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Sunja’s Newspaper/TV Challenge --TAC 09 | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Language Learning Log |  | |
| Sunja Diglot Senior Member Germany Joined 6089 days ago 2020 posts - 2295 votes  1 sounds Speaks: English*, German Studies: French, Mandarin | Message 193 of 232 27 August 2009 at 10:58am | IP Logged |
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I got an email reply from Mariko. She wrote me 5 pages (!) Don't worry, I won't recount everything here, but what she wrote is very insightful so I wanted to share some of it.
In our last email we were discussing the Japanese personality and the prevailing attitude that Japanese are inherently shy people. She's arguing that they are not. I'm a mere learner and could only offer her a personal anecdote. Here are "a few" of her corrections to what I wrote: 私はLAの銀行に勤めていた時、熟年の方はみ こさんいました。→私がLAの銀行に勤めて た時、年配の方で、みやこさんという(同僚 )女性がいました。 Here I wrote about a Japanese colleague I had when I worked in Los Angeles. I use the word 熟年の方 to describe the person. Jim Breen defines 熟年 as "mature". Mariko says this is not so polite as 年配の方. Mariko writes: When you want to write about someone who is old, 年配 is appropriate. 熟年 is not wrong, but 年配 is better in this case. Actually, we don’ t use 熟年 with 人 or 方. Because 熟 is a opposite meaning of fresh (it means mature) , so 熟年の方doesn’t sound good. Moreover, the word “熟年″didn’t exist in past times. 年配の方 sounds polite and natural. If you want to try using the word, please refer to examples below. 熟年者 (=elderly) /熟年離婚 (=middle-aged divorce) /熟年夫婦 (=older couples) Isn't that great stuff? okay, みやこさんは表現したくなったのように見ま せん。→みやこさんは自分自身を表現するの が好きではなかったようでした。 Without going into everything she basically added 自分自身 which acts as the reflexive in the phrase 自分自身を表現する. But I have to ask, both mean "herself"; what's the difference between 自分 and 自身? I'm sure it's like when we say "she herself". I'll ask. 私は今みやこさんがシャイだったと思います 。→今になって思うと、彼女は単に恥ずかし がり屋だったのだと思います。 単に恥ずかしがり屋 means simply a shy person, tanni hazukashigarisha She also writes: When you look back something, it is a useful phrase.(今になって思うと) Isn't that useful (^-^)b Sounds like it translates to "even now becoming,.." Obviously it doesn't work so well to try and translate it but just thought it would magically imprint itself on my brain if I made it closer to our language.. moving on, (here's a big one) 洗濯物を持っていくみやこさんよこしてしま した。(I understand that secretaries sometimes give tea service to clients, but I think Miyako had to do other things too, like pick up the manager's laundry.) → 秘書は時として得意先の方にお茶出しをする ことはあります。しかし、彼女は上司の洗濯 物をもって行くなど、（仕事と）関係のない ことまでやらされていました。 This was beyond skill to write, so she was kind enough to fill it in for me. There's a lot of stuff here. ひしょはときとしてとくいさきのかたにおち ゃだしをすることはあります。 しかし、か のじょはじょうしのせんたくものをもってい くなど、しごとかんけいのないことまでやら されていました New words or things I've forgotten, ときとして - when (working) as とくいさきのかた - client おちゃだしをする - serving (someone) tea じょうし - boss しごとかんけいのないこと - things unrelated to work (job) やらされる - being forced to do 私はみやこさんに表現しているように催促し ました。→私みやこさんに、もっと自分自身 を表現するよう励ましました。 (○○を表現する) You need Object when you use 表現する. はげます - encourage NOT さいそく - request, demand アメリカに住んだのあとで、みやこさんは平 等が好きです。分かりました。 After living in America for a time, Miyako liked to have more equality (at work). I can understand. →アメリカに住んだ後、みやこさんは(職場 は)もっと平等に扱われたいと思っていたよ です。 もっとびょうどうにあつかう - to treat more equally Okay that's probably "reader tolerance level" for the corrections. There's plenty more where that came from. I went on to discussing a few things in English, and I didn't have the time/skill to write it. She was kind enough to give me a Japanese version of what I wrote. So I'm going to go take a look at that now. It's going to be another full day. I have to work tonight. Hopefully I can stay on top of my smart.fm vocabulary.. PS. Next time I'll add these great Japanese proverbs that she sent me. I translated one already to "Better the foot slip than the tongue", which explain the Japanese virtue that it's better to be one of few words. 1 person has voted this message useful | |
| Sunja Diglot Senior Member Germany Joined 6089 days ago 2020 posts - 2295 votes 1 sounds Speaks: English*, German Studies: French, Mandarin | Message 194 of 232 29 August 2009 at 1:07pm | IP Logged |
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沈黙は金、 雄弁は銀- ちんもくはきん ゆうべんはぎん silence is gold, speech is silver
口は禍の門 ちはわざわいのもん 口が滑るくらいなら足が滑った方が増し better the foot slip than the tongue. Mund ist das Tor von Gut und Böse, die Wurzel von der Geißel der Zunge / Mund ist die Quelle der Schwierigkeiten 目は口ほどに物をいう The eyes are as eloquent as the mouth I'm working on translating the other stuff she wrote. These proverbs are common and can be found all over (as I've discovered). The other stuff she wrote is interesting. I'm still studying... I also got my latest issue of "Hiragana Times". I have enough to keep me busy. Will I ever get to the housework? Probably not. Mari also sent me an email. I have to go over that one too. 1 person has voted this message useful | |
| Sunja Diglot Senior Member Germany Joined 6089 days ago 2020 posts - 2295 votes 1 sounds Speaks: English*, German Studies: French, Mandarin | Message 195 of 232 29 August 2009 at 1:23pm | IP Logged |
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I've picked up a couple of tips for music..
ENDLICHERI☆ENDLICHERI KOKIA I don't get to listen to much music (always busy) so this will be a new way to hear the language for me. Edited by Sunja on 29 August 2009 at 1:24pm 1 person has voted this message useful | |
| Sunja Diglot Senior Member Germany Joined 6089 days ago 2020 posts - 2295 votes 1 sounds Speaks: English*, German Studies: French, Mandarin | Message 196 of 232 30 August 2009 at 9:03am | IP Logged |
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I worked on my replies to Mari and Mariko yesterday. Mari wanted to know about the swine flu in Germany, so I had to brush up on some vocabulary in order to write about that. I have both emails in the out box and I'll check them over one more time before sending.
I read some of my new Hiragana Times magazine. I finally know what a 草食だし is and now I've discovered that they have a term 肉食女子. So we have as a modern trend, "grass-eating men" and "carnivorous women". Unfortunately I'll have to wait a bit until I'm able to go find more on the subject. My reading is improving, but the articles in HT are slow-going, because the sentences are so long. My syntax has improved quite a bit since I started writing everyday, so I'm happy with that. My vocabulary needs a severe boost. There just aren't enough hours in the day for me to get enough reading practice. My progress will remain slow. I haven't been to smart.fm in a few days and I have a permanent "you're behind schedule" notice on all my lists. Even with my deadline set for the end of the year I have to suffer this reminder that I may not make it. I've only done about 5% of each list and there's 8 lists. I'm going to work on that this morning. My family and I are going out today. One last "hoorah" before we sink into the new semester. I'll see how much of my lists I can accomplish before we go. 1 person has voted this message useful | |
| Sunja Diglot Senior Member Germany Joined 6089 days ago 2020 posts - 2295 votes 1 sounds Speaks: English*, German Studies: French, Mandarin | Message 197 of 232 31 August 2009 at 10:10pm | IP Logged |
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feeling exhausted. I don't think I'm going to make it to smart.fm. tonight.
I have tomomi's email to think about and I haven't checked my in-box -- hold on -- okay, no new emails. *whew* I'm having a hard time trying to find stuff to write about. I'm trying to work on my vocabulary but it doesn't get enough practice. tomomi is having a hard time, too. She wrote a couple of sentences about going shopping and that was it. yep. Feeling tired today. I have a wordlist I'm going to try out. It's a group of 50 words centered around illness. Fun,eh. Actually they're great words and I actually learned something today when I read about influenza in the Japanese Wiki. It took me an hour to fish out words that I like well enough to spend time with them. I kind of skipped the ones that I won't be using with people. Words like "phlegm". The Wiki can keep that one. I'll be spending more time with my list of 50 tomorrow. As of today I just wrote them down. Red marker kanji, blue marker English. I want to see if I fare better with this method than at smart.fm. I like smart.fm, but the words are grouped according to frequency and there's no context to tie them to. They're getting tough. It's not like I'm learning the word for "laundry" or "screwdriver". I'm learning really abstract ones. It will take me longer to get through the Core 6000. I spent a lot of time at Meguro Language Center.com, today. I wanted to try their dialogues again after a few months of being away. They have some really good example dialogues for "tara", and I copied the PDF files on those. Will I start another wordlist tomorrow? Why not. I just have to figure out what theme I want. tourism? banking? art? Edited by Sunja on 31 August 2009 at 10:11pm 1 person has voted this message useful | |
| Sunja Diglot Senior Member Germany Joined 6089 days ago 2020 posts - 2295 votes 1 sounds Speaks: English*, German Studies: French, Mandarin | Message 198 of 232 01 September 2009 at 9:00am | IP Logged |
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I'm not really ready to quiz myself on my batch of "illness" words that I wrote down yesterday. I tried to read the kanji last night before bed and I did well on all except
集団 しゅうだん group, mass 流感 りゅうかん virus, cold 筋肉痛 きんにくつう muscleache 頭痛 ずつう headache 特徴 とくちょう characteristic (one of my abstract ones from "Core" that I never learned) 鼻閉 びへい congestion of the nose. check out the kanji. If you know Heisig you get a nice image in your head... 炎症 えんしょう inflammation (another lovely word) 腹痛 ふくつう stomachache 取り除くる とりのぞくる disperse the highlighted syllables are the ones I missed. Otherwise I sounded the rest out okay. This morning I quized myself and I read from the "blue" English-side and the only one I could write was ドアの取っ手 "doorknob". So I'm not ready to go from English to Japanese yet. Most of the kana I got. I decided to add words like "doorknob" and "surface" because these are the kinds of things I usually think about when I think of germs. I'll do another quiz shortly. Now I'm going to go make a list of new words (another 50) on the subject of supermarkets. I'm going to the Japanese Wiki again. Meguro Language Center has a cool shopping list. Any other words I'll have to google. My absolute favourite katakana words from MLC's shopping list are ピーナッツバター "peanut butter". I'm a smooth-type myself. スムースタイプ. I never cared for crunchy. クランチタイプ I'd better get to my list. It's already 9:00 1 person has voted this message useful | |
| Sunja Diglot Senior Member Germany Joined 6089 days ago 2020 posts - 2295 votes 1 sounds Speaks: English*, German Studies: French, Mandarin | Message 199 of 232 01 September 2009 at 11:17am | IP Logged |
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oo, man that took me a while. It's already 10:40. I guess I spent more time on that Wiki article than I thought.
I have a list of 50 very carefully selected supermarket words that I don't mind spending time with. The article at Wiki was mostly economic terms but since the roots/compounds are all useful I went ahead and put them in my list. 安売り競争 "discount competition" is not really a word that I need at this learning stage, but the kanji compounds are very useful. Besides "competition" is another one of those Core words from smart-fm that I never seem to be able to memorize completely. My favourites are 出来合いの弁当 できあいのべんとう to-go (ready-made) lunch レジの人 &nb sp; person at the register 食材 しょくざい &nbs p; ingredient or foodstuff 惣菜 そうざい &nb sp; side dish. Like when you go to the deli and get a package of potato salad 入手しにくい hard-to-get item (it will go nicely w. "ingredient") 日常生活 にちじょうせいかつ everyday living 日用品 にちようひん &nb sp; everyday articles, food 列 れつ &nbs p; &nbs p; queue (at the cashier) 洗剤 せんざい &nb sp; detergent watch out for that last one, it has a homophone 潜在 せんざい which is "potential" I'll try using some of these in an email and have my partners check the usage on these. It would be a drag to learn that I spent so much time learning できあいの if they also say レディーメイド for "ready-made". Who knows if they use it in the same context. I'll find out.. Edited by Sunja on 01 September 2009 at 11:20am 1 person has voted this message useful | |
| Sunja Diglot Senior Member Germany Joined 6089 days ago 2020 posts - 2295 votes 1 sounds Speaks: English*, German Studies: French, Mandarin | Message 200 of 232 03 September 2009 at 11:41am | IP Logged |
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feeling exhausted and erkältet. I wrote Tomomi yesterday with all the "market" words I could think of. I really hope she responds in Japanese and not English - I forgot to ask. I really need to see those words written in a real, native context.
I wrote a draft of Kyamina's response - just her corrections. Hey,...*listen* what a downpour. Did bring in the laundry +++ okay so it's a little damp. Anyway... *sigh* I've been going over some simple, basic dialogues to counter my intensive vocab work. I haven't been over my illness words today, yet. There's still time. I won't be going back to smart-fm, because I want to work on my speaking (shadowing dialogues, mimicing, trying to come up with my own phrases, pretending I'm talking to someone instead of uttering Japanese outloud in my car with the windows rolled up.) I'm using my intermediate tapes (ancient but good). I can't do much listening all at once because I end up tuning it out. I have so much going on at the moment. I have to leave to run and errand, pick up the kids, blah-blah-blah, work tonight and do a report. I thought I'd be able to get my house in order after the summer break. 3 kids and 3 adults have been here almost every day for six weeks and it looks like a bomb hit the place. Ordnung muss sein. I'd better get to it. I try to squeeze in whatever I can. Consistent I am not. I just do what I feel like, as long as it's something. I'll work on that email reply to Kyamina. I plan to write a paragraph using the words from one of my wordlists. 1 person has voted this message useful |
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