog title they've misinterpreted. * Come on Splog, I won't be performing miracles if I reach C1. Have none of you met people who have been pressured to learn in immersion environments quickly?? Honestly, I'm not the first and I won't be the last to learn a language quickly. I'm only the first one to blog about it with this size audience. I have to be frank: despite the fact that many of you here know a million times more than I do about linguists and such, I have to wonder if you live in the real world or met any amount of social-focussed language learners. I HAVE. Erasmus students alone, who do not socialise with their mother tongue, improve their local language abilities dramatically - at least the ones I met who were out with the rest of us. Those staying at home all the time of course improved little. My objectives are based on what I KNOW is possible, because I've seen others achieve it. It's nothing to do with me having some miracle gene. Anyone reading the blog knows I despise such thoughts and am trying to encourage everyone to try, and to ditch silly excuses. I don't see what the problem is. All this "it takes years" stuff is pure hogwash unless you're talking about actual perfectionism and emulating natives right down to perfectly copying their accents, or being a professional writer in the language - snail-paced learning is presuming you are going through an academic or similar inefficient learning approach, and that not a single mistake can ever be uttered, which leaves a LOT to be desired, when looking at the social context of languages. Vocabulary can be learned quickly with good memory techniques, and truckloads of practice can force you to improve your level beyond the comfort zone of language learners sitting in armchairs. There's a lot of Pirato's principle in what I propose, which you can't imagine if you have your head in a text book. I will be book studying a decent amount over the next 3 months, but that's only to amplify the speed my spoken abilities can improve at for the priority time where I put the book down and hang out with the Taiwanese. A pure study approach would indeed take years to reach fluency due to lack of practice and human feedback. By the way, I'm interested in friendly questions - not confrontations. I'm coming in here from a break from studying a language that I'm struggling with since I just started it, don't have any friends in the entire country yet and am very jetlagged. Please be nice to a fellow language learner. ;) Edited by irishpolyglot on 06 January 2012 at 11:21pm 11 persons have voted this message useful | |||||||||
| Ellsworth Senior Member United States Joined 4956 days ago 345 posts - 528 votes Speaks: English* Studies: German, Swedish, Finnish, Icelandic, Irish | Message 26 of 69 06 January 2012 at 11:41pm | IP Logged | ||||||||
|
You seem like a very nice person and very dedicated. After reading that post I am really
going to be rooting for your Mandarin! I think you can do it :) I like your website too. Ádh mór ort! EDIT: Also, I just don't understand these critics... I love his approach to language learning and I can only see him as positive to the language learning world. His endeavors are exciting to follow and provide motivation and practical advice for other language learners. Edited by Ellsworth on 06 January 2012 at 11:51pm 4 persons have voted this message useful | |||||||||
| tmp011007 Diglot Senior Member Congo Joined 6068 days ago 199 posts - 346 votes Speaks: Spanish*, English Studies: French, Portuguese | Message 27 of 69 07 January 2012 at 12:43am | IP Logged | ||||||||
well, let's see why
and/or
I guess (in this case at least) it's all about that conversational C1 statement... for me a C1 (even just conversational) isn't really likeable in so short period of time just for one simple -there are a few more, but..- reason: listening skills .. I know I don't really need a wide active vocabulary (speaking) but listening definitely takes time -and some other things but let's stay just with this point using "The Quick and Dirty Guide to Learnin Languages Fast" strategy (or the FLR method -or something like that) I reckon he could gain a lot in just three months but still that conversational C1 statement... a conversational C1 for me would be something a little bit different I guess Edited by tmp011007 on 07 January 2012 at 12:53am 2 persons have voted this message useful | |||||||||
| iguanamon Pentaglot Senior Member Virgin Islands Speaks: Ladino Joined 5261 days ago 2241 posts - 6731 votes Speaks: English*, Spanish, Portuguese, Haitian Creole, Creole (French) | Message 28 of 69 07 January 2012 at 1:07am | IP Logged | ||||||||
|
Remember @sarahgirl23's My crazy 30 day challenge to learn Greek log here on the forum recently? I love how she describes the challenge's beginning:
"Earlier this evening, I was chatting with my boyfriend, when we got onto the topic of languages. He is Greek, you see, and, although his English is very good, he sometimes fails to understand everything that I am saying. I, jokingly, said that I would have to learn Greek to be able to explain everything to him. He laughed at the idea, saying it would take years before I would even be able to hold a basic conversation. Now, I have always been a rather headstrong girl, and immediately jumped to the challenge." This was a woman who set herself a challenge as a bet with her Greek boyfriend to go from zero to being able to discuss- "1)What I did the previous weekend, 2)My likes and dislikes, and 3)What my future plans are"- with his mother over the phone as her test. His mother speaks no English or French or any other language that she would understand." @sarahgirl23 won her challenge. She showed those of us who followed her log what can be done if we dedicate ourselves. There's just something about a deadline that does tend to concentrate the mind wonderfully. More examples are the "Total Annihilation Challenges" that fill up the language log section periodically, and especially at the beginning of the year. The people who take part often describe it as quite valuable in their language learning and often make huge leaps forward in that short amount of time. If the TAC's were called "Maybe I'll learn some French today and maybe I won't if I don't get around to it", somehow I don't think they would have quite the same effect. My deadline comes in 30 days time when I will visit Brazil for a few weeks. I'd better be ready! I would venture to say that more than a few of us do not set a specific goal in our language learning endeavors. Perhaps goal-setting should be just as important a decision as "whether I should choose Assimil or Colloquial". What most of us on the forum do in our language learning endeavors differs from Benny's endeavors primarily in not being in-country for large chunks of time. So, for that reason, I'm also quite inspired by @tanya b's and @liddytime's recent language stories as they are more relevant to my own experience. Still I do take inspiration and glean useful tips and insights from Benny's challenges. Regardless of whether Benny succeeds or not, he is showing what can be accomplished by setting a goal and striving with hard work, dedication and determination to reach it. If Benny manages to succeed in his goal, it will in no way take way from anyone else's achievements who took a lot more linear time to reach their goal. Success is not a finite resource. It is there for all of us to grab if we will only try. That's what I like about stories like this. I want everyone to succeed! Best of luck, Benny! Edited by iguanamon on 07 January 2012 at 1:15am 8 persons have voted this message useful | |||||||||
| hrhenry Octoglot Senior Member United States languagehopper.blogs Joined 5129 days ago 1871 posts - 3642 votes Speaks: English*, SpanishC2, ItalianC2, Norwegian, Catalan, Galician, Turkish, Portuguese Studies: Polish, Indonesian, Ojibwe | Message 29 of 69 07 January 2012 at 1:14am | IP Logged | ||||||||
That would be a B1 level as defined by the CEFR. I honestly think Benny wouldn't have received any criticism at all had he not used "C1" as his goal for three months. But claiming a C1 in three months, well... it sort of mocks everyone that strives to reach such a high level in earnest. R. == 4 persons have voted this message useful | |||||||||
| iguanamon Pentaglot Senior Member Virgin Islands Speaks: Ladino Joined 5261 days ago 2241 posts - 6731 votes Speaks: English*, Spanish, Portuguese, Haitian Creole, Creole (French) | Message 30 of 69 07 January 2012 at 1:23am | IP Logged | ||||||||
He does like to be controversial. Remember his "America" post? If he hadn't set his goal as "C1", you're right, there wouldn't be much criticism. Then again, there wouldn't be near as much interest either with a more modest goal and we should expect more from a professional. Still, if he had said "B2" I would have been suitably impressed. The proof will be in the pudding. Edited by iguanamon on 07 January 2012 at 1:24am 1 person has voted this message useful | |||||||||
| hrhenry Octoglot Senior Member United States languagehopper.blogs Joined 5129 days ago 1871 posts - 3642 votes Speaks: English*, SpanishC2, ItalianC2, Norwegian, Catalan, Galician, Turkish, Portuguese Studies: Polish, Indonesian, Ojibwe | Message 31 of 69 07 January 2012 at 1:26am | IP Logged | ||||||||
Would that be you? Me? Or him? What defines a "professional"? And a professional what, exactly? R. == 3 persons have voted this message useful | |||||||||
| tmp011007 Diglot Senior Member Congo Joined 6068 days ago 199 posts - 346 votes Speaks: Spanish*, English Studies: French, Portuguese | Message 32 of 69 07 January 2012 at 1:45am | IP Logged | ||||||||
a calculated risk? ("Speak from Day 1"..)
not only you.. in fact for me a real B1 would be enough
the thing is, language skills are way too difficult to test unless you use a face-to-face method and a good amount of scenarios (plus he seems to have his own definition, so..) Edited by tmp011007 on 07 January 2012 at 1:46am 2 persons have voted this message useful |
|  | 
Printable version
|
| Copyright 2024 FX Micheloud - All rights reserved No part of this website may be copied by any means without my written authorization. |
