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 Language Learning Forum : General discussion |  | |
| s_allard Triglot Senior Member Canada Joined 5430 days ago 2704 posts - 5425 votes  Speaks: French*, English, Spanish Studies: Polish | Message 17 of 17 02 April 2010 at 4:21pm | IP Logged |
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Since this is one of my favourite topics, I'd like to expand a bit on the subject of the proper use of frequency lists and word lists in general. I'll restrict my remarks to Spanish, French and English, the only languages I'm familiar with. And I'll emphasize the spoken language because I believe there are fundamental differences between the spoken and written language. In this respect, I'll assume that our initial goal as learners is to attain a certain level of comfort in understanding and speaking the language. I say all of this because reading a newspaper or a novel in the chosen language is not the same as speaking the language.
That said, let's dive in. Without wanting to revisit the hoary debate of vocabulary vs grammar, I suggest that in the beginning you can't really separate the two. If vocabulary is the components, grammar is the set of rules that tell us how to connect the components properly. In my opinion, one of the greatest dangers of learning words in isolation is not learning how to use them properly in context. Instead, we end up using our native structures in the desired language, e.g. sort of like speaking English in French. Aside from the accent, this is what sets a non-native apart. Their speech is not idiomatic because it contains weird or unexpected constructions. The other real danger is not being able to distinguish between formal and informal forms. The words all look the same to us, but to native speakers certain things may be formal and literary or at the other extreme vulgar and slang. Then, of course, there may be dialectal differences that we are not aware of. As learners, we are often well too aware of our limitations and the frustration of not being able to say what we want to say--and can say well in our native tongue--in a manner that sounds right in the target language. So, there is a bit of a dilemma here. You either speak the language well or not at all. But how do you get there? I'm a great fan of sentence or phrase lists because the spoken language is full of collocations, idioms and formulaic expressions. Many conversations are grammatically quite simple. The emphasis is on the ability to keep the interaction going. This is where all those little connecting devices play such an important role. For example, if you listen to an interview in English, most people will start their answer with "well". In French, we would use "ecoutez" (sorry about the lack of accent) or, in Spanish, "mire". The words are fillers that allow us to frame our response. Phrase lists are in a sense lists of words in context. I'll focus on a certain word but also how it is really used. So, when I actually try to use the word, I start with a complete idiomatic "container" that makes my utterance sound very good. People often think I'm better than I really am. I see the value of pure word lists at more of an intermediate level where I feel quite comfortable with the grammar. At this point, I need lots of pure vocabulary and less grammatical context. I've been experimenting with some of the techniques mentioned in this forum. I like the Iversen method, but one has to experiment quite a bit. I try thematic lists such as human anatomy or parts of an automobile. Finally, I can't emphasize enough the importance of idiomatic expressions in the spoken language. They are challenging because it is not always easy to find the meaning. I remember hearing a speech of the Spanish president where he promised to "poner toda la carne en el asador" (put all the meat on the grill). It took a bit of searching for me to find out that he meant something like "give it all we've got". 5 persons have voted this message useful |
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