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TAC 2010: Russian and Hebrew | ||
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| RedKing'sDream Diglot Groupie United States Joined 5803 days ago 53 posts - 68 votes  Speaks: English*, Russian Studies: Ukrainian | Message 9 of 24 23 December 2009 at 12:14am | IP Logged | |||||||||||||||||
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I didn't mean that the book is worthless. In fact, it's probably very useful, but without the appropriate "filter" you run the risk of absorbing very odd or archaic expressions or syntax.
"Молодец" is a very valuable word, and it does literally mean "good boy/girl." But since the context of its use is different from the English equivalent I would translate it as "good job!" or "nice one!" However, you probably would not use this word with those whom you address as "вы." "Знать увидел вас я в недобрый час" sounds bizarre or very archaic--as weird as using "verily" in modern English. Maybe they meant "значит" instead of "знать." "Как боюсь я вас" is correct but overly formal. The fact that the book gives so many sentences with the subject coming after the verb is odd in some cases and makes it sound way too formal. "Я вас бoюсь" is normal. "Ко мне" is correct, but note that said alone it is roughly equivalent to instructing a dog to "come here!" "итти" is not correct. Perhaps it's a typo. "Можно-ли мне сегодня гулять?" is correct but too formal. "сегодня можно гулять?" sounds more colloquial. I think a more natural way of saying "Мне нужен воздух" is "Мне надо свежиться." "Кто его знает?" means "who knows him?" "Who knows?" is "Кто знает?" Note that "Очи" is extremely archaic and only used in poetry. "Она говорит свободно по-английски" sounds better as "Она свободно говорит по-английски." Usually adverbs come before verbs. Hopefully this helps. I have quite a collection of interesting/rare Russian idiomatic phrases that you probably won't come by in textbooks, so I can give you some as you build your collection of sentences. Overall sounds like you've got a good plan. Good luck! Edited by RedKing'sDream on 23 December 2009 at 12:17am 2 persons have voted this message useful | ||||||||||||||||||
| Stryozyk Newbie United States Joined 5474 days ago 39 posts - 44 votes Speaks: English* Studies: Russian | Message 10 of 24 23 December 2009 at 12:56am | IP Logged | |||||||||||||||||
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Thank you both so much for your corrections. They are extremely helpful. I am glad there are not more
serious errors - I had figured the language was a little strange, but what else do you expect from a lesson book? To be honest just being able to recognize a word like свободен and know that it can mean something like "free" is the most important thing for me at this point. RedKing'sDream, I would love to see your collection of idioms. I just completed the third series of lessons (15-21) in the Assimil book, so here are some more sentences. Corrections/comments are of course very greatly appreciated. В чём дело? What does it concern? Обед не готовлю. I'm not fixing dinner. Время теряю. I'm losing time. Всё грязно! Everything's dirty! Просто у вас настроение плохое. It's just that you're in a bad mood. Боюсь, что я больна. I'm afraid I'm sick. У меня голова болит. My head hurts. Почтальон не приходит. The mailman isn't coming. Не так-ли? Right? Накройте на стол. Cover the table. Уверяю вас. I assure you. Вы пьёте, даже когда вам не хочется пить. You drink even when you're not thirsty. Напротив. To the contrary. У меня сейчас сильная жажда. I am very thirsty right now. Вот закуски. Here are the appetizers. Я умираю от жажды. I'm dying of thirst. Я бросаюсь на квас. I dive into the kvass. Вы нетерпеливый человек. You're an impatient person. Вот наконец и самовар кипит. Finally the samovar is boiling. Что касается меня... As for me... Мне больше ничего не хочется. I don't want anything anymore. Вода уже давно кипит. The water has been boiling for a long time. Давайте кушать. Let's eat. Город теперь смерть для нас. The city is deadly for us right now. Деревня спокойная. The countryside is peaceful. Воздух чистый. The air is clean. Помните то, что я вам говорю. Remember what I tell you. Пора мне обедать. It's time for me to eat dinner. To be continued...there are considerably more words this time. Edited by Stryozyk on 23 December 2009 at 1:05am 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||||||||||||||
| RedKing'sDream Diglot Groupie United States Joined 5803 days ago 53 posts - 68 votes Speaks: English*, Russian Studies: Ukrainian | Message 11 of 24 23 December 2009 at 3:10am | IP Logged | |||||||||||||||||
This is used in the sense of "What's the problem?" In the sense of concerning it might be better to say "О чём идёт речь." Note, however, the similar "Дело в том, что..." for "The point is..."
Note, that "больна" indicates a female.
Correct, but old fashion. Better to say "правильно?"
Again, old fashion or too formal. Better to say "наоборот"
This literally means "I don't feel like anything else." "I don't want anymore" would literally be "Я больше ничего не хочу."
Kind of funny sounding. Better to say "Давайте есть" Overall, these sound a little better to me. I have so many Russian phrases/expressions/idioms spread out that it might be more effective to just PM me if there are certain phrases you want. If I don't know them I can find out quickly. ...But just for fun, here are a few interesting ones. задеть чьё-небудь самолюбие - "to hurt someone's pride" развеять скуку - "to relieve boredom" сводить счёты - "to settle the score" доходить до сути дела - "to come to the point" нажить врагов - "to make enemies" совершать сделку - "to make a deal" нога у меня онемела - "My leg fell asleep." найти точку опоры - "to gain a foothold" козёл отпушения -"a scapegoat, a patsy" сокращать учётных ставок - "to reduce interest rates" разработка космоса - "space exploration" ратифицировать договор - "to ratify a treaty" прокинуть в здание через охрану - "to get into a building past security пить заплом - "to drink in one gulp" застать (кого-либо) врасплох - "to catch (someone) off guard роботать на халтуре - "to earn money on the side" обрести второе дыхание - "to get one's second wind" дать (кому-либо) поблажку - "to be lenient (with someone)" Hope this helps. Edited by RedKing'sDream on 23 December 2009 at 3:16am 2 persons have voted this message useful | ||||||||||||||||||
| Stryozyk Newbie United States Joined 5474 days ago 39 posts - 44 votes Speaks: English* Studies: Russian | Message 12 of 24 23 December 2009 at 5:30am | IP Logged | |||||||||||||||||
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Thanks again for the suggestions! Those phrases you gave me are great. It makes me very excited about
getting to that level. I noticed you're studying Ukrainian; I'm really interested in studying other Slavic languages after Russian (though I shouldn't get ahead of myself). I should note that I don't plan on entering the sentences I've put here as cards into Anki, for the reasons you mentioned - I want more natural language for those. But I'm putting them here because for one thing typing helps me remember and for another I wanted to put all the sentences with new words in one place. Not to mention that it's great to have comments like yours. But anyway, continuing: trong>Ей всё равно. It's all the same to her. trong>Саша сегодня грустный. Sasha is sad today. trong>Он не играет на рояле. He's not playing the piano. trong>Для неё то же самое, что не работать. To her it's the same thing as not working. trong>Всё время отдыхать. To rest all the time. trong>Ну что, мы поём вместе, дорогая? So, should we sing together, darling? trong>Ты лентяй. You're lazy. trong>Отвечает она грубо. She answers rudely. trong>Бедный Саша. Poor Sasha. trong>Мне нужна какая-нибудь игрушка. I need a kind of toy. trong>Сколько лет вашему ребёнку? How old is your child? trong>Вот лестница. Here's the stairs. trong>Игрушки внизу. The toys are downstairs. trong>Вот лучше. Here's a better one. trong>Я ищу дешёвый подарок. I'm looking for an inexpensive gift. trong>Уж спасибо. Thanks a lot. trong>Барабан мне не нравится. I don't like the drum. trong>Покажите. Let me see. trong>Это ваша последняя цена? Is that your final price? trong>Неужели вам не холодно? Are you really not cold? trong>Пальто у меня не готово. My coat's not ready. trong>Портной мне его завтра принесёт. The tailor is bringing it to me tomorrow. trong>Мороз уже сильный. The frost (?) is already strong. trong>Не шутка. It's not pleasant. trong>А у вас шуба великолепная. But you have a magnificent fur coat. trong>Шуба эта уже старая. This fur coat is already old. trong>У меня другая есть, новая. I have another one, a new one. trong>Защищаться надо во-время, не правда ли? You have to protect yourself at times, don't you? trong>Зима теперь очень близка. Winter's very close now. trong>Завтра будет первый снег. Tomorrow's the first snow. trong>И тогда будет уже поздно. And then it will be too late. trong>Кипучая, могучая. Bubbling, mighty. trong>Никем не победимая. Invincible. trong>Страна моя, Москва моя, ты самая любимая. My country, my Moscow, you are the most beloved. 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||||||||||||||
| SII Senior Member Russian FederationRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 5796 days ago 184 posts - 194 votes Speaks: Russian* Studies: English | Message 13 of 24 23 December 2009 at 10:08am | IP Logged | |||||||||||||||||
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trong>Stryozyk
There are some syntax mistakes in your Russian sentences again. In addition, the unusual word order is used sometimes. You use a strange source for these sentences. 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||||||||||||||
| Sprachjunge Diglot Senior Member Germany Joined 7169 days ago 368 posts - 548 votes Speaks: English*, GermanC2 Studies: Spanish, Russian | Message 14 of 24 23 December 2009 at 9:55pm | IP Logged | |||||||||||||||||
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Hello Stryozyk! It was so funny--when I logged on last night, I was reading your log and thinking "Hey, this sounds similar to my approach; I see just where she's coming from." And then I switched to my log and read your comment! Thanks for the note, and best of luck to you as well. I especially echo your thoughts about a little bit each day. I've found that none of my projects die because I do too little each day, but rather because I just won't do anything for weeks--months--and suddenly it's dead.
Antimoon and AJATT also really changed the way I think about language learning. I realized (for me, at least; people's goals differ): "Sprachjunge, your job is not to be creative in the slightest in a foreign language. That impresses no one. Your job is to figure out how most native speakers say all of the things you could possibly want to say in that language, and then memorize them." 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||||||||||||||
| Stryozyk Newbie United States Joined 5474 days ago 39 posts - 44 votes Speaks: English* Studies: Russian | Message 15 of 24 25 December 2009 at 6:08pm | IP Logged | |||||||||||||||||
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SII, thanks for letting me know. Hmm, I think I will still keep them though because really they are just useful to
me for the vocabulary. I'm just using this book as the briefest of introductions and I don't plan on imitating its language, so hopefully I'll be okay. Sprachjunge, thanks so much for the comments. Antimoon/AJATT revolutionized my language learning ideas too - actually my learning ideas in general. Whereas before I thought of language as more of a grammatical structure focusing on proper construction, now I think of it as a fluid, individual structure which focuses more on conveying meaning. I owe those guys a gigantic debt. So I've been looking through the old posts on the "Links and Internet Resources" section of this site, and found a ton of awesome Russian sites. There is a really useful list on masterrussian.com of the 1000 most frequently used words, with examples sentences and idioms for each. I might take sentences from there. I also did my first page of the Kitzur - it made about 25 sentences and took maybe half an hour. I had to go a little slowly because I have made mistakes switching so quickly from Hebrew to English typing in the past. (I actually type in Hebrew better than in English, thanks to a typing tutor I once took for the Hebrew keyboard...so when I switch back to English I get confused.) Anyway, the system seems to work pretty well. These are a few sample sentences (er, phrases; most aren't full sentences): trong>מודדין באצבע של אדם בינוני one measures with the thumb of an average person mod'din b'etzba shel adam beinoni trong>מונחים זה אצל זה ברחבן placed near each other widthwise munakhim ze eitzel ze b'rokhban trong>והוא כמו שבעה גרעיני שעורה which is similar to seven kernels of barley v'hu kh'mo shiva garinei s'ora trong>שוב הראני נכדי הבחור יחזקאל בנעט my grandson, Yechezkel Banet, later showed me shuv herani nekhdi habakhur y'khezkeil banet trong>והיא לערך אמה בעמיש this is approximately a Bohemian cubit v'hi l'eirekh ama bemish trong>הוא האצבע העב, דוימען פינגער this is the thick finger, the thumb hu haetzba haav, doimen finger Some unrelated rambling: I really love Anki. It's pretty much a lifesaver for obsessive-compulsives like me, and has given me an easy way to learn all kinds of things. I remember that when I tried studying Arabic I actually got a text-to-speech program and for every sentence I put in I would attach a picture, audio, and all these notes. That was quite a hassle but it sure looked nice and I did eventually get my time down to 1-2 minutes per card. I needed all the encouragement I could get there though...I'm not below using big, colorful markers and huge letters to drill things into my head, either. Edited by Stryozyk on 25 December 2009 at 6:14pm 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||||||||||||||
| Sprachjunge Diglot Senior Member Germany Joined 7169 days ago 368 posts - 548 votes Speaks: English*, GermanC2 Studies: Spanish, Russian | Message 16 of 24 28 December 2009 at 7:15pm | IP Logged | |||||||||||||||||
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Again, thank you for the kind words! The "Pronouncing -- Correctly" series systematically takes you through all of the sounds in a given language with examples for each. Sometimes there are better pronunciation resources available for a language--I know there are in German--but I guess it's as good a place as any to start. Are you familiar with the website uztranslations.net? It's free; you just register and there is a ton of material for several languages. It gave me the text and the audio.
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