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 Language Learning Forum : Language Learning Log |  | |
| Cavesa Triglot Senior Member Czech Republic Joined 5007 days ago 3277 posts - 6779 votes  Speaks: Czech*, FrenchC2, EnglishC1 Studies: Spanish, German, Italian | Message 73 of 129 12 May 2015 at 10:24pm | IP Logged |
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Well, while it is hard sometimes to find an hour of time for a whole episode of
something, I found it extremely useful to get a few afternoons (like 4 or 5) and do a several hours long immersion with a tv series. That got me to really fast progress and easier continuation at a reasonable pace. Believe it or not, you can get burnt out of watching tv series as well. :-) I think you could enjoy it more if you would work your way up. Just an idea of a possible learning curve, based on things I have watched: 1.an easier dubbed series or two, such as Grimm (or EMK's favourite: Buffy the vampire slayer) or Eureka, 2.something dubbed and more difficult such as the Game of Thrones (of course, what is more and less difficult can be subject of discussion sometimes) or Caprica (a spin off of Battlestar Galactica, I suppose the dubbing of that should be of equal quality and difficulty to Caprica) 3.an easier original show, such as Profilage 4.a hard original show, such as Engrenages 5.a hell of a challenge, such as Héro Corp I wonder what does a "commentaire exam" look like. You make a gramatical analysis or what could I imagine? I am curious. Edited by Cavesa on 12 May 2015 at 10:26pm 1 person has voted this message useful | |
| Expugnator Hexaglot Senior Member Brazil Joined 5164 days ago 3335 posts - 4349 votes Speaks: Portuguese*, Norwegian, French, English, Italian, Papiamento Studies: Mandarin, Georgian, Russian | Message 74 of 129 12 May 2015 at 11:08pm | IP Logged |
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No matter how 'hell of a challenge' it sounds, it does get better with time because you get used to that person's voice and even way of mumbling. Context always helps get what the mumbling is about. Much of our daily conversation in our native languages consist of the same mumbling you hear at Hero Corp, incomplete sentences and such. I find series always easier than individual films because you get repetition.
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| Cavesa Triglot Senior Member Czech Republic Joined 5007 days ago 3277 posts - 6779 votes Speaks: Czech*, FrenchC2, EnglishC1 Studies: Spanish, German, Italian | Message 75 of 129 13 May 2015 at 12:07am | IP Logged |
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Yes, that is my favourite reason to watch series instead of movies as well.
Sure you get better but I still thing the "getting better" period gets easier with the accumulated previous experience. 1 person has voted this message useful | |
| garyb Triglot Senior Member ScotlandRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 5205 days ago 1468 posts - 2413 votes Speaks: English*, Italian, French Studies: Spanish | Message 76 of 129 13 May 2015 at 11:29am | IP Logged |
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I hadn't realised that Héro Corp changed format, I just assumed it was all 25-minute episodes. I enjoy short-form comedy stuff like the Youtube comedians or aforementioned Bref and Caméra Café, and things like that are great when I have a few spare minutes to fill, but for a series with an ongoing plot it seems a strange choice.
On the other extreme you have Commissario Montalbano, where each episode is longer than a typical film! Only really suitable for a quiet Sunday afternoon. I'm also not a fan of watching a single episode in parts. Some software like Netflix and the latest version of VLC has a feature to resume from where you last stopped, which makes the technical aspect less annoying, but for learning and enjoyment I'm sure you gain more from watching it all at once. I've found it easier to watch two 25-minute episodes in one sitting than one 50-minute episode. I suppose it's because I feel more in control like you say :). It can also depend on how engaging the show is: I had no problem "finding" 50 minutes for Engrenages episodes, sometimes even two in a row, because it's so gripping. Cheap suspense/cliffhanger plot devices it may be, but it works. With comedy and drama it's easier to get distracted and feel like doing something else. 1 person has voted this message useful | |
| Cavesa Triglot Senior Member Czech Republic Joined 5007 days ago 3277 posts - 6779 votes Speaks: Czech*, FrenchC2, EnglishC1 Studies: Spanish, German, Italian | Message 77 of 129 13 May 2015 at 8:15pm | IP Logged |
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Héro Corp starts with normal, 25 minutes long episodes, that's season 1. Than there is
"bonus season", which is basically one episode chopped into one 10 minutes long and several 2,5 minutes long pieces. Than there are two seasons with episodes that take anything between 4 and 8 minutes. The last season is getting more normal again but I think it is still not 20 minutes. Well, I totally agree the long episodes are digestable or tiring, based on the content. That's why I dislike that every Spanish series I've checked out is of the 70-80 minute format. Sometimes it's great (majority of the Isabel series was just awesome this way but the end was quite tiring), sometimes not. And it is hard to find time for that either way. Edited by Cavesa on 13 May 2015 at 8:16pm 1 person has voted this message useful | |
| Elenia Diglot Senior Member United Kingdom lilyonlife.blog Joined 3854 days ago 239 posts - 327 votes Speaks: English*, French Studies: German, Swedish, Esperanto | Message 78 of 129 16 May 2015 at 2:22pm | IP Logged |
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So, the past few days have felt quite full on. I cancelled all of my plans on Wednesday as I felt poorly when I woke up. I spent the entire morning sleeping, and I think I did a little bit of study in the evening, but not much as my dad decided to celebrate the sun with a miniature barbecue.
I had my exam on Thursday morning. To answer you question, Cavesa, for our commentaire exam we are given a choice of two texts, one literary, one journalistic. We have fifteen minutes to read through the texts and decide which one we want to do, making notes on anything that might be of interest (lexical fields, verbs forms, tone, register, address, tenses and so on). If we choose the journalistic text, we have to identify the theme, thesis and standpoint of the author. For both texts, the structure needs to be identified. The next step is to gather as many of these interesting elements into two or three parties thématiques. As an example, my two sections in the exam I sat were: 1) the author criticises the government and 2) the author examines the reaction of the company bosses (in an article about the protest of company bosses in France late last year). Every commentaire relies only on the text given, so there needs to be a lot of citations from the text. I feel as though I have explained this badly. One day (maybe even today) I will post an example of a commentaire I wrote while in France that received a good grade. After the exam, I had lunch with a few girls from my course, before running home to get ready for work. I spent all of yesterday at my uncle's funeral, and was exhausted when I came home. As a result of all this, I have only just about managed to keep a duolingo streak going, and to do anki almost everyday. I brought Låt den rätta komma in wuth me on the journey to work, but I was too tired to make much progress. As it stands, I have listened to 54 minutes of Alles Sense!, which is more than I had thought. I also listened to a tiny bit of Tintenherz while reading along in German. Starting again from the start, I could remember and understand more than I had expected, which was nice. The total listening was only six minutes, but that does mean that I have done an hour of German listening. Yay! As I couldn't find the German copy of Alles Sense I had to read along in French (where it is translated as Le Faucheur. It also struck me that Pratchett's death loses something in French, as the French anthropomorphic representation of death is traditionally female...). This means I have, completely inadvertently, read 28 pages of French. Double yay! I found a way to watch Workingirls, which is a French clip show that I first discovered in France but couldn't find afterwards. I watched nine episodes throughout Wednesday and Thursday. Episodes are only eleven or twelve minutes long, but I watched them in batches of two or three at a time. This means I have somehow managed to do about an hour of French watching, although I should do a little more to make up for the silent bits. It kind of reminds me of Green Wing, which I love. This means I have almost completed five of the nine objectives I had for this week. One is imposible to make up - the language meetup, but I should be able to do the rest before Sunday ends. --- I get burnt out really easily when watching TV series, even in English. There are only five series which I have watched in their entirety - three comedy, two drama (which makes me the exact opposite of garyb, I suppose!) - and these were all in English. I go through phases where I can watch a lot of something at once, like lat Summer when I spent a lot of time watching old episodes of the Addams Family and Buffy the Vampire Slayer with Swedish subs, but these periods usually come and go. I find it quite hard to justify watching long episodes of things, and I tend to get restless when I try. It is much easier to watch things with someone, but I don't have any Swedish/French speaking friends who are both willing and able to watch even an episode of anything with me. That's why I find shorter things and standalone documentaries a boon, but they have different benefits to longer episodes and series. I guess this is the kind of thing I'll have to stick with. Using audiobooks for listening practice is something I've never done before. In fact, the last time I had real honest-to-goodness audiobooks was when I was a tot. My sister and I would listen to Enid Blyton story-tapes when we were younger and before we went to bed. I tried listening to the audio of Manon Lescaut lat summer, because I thought it would be quicker than reading, but the reader spoke veeeeery slooooowly, which irritated me no end. I don't think I could read along to an audiobook in French, as I can read faster and I wouldn't particularly benefit from the audio, but I'm really enjoying reading along to German and Swedish. The audio for Låt den rätta komma in is a particular challenge, but one I enjoy. I'm looking forward to doing more and to being able to set aside a few hours in which I just listen and read along. I still doubt I'd be able to go without frequent breaks (that would be a challenge!), but being able to dedicate a lot of time to the activity would be great. 2 persons have voted this message useful | |
| garyb Triglot Senior Member ScotlandRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 5205 days ago 1468 posts - 2413 votes Speaks: English*, Italian, French Studies: Spanish | Message 79 of 129 18 May 2015 at 1:01pm | IP Logged |
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Thanks for the Workingirls recommendation, it sounds like a good one. I know what you mean, I also
struggle to watch series and have only finished a handful of them. Some of my friends can go through a whole season in a day, which is something I could never do even if I had the time. I generally prefer comedy and drama, but action seems to be better at holding my attention and stopping me from getting restless. Indeed it's a lot easier to focus when you're with other people, less temptation to get distracted. It would be nice to have viewing company more often! Most of the Italian and French people I know would rather spend their time watching series in English :). And I'm not sure how many other learners I know would understand without subtitles. I don't mind subs, but for many series they're not even available. Every so often I discuss the idea of having French/Italian film evenings with friends, but it rarely actually happens. One nice thing with the French meetup group here is that they organise film evenings every so often, either at the cinema or at the organiser's house. 1 person has voted this message useful | |
| Elenia Diglot Senior Member United Kingdom lilyonlife.blog Joined 3854 days ago 239 posts - 327 votes Speaks: English*, French Studies: German, Swedish, Esperanto | Message 80 of 129 18 May 2015 at 4:42pm | IP Logged |
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I watched the end of the first season today... very unexpected. Not sure how I feel about it? But I won't spoil it for you. Amazingly, I've managed to find French subtitles for six of the twelve episodes in the first season, although that still not as many as I would like. I also found the first episode with English subs on youtube, although this is not as good as French subs.
L'Institut francaise occasionally organises séances cinéma, and the Swedish Language group has a free Scandi film night every Tuesday. Now that I'm pretty much finished with uni, I have less excuses not to go (but I'm sure I'll find some more!) --- I didn't achieve all of last weeks goals, unfortunately. I did about twenty more minutes of German listening (reading along in English). I'll repeat that again today or tomorrow, reading along in German. I also started work on the French anki deck. I am still not sure which language I'll do next, but I have decided that I'll sign up for the next 6 week challenge with it. Goal setting managed to keep me more or less on the straight [but not narrow] last week, so I'll do it again and cross my fingers I achieve better results. That being said, this week's goals are:
1 episode of Les Revenants 6 episodes of Workingirls 1 episode of Hero Corp 100 words of translation 1h30 of German listening 1 new article on Spektrum.de Re-read the Schlaf-Wach rhythmus article 1h of Låt den rätta komma in 1h30 of Swedish watching Duolingo as usual Anki as usual Again, it feels like a lot already, but I am sure that it will be manageable. Whether I actually manage it remains to be seen but: nothing ventured, nothing gained. The forty pages of French reading will be exclusively book reading. That is not to say I won't read other things - because I hopefully will: building the French anki deck requires is. But I say book pages simply because they are MUCH easier to count. For Les Revenants, I am watching again from the beginning. I rererererewatched epsiode one last week or the week before, and will now watch episode two. After Hero Corp, speech in Les Revenants seems really clear. So that's one plus! The six episodes of Workingirls will not necessarily be the six episodes with subtitles available. I am looking forward to seeing whether studying the transcripts of some episodes will improve comprehension of all of them. I'm hoping that it does! The episode of Hero Corp... well, I'm not sure how that'll work, aside from 'with luck'! The translation is a personal project (very difficult!) which will hopefully double as preparation for my translation exam next week Tuesday. I plan to be reading along for the German listening. Whether I'll be reading in French, German or English remains to be seen. I imagine there it will be a mix of these three. For the articles... like that, they seem kind of pathetic. A steady pace of one/two article a week isn't the least bit impressive, but given how heavily I'm relying on ReadLang for this, I imagine that trying for more would be overly ambitious. In fact, just two feels overly ambitious. Once again, nothing ventured, nothing gained. The amount of Låt den rätta komma in I listened to last week was a lot lower than it should have been, which is probably in part due to me having no concrete goal. Hopefully this week I'll listen to more. The Swedish watching is more or less lined up. I think there are still a few episodes of the Free.running documentary available on SVT Play, and I found the film of Asterix och Britterna! Obviously inspired by Meddysong's log, I have it already open and ready to watch. I also have the link to the dramatic reading open, if I manage to watch the entire film, I'll give the reading a try, too. And then the everyday staples of duo and anki. I mentioned my French anki deck earlier. It's still quite small right now, but it will grow. It is a genders deck (or rather, it is a genders deck at current), so it's only words which I know the meaning of, for which I am not sure about the gender. This category includes a lot of words as genders and accords are quite possibly the biggest problems I have for written French. This has been a long entry. Wish me luck in getting all of that done! 1 person has voted this message useful |
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