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Total Annihilation - Charlmartell | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Language Learning Log |  | |
| charlmartell Super Polyglot Senior Member Portugal Joined 6242 days ago 286 posts - 298 votes  Speaks: French, English, German, Luxembourgish*, Spanish, Portuguese, Russian, Dutch, Italian, Latin, Ancient Greek Studies: Mandarin, Japanese | Message 49 of 71 07 September 2008 at 12:56pm | IP Logged |
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This is now a more general what-I-do-language-related-wise log, here what I did at the beginning of last week but never got round to recording. About how one can and does establish connections between a priori totally independent sources: An Italian book ("I promessi sposi"), real life ("war on terrorism"), a section called RELIGIONE in an Italian 3rd grader's nook of general knowledge, a short story by Dino Buzzati. And then, thinking about language: Again "I promessi sposi", Lewis Carroll's jabberwocky, Lewis Pagett's science fiction, a modern film and, totally unrelated except incidentally: "The Ones Who Walk Away from Omelas", which brings us back to that same idea of good/bad/justice/happiness in the 3rd grade RELIGIONE.
The thread about "I promessi sposi" piqued my curiosity, so I downloaded the first chapter and tried to read it. It was supposed to be difficult, my Italian isn't all that strong yet, but I had no problem understanding. Because I'm used to read meaning, not words. That's what we do in our native languages, unless we are specifically trying to improve our vocabulary. Or are very slow readers. Which brought Lewis Carroll's "all mimsy were the borogroves" to mind, all gibberish that still somehow makes sense, subjective sense that is. Manzoni's language is full of words I don't know but can either understand through context or just skip over if unimportant, to me personally, for global understanding of the story. Anyway, I read the jabberwocky poem ages ago and now wanted to reread it, so I googled and found it here, with some background information. I still love it now, just like I did then. But I also found a different version related to a science fiction story (1943) by someone called Lewis Padgett, see this blog for general appraisal and story. I did once see a bit of the film The Last Mimzy the blogger refers to. I found it abominable, and the title didn't even remind me of Lewis Carroll's poem nor of Lewis Padgett's book (which I had never heard of but now think may be an interesting read). Then, because the Adventus blogger intrigued me I investigated and found this entry about a story with the rather catching title: "The Ones Who Walk Away from Omelas". The link he gives for the full text doesn't work, but I found some information about the story here and then the full text in pdf form here. The teacher in the RELIGIONE section explains to her chidren about the importance of being good, helpful but also JUST so as to make our world a sort of paradise (she calls it god's reign on earth, but I'm not religious, so I prefer to call it a happy place, a paradise, which it would be if everybody were good, helpful and just/fair). Is Omelas really a happy place? So why, when most stay, do some walk away from that Eden? I have no idea how much time I spent on-line NOT attending to my TAC, but it was worth every second! 1 person has voted this message useful | |
| charlmartell Super Polyglot Senior Member Portugal Joined 6242 days ago 286 posts - 298 votes Speaks: French, English, German, Luxembourgish*, Spanish, Portuguese, Russian, Dutch, Italian, Latin, Ancient Greek Studies: Mandarin, Japanese | Message 50 of 71 08 September 2008 at 5:28am | IP Logged |
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Did I say I was dropping Don Quijote from my TAC? Well, well. First thing in the morning, after washing and shaving but before breakfast, I grab my mp3 player and my dog and take them both for a walk. I do all my Italian audio that way. Only, as it is still rather dark at 7 am and I didn't switch on the light in my study I got hold of the wrong mp3 player. Didn't find out till I was out of the gate. So I spent nearly an hour listening to Spanish Don Quijote, Part 2, chapters 2, 3, 4 and 5, instead of Assimil Italien. The fact that it is very well read helped a lot of course. I really enjoyed it this time, much better than Perfectionnement Italien. From now on Don Quijote will accompany master and his dog every morning, Italian gets enough coverage at my desk, during the day.
I obviously needed a push, in the right direction, to appreciate Cervantes' master-piece. My grabbing the wrong player, Fate or Coincidence? 1 person has voted this message useful | |
| charlmartell Super Polyglot Senior Member Portugal Joined 6242 days ago 286 posts - 298 votes Speaks: French, English, German, Luxembourgish*, Spanish, Portuguese, Russian, Dutch, Italian, Latin, Ancient Greek Studies: Mandarin, Japanese | Message 51 of 71 10 September 2008 at 11:51am | IP Logged |
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SPANISH: Don Quijote
Listened to chapters 6, 7 and 8, quite a few more chapters to enjoy: there are 74 chapters in Part 2 [some 20 hours). And if I decide to listen to Part 1 as well, another 52 chapters (some 17 hours). I might just do it before Jan 1st. GREEK: The Library by Apollodoros Book 2, Heracles, early years, his crime, 12 labours imposed on him for atonement. Have now read: Nemean Lion Hydra Cerynitian Hind Erymanthian Boar Stables of Augeas Stymphalian Birds Cretan Bull Mares of Diomedes Belt of Hippolyte (only half so far, time was up) 1 person has voted this message useful | |
| charlmartell Super Polyglot Senior Member Portugal Joined 6242 days ago 286 posts - 298 votes Speaks: French, English, German, Luxembourgish*, Spanish, Portuguese, Russian, Dutch, Italian, Latin, Ancient Greek Studies: Mandarin, Japanese | Message 52 of 71 13 September 2008 at 12:45pm | IP Logged |
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SPANISH: Don Quijote
Typical, everything I do is half-arsed. Luckily only half, the other half is fine. I did think that those chapters I was listening to were a little disorganised and found it rather strange that the second book told some stories I'd have expected to be part of the first. But when then all of a sudden the whole story of how El Ingenioso Hidalgo de la Mancha got himself an escudero called Sancho Panza I started seriously wondering. Then came the adventure with the windmills! Definitely 1st book! That's when I went and checked my recordings. It wasn't the book that jumped around, it was my mp3 player that played 'book 1, chapter 1', 'book 2, chapter 1', 'book 1, chapter 2', 'book 2 chapter 2' etc. So I have listened not to 11 chapters but to 22 (out of 126)! Anyway, I've come to really appreciate this book now. The contrasting language registers used in that chapter about hiring Sancho Panza is really hilarious. Well, it actually all is. And brilliantly written, too. I know why I didn't notice before: I was prejudiced because of those windmills. That chapter, found in every Spanish reader, just got on my nerves. I therefore read the book badly, like boys read poetry when they think only sissies read properly. I like the way it is recorded, the voice is expressive, changes according to the situation, without being dramatic. I've become a fan! What I wouldn't have noticed when reading, as I have a tendency to skip over such pesky details, when hearing certain forms I thought: Now wait a moment, those are future subjunctive forms. Still used in Portuguese, but dropped in Spanish, at least as far as I know. I've never heard them used. Maybe because I'm used to them, in Portuguese, I find they really add extra flavour to the telling, they sound a little quaint, but apt. And then another Portuguese peculiarity: splitting the future form in 2 and inserting the pronoun between stem and ending. Example: I'll tell you Spanish: te diré Portuguese: dir-te-ei Cervantes: dir-te-é Sometimes the placement of the pronouns is also rather portuguese-like. I'm now waiting for personal infinitives to turn up as well! Details, but interesting. I'm really glad I got hold of the wrong mp3 player that day. It is easy to listen to this book in bits because the chapters are separate stories, one doesn't have to read the lot, all 620 pages all at once, waiting to see how the plot thickens and how it all ends. The story is really so many very well presented 'tableaux', But I still hate his adventure with the windmills! GREEK: The Library Finished Book 2 chapter V The 12 labours that were supposed to be only 10. 09. The belt of Hippolyta 10. The kine (cattle) of Geryon 11. The apples of the Hesperides 12. Cerberus (taken from the nether world and carried back again). Book 2, chapter VI. Hercules wins the contest but doesn't get the prize Iole, daughter of Eurytus. Kills Iphitus, not on purpose, but in another fit of madness To cure a nasty skin disease has to be sold as slave, is bought by Omphale and serves her for three years. Story of siege and capture of Troy (the first) by Heracles and Telamon, Laomedon, king of Troy is killed, his daughter Hesione is given to Telamon as wife and she is allowed to save and take along her brother who is renamed Priam. I wonder whether the Priam, king of Troy and the Hesione I know are descendants. Suppose I'll find out in the Epitome. Either the book is getting easier, or my reading is getting better. Definitely more fluent. I still only read 4 pages a session, but now take not quite 20 minutes when in the beginning I needed nearly twice that. Could also be because it isn't like reading a telephone directory at this stage, the actors seem to be begetting fewer offspring. 1 person has voted this message useful | |
| charlmartell Super Polyglot Senior Member Portugal Joined 6242 days ago 286 posts - 298 votes Speaks: French, English, German, Luxembourgish*, Spanish, Portuguese, Russian, Dutch, Italian, Latin, Ancient Greek Studies: Mandarin, Japanese | Message 53 of 71 14 September 2008 at 12:56pm | IP Logged |
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CERVANTES: Don Quijote
Part 2, chapter 11 where they do run into some more trouble, with Las Cortes de la Muerte (travelling actors). Part 1, Chapter 12 where for a change nothing untoward happens to Don Quijote and Sancho Panza. They're actually fed and entertained and told a story. To be continued in the next chapter (of book 1). My mp3 player is adamant: same number chapter by chapter, forget about which book. ANCIENT GREEK: The Library Finished book 2, chapter 6 and half of 7. More fights, more killings and a marriage. Few unknown (unguessed) words. After the last 2 days' interesting stories a little letdown today. It should pick up again tomorrow with the end of the Hercules/Heracles story. 1 person has voted this message useful | |
| charlmartell Super Polyglot Senior Member Portugal Joined 6242 days ago 286 posts - 298 votes Speaks: French, English, German, Luxembourgish*, Spanish, Portuguese, Russian, Dutch, Italian, Latin, Ancient Greek Studies: Mandarin, Japanese | Message 54 of 71 16 September 2008 at 12:47pm | IP Logged |
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Don Quijote (2 days' reading)
Book 1 chapters 13, 14, 15, 16, 17 and 18. 13 is the continuation of the story started in 12, all about Marcela, a beautiful girl who likes the simple life and therefore plays at being a shepherdess and Grisóstomo, a nobleman who does the same, well, shepherd in his case. Grisóstomo falls madly in love with Marcela who does not reciprocate his feelings. And so he dies, of a broken heart apparently. Chapter 13 is about his friends going to bury him, his papers he wanted burnt, some of them are rescued and Chapter 14, his last words are read to the fake shepherds his friends, the real goatherds and don Quijote. A long poem about G's love for Marcela that I must confess I found difficult to listen to, not because of language, but content. I was glad when it was finally over and Marcela appeared in person. She then had a long speech about the unfairness of all those that wanted to blame her for G's death. Very good speech, though also a little on the long side, a little repetitive. Chapter 15 Instead of a quiet siesta more trouble, with some shepherds this time. Capter 16 in an inn, that Don Quijote takes for a castle. Some more trouble when at night the servant girl comes into the room where they're sleeping to keep her promise to their co-lodger and all hell is let loose, guess who's at the receiving end? Chapter 17 what happens when you don't want to pay for your lodgings Chapter 18 lots of talk and a meeting with 2 flocks of sheep taken for 2 enemy armies, which, as usual, ends in more misfortune for our heroes. Not very funny! By now don Quijote has lost most of his molar teeth (on one side at least) and Sancho the saddlebags with all of their belongings. They don't seem to have much more left to lose over the next 100 chapters! I'm getting a trifle tired of all those beatings they take. The conversations are interesting and can be great fun (when not too long-winded), but the actions are a little too bashbashbash for my taste. ANCIENT GREEK: The Library Finished chapter 7, all about what happened next to Heracles: some more bloodshed, his gory death and, now become immortal, some more begetting of children. The last page or so is a mere enumeration of what children he had by whose daughter(s). Very boring. Chapter 8 will be about his descendants. I wonder, but dread to think, what they will be up to. Why do I go on reading this? Morbid fascination? Because I'd like to find out, eventually, why this is considered good literature. Easy enough to read but the style is rather rough-edged. Some of the stories are very interesting, but mostly end in bloodshed. The Greeks were supposed to be an intellectual, artistic people, none of their early history is pointing that way. Very strange indeed. 1 person has voted this message useful | |
| charlmartell Super Polyglot Senior Member Portugal Joined 6242 days ago 286 posts - 298 votes Speaks: French, English, German, Luxembourgish*, Spanish, Portuguese, Russian, Dutch, Italian, Latin, Ancient Greek Studies: Mandarin, Japanese | Message 55 of 71 18 September 2008 at 12:31pm | IP Logged |
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DON QUIJOTE
Chapter 19 where for a change Don Quijote is not at the receiving end of blows but hands them out himself. By mistake of course, as per usual. And Sancho Panza takes a lot of food from the victims' abandoned belongings: the spoils of war. I wonder what happened to the poor corpse that they were carrying to his grave in Segovia? At the decisive moment my mp3 player shut down, low battery. The rest of the dog walk was done in silence. ANCIENT GREEK The Library Finished Book 2. Chapter 7, section 8 was just a list of the numerous sons and daughters Hercules had with numerous women. Succession must have been a nightmarish affair! Chapter 8 dealt with that and the problems faced by the Heraclids (descendants of Hercules) trying to reconquer the Peloponnese. The usual killings, willy as well as nilly, bad luck, misinterpretation of oracles etc. Let's see what book 3 is going to bring, I doubt it will be all harmony and 'love thy neigbour'. 1 person has voted this message useful | |
| charlmartell Super Polyglot Senior Member Portugal Joined 6242 days ago 286 posts - 298 votes Speaks: French, English, German, Luxembourgish*, Spanish, Portuguese, Russian, Dutch, Italian, Latin, Ancient Greek Studies: Mandarin, Japanese | Message 56 of 71 27 November 2008 at 12:17pm | IP Logged |
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Russian and Italian went well, but what happened to the rest of my TAC projects?
One very useful realisation: I'm obviously never ever going to refrain from flitting from this to that, as I found out... and it doesn't matter. I can stay sort of focused for longer if I really set my heart on it, cf Russian and Italian, both of which I'll carry over into 2009 and, surprise, surprise: El Ingenioso Hidalgo Don Quijote de la Mancha. I thought I should read him, one day, but I was very unenthusiastic about "those silly windmills". It took a grabbing hold of the wrong mp3 player one morning to get me to change my mind. I've nearly finished the 2 books, do a chapter/chapter and a half each morning and find it is a really great way of starting a day. It's perfect for listening to on an early walks because 1. there are no distractions and 2. the chapters are so many tableaux, there is no urgency about finding out "what happens next", you just appreciate them one by one. Something I have never been able to do before, I always rush through books and never stop to think about anything but the plot. I'll have to reread the book, in the correct order this time: whenever I recharged my mp3 player it jumbled the chapters up, with the result that I read the whole book like a French tiercé, 'dans le désordre'. I'll gladly re-read it because it is full of brilliant ideas, fabulously rich language (a bit antiquated which makes it all the more interesting) and very funny (except of course for the bashings and that awful duke and consort with their stupid practical jokes). I do wonder though what kids nowadays make of it as it is full of references to, not only errant knights and Spanish history, but mythology, ancient history (Greek/Roman) as well as religion (ancient gods as well as Judaism/Christianity) that are not high priority on school curricula-curiculums any longer. If somebody had told me before this TAC that I'd replace Federico García Lorca's 'Bodas de Sangre' with Don Quijote on my list of 3 books to take with me on that desert island, I would have told them they were out of their minds. Not only is it now one of the 3, it actually takes gold. ANCIENT GREEK The Library When my computer crashed I managed to rescue most of my stuff, ancient Greek unfortunately was not so lucky. I would have had to re-download both the Greek and the English versions, make a new parallel text but even then I'd be left without the lexical/morphological items I'd highlighted for future reference and possible checkup. So I decided to be content with having read half of Apollodoros' Library. Maybe the rest next year? Who knows? Japanese and Hungarian fared even worse. I'd done a lot of Hungarian parallel text work prior to the crash, thought I'd lost it all, finally found I hadn't but by then it was too late, I'd run out of steam. Hungarian ended up 'loser of the year', followed closely by Japanese. Heisig's 'Remembering the kanji' seemed like a good idea, but ... I have learnt a lot about kanji radicals/primitives/components but I need context to keep me motivated, not a lot of theory, be it ever so interesting. Making up little stories is all very nice but without proper context those stories become just as uninteresting as loose lexical items. I just can't cope with them in the long run. I got to about 800 and gave up. I do want to learn to read Japanese properly some day, but I'll just have to find a different way. I think I'll concentrate on aural/oral Japanese first, that should make learning to read easier. So I'll use only audio files next year, I've got a vast amount of those squirrelled away, ready for consumption. And that is that as far as TAC 2008 is concerned. I think I'm good and ready for tackling 2009 now. Edited by charlmartell on 27 November 2008 at 12:21pm 1 person has voted this message useful |
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