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Well I guess I�m learning Russian... | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Language Learning Log |  | |
 Brian_N Pro Member Canada Joined 5769 days ago 200 posts - 202 votes  Studies: English*, Russian Personal Language Map | Message 41 of 248 25 February 2009 at 5:03am | IP Logged | ||
They’d definitely go crazy it I told them I was learning Arabic lol. Na, there not bothering me to much anymore...I basically told them to all F off...I say basically because more was said, but you get the picture lol. Anyways thanks for the book list, the “Roots of the Russian Language” one really caught my attention. I’m definitely going to be getting it, probably order it in next week with a Russian grammar book I’ve been looking at. Persian hey? That’s an interesting language (my second choice), I’d definitely like to learn that one and go visit the Iranians...though for now I’ll stick with Russia and Russians...I sense the odds of my coming back home with my head still attached to my neck are abit higher lol. Edited by Brian_N on 25 February 2009 at 5:05am 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| rafey Newbie United States Joined 5764 days ago 24 posts - 25 votes Speaks: English* | Message 42 of 248 25 February 2009 at 4:14pm | IP Logged | ||
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I spent a year studying Japanese but ran into a glitch when I kept bumping into Kanji (as Pitwo will no doubt vouch for this problem common to all Japanese learners). Otherwise, the language itself is not all that difficult but for the emphasis on class and age differences. I did, in fact purchase the Declan cards but then discovered a more practical approach (advised by a Japanese friend of mine), which I continue to use while I more seriously pursue Russian. In both cases, however (and as nearly all liguists agree), I continue to learn my vocabulary in context (much as we do our native language) rather than by the "hairshirt" method of drill, drill, drill and that has paid off tremendously and has enabled me to more rapidly absorb the essence of the language itself so that I very quickly was able to comprehend entire sentences almost at a single glance or hearing (as one does in one's native lingua franca.
In Russian, the word form transforms radically when employed in varying sentence structures so that learning the word itself is of little help once one begins to read intermediate level Russian. Each form is like learning a new word but this is similar to most inflective languages like Ancient Greek and Arabic. In any case, it's the 26 letter tongue twisters with which I encounter most of my trouble but I break them down into their parts and eventually master their enunciation. I figured that you would appreciate the "root" book. You'll find it immensely informative for a long time to come, even after you have reached advanced stage Russian! 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Brian_N Pro Member Canada Joined 5769 days ago 200 posts - 202 votes Studies: English*, Russian Personal Language Map | Message 43 of 248 26 February 2009 at 2:27pm | IP Logged | ||
I also plan to learn my vocabulary in context, in the spoken context. Continual drilling is a necessity for me to be able to pic apart spoken Russian. I will utilize books occasionally for the grammar and other bits of information I see as necessary, but I’d strongly prefer something that comes with sound. Ultimately, Russian literature (or English) doesn’t interest me. Russian psychology and Russian women do, hence my emphasis on the spoken. I can’t agree that that drilling in the beginning will be useless for intermediate level Russian, there has to be some sort of relation between the roots words + grammar and what is written. If there isn’t, then that would make intermediate level Russian a language within a language and nothing I’ve ever read seems to suggest this. And even if it is...rote learning and more drill will take care of it. Thanks for the book list, I definitely did appreciate the root book. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Brian_N Pro Member Canada Joined 5769 days ago 200 posts - 202 votes Studies: English*, Russian Personal Language Map | Message 44 of 248 26 February 2009 at 2:59pm | IP Logged | ||
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Feb 25th – Day 16 – Group 1 Vocabulary (+20)
Nouns – Part 1-4 => Complete Nouns – Part 5 => (45/50) => Under Review Nouns – Part 6 => (24/50) => Under Review 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| rafey Newbie United States Joined 5764 days ago 24 posts - 25 votes Speaks: English* | Message 45 of 248 26 February 2009 at 8:24pm | IP Logged | ||
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Don't mean to keep harping on the issue. It is just that too many people get into the habit of word-for-word translating when they learn a foreign language by rote. That is why so many poorly translated volumes have been publised over the centuries. Genesis, for example was translated from the Greek by monks who were vocabulary-wise but linguistically & culturally poor. Their subsequent translation was way off the mark, the finished product emphasizing externalities and such items as God, "The Word," etc. while the original Greek described a very opposing view, emphasizing internalities, inspiration from within and the birth of consciousness (two virtually different versions with entirely different consequences in terms of their effect on Human history).
Again, Americans who have been sent overseas as Arabic "translators" perform word-for-word translating, which have the unfortunate effect of insulting and misunderstanding, since the word translations do not actually conform to the actual meaning as it is represented in the Arab culture. (A good example is the word: nijay which translates as "foreigner" in English but is understood by Arabic speakers as barbarian. A simple example, but you get the point. In any case, when you have arrived at a more advanced stage in your learning, this book is a must: V Puti: Russian Grammar in Context, 2nd Edition It helps to develop all Russian language skills, including listening, speaking, reading, and writing. In addition to the N. Brown I mentioned previously, this is the most highly regarded of texts, only for the more intermediate to advanced. Thanks again for hearing me out. Rafey 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Brian_N Pro Member Canada Joined 5769 days ago 200 posts - 202 votes Studies: English*, Russian Personal Language Map | Message 46 of 248 27 February 2009 at 5:01am | IP Logged | ||
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Feb 26th – Day 17 – Group 1 Vocabulary (+11)
Nouns – Part 1-4 => Complete Nouns – Part 5 => (49/50) => Under Review Nouns – Part 6 => (31/50) => Under Review 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Brian_N Pro Member Canada Joined 5769 days ago 200 posts - 202 votes Studies: English*, Russian Personal Language Map | Message 47 of 248 27 February 2009 at 5:57am | IP Logged | ||
I understand perfectly what your trying to say Rafey, the text book language and the actual language are two entirely different animals, and I agree with you 100%. I also understand that your not trying to be a pain, but rather show me a better method of learning, as was shown to you. The benefits of superior methods are not lost on me Rafey, I understand fully that using better methods not only translates into a deeper understanding of the target language it also shaves months off of reaching target fluency. I see both as being very very desirable. The problem i’m having however is I have no clue how I would begin learning anything in context. I have no reference point, no focal point...I can’t see where I would even begin building any sort of foundation. I am fully aware of the deficiencies of rote for foreign language learning, your example demonstrates it case in point. However in my eyes for a beginner, such as myself, I can’t see how it wouldn’t be the best option. In time, with enough drill, it will provide a useful foundation that I can stand on while I start transitioning to the ‘real’ language. Trust me when I say my learning is highly adaptive, I have no intention of doing drill forever. Once its usefulness has been expended, it will be discarded and something that can better meet the needs of the situation will quickly take its place. V Puti: Russian Grammar in Context, 2nd Edition...hmm another book, this one looks interesting too. Thanks, salesman? lol j/k. Edited by Brian_N on 27 February 2009 at 6:01am 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Brian_N Pro Member Canada Joined 5769 days ago 200 posts - 202 votes Studies: English*, Russian Personal Language Map | Message 48 of 248 27 February 2009 at 6:28am | IP Logged | ||
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Day 17 – Interesting....
One of the things I started doing regularly when I began learning Russians was to start listening to the language as I sleep. And while...yes lol, it can be abit creepy waking up in the middle of the night and hearing people chattering away in a different language I’m finding those minutes right when I’m between being asleep and awake very interesting. Its almost as if I can make better sense of what i’m hearing...the words i’ve drilled are recalled immediately, the language sounds cleaner, clearer...and even abit slower. The first time I thought I just dreaming that this was somehow making more sense lol...but nope this pattern seems to be reoccurring. Potential for verbal understanding increasing as I get closer to falling asleep. Now I just have to figure out how this can go from being cool to being actually useful lol. 1 person has voted this message useful |
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