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Pre/Post Reunification of Germany | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Specific Languages |  | |
| Luso Hexaglot Senior Member Portugal Joined 6064 days ago 819 posts - 1812 votes  Speaks: Portuguese*, French, EnglishC2, GermanB1, Italian, Spanish Studies: Sanskrit, Arabic (classical) | Message 9 of 39 01 September 2014 at 3:03am | IP Logged | ||
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I've had a bit of experience with the DDR, and it was great. Don't worry, it's not about politics, but rather about language learning.
In 1989, I was finishing college, and it was cool to engage in activities on the side. Being in a quite upscale University, some people went mountaineering in the Alps or sailing, but most of us had to find more prosaic activities, like martial arts or surfing. Anyway, money was tight, but I wanted to learn German, and the Goethe-Institut was quite expensive. Looking at the yellow pages (pre-internet Google) I found out there was another institution offering German: a certain Herder-Institut, of Leipzig. They didn't have an office of their own in Lisbon, but used the facilities of the "Associação Portugal-RDA" (not translating that one - this is HTLAL, after all). I checked and the prices were ridiculously low. For manuals, too. The paper was brownish, but sturdy. And it was an adventure, contacting with real communists. The walls were covered with pictures of smiling blond people in bright blue athletic or swimming gear with many gold medals hanging from their necks. Some beautiful landscapes, too. We used a Tonbandgerät (no CD players), learned about Kaufhallen and addressing waiters as "Herr Ober" (lots of stuff my Goethe teachers found funny many years later). As I told you above, I began there in 1989 (I kid you not). Since they must have been heavily subsidised before that, they were not self-sufficient, and everyone knew time was running out. At the end of the school year, they said goodbye and closed forever. I still think it was one of the most interesting experiences of my life. Edited by Luso on 01 September 2014 at 3:31am 5 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| soclydeza85 Senior Member United States Joined 3910 days ago 357 posts - 502 votes Speaks: English* Studies: German, French | Message 10 of 39 03 September 2014 at 2:24am | IP Logged | ||
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Thanks for all of the replies guys, they were all very enlightening; it gives me more of a broad perspective on the whole situation.
1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| fnord Triglot Groupie Switzerland Joined 5036 days ago 71 posts - 124 votes Speaks: German*, Swiss-German, English Studies: Luxembourgish, Dutch | Message 11 of 39 03 September 2014 at 8:55pm | IP Logged | ||
Eastern cities regularly astonish me with (the state and looks of) their public spaces and infrastructure. More often than not, they look much neater and more “polished” to me. Western ones of comparable size & makeup often have “drab”, if not downright derelict, look to them. This is especially striking in economically weak regions (take Rhine/Ruhr, for instance). Train stations and surroundings are a great example, though I, as a heavy rail traveler, might of course be somewhat biased… I feel that the sentiments echoed here have greatly diminished in the last few years and in younger generations. Looking at people under, say, 35 (i.e. pre-high schoolers in 1990 when Germany was reunited), I can hardly imagine anyone under say wishing back the DDR - nor have I sensed any genuine anymosity between young "Wessis" and "Ossis". Though that's certainly a little bit different amongst some older people. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| montmorency Diglot Senior Member United Kingdom Joined 4831 days ago 2371 posts - 3676 votes Speaks: English*, German Studies: Danish, Welsh | Message 12 of 39 06 September 2014 at 1:30am | IP Logged | ||
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I thought that technically, you were still supposed to call a waiter "Herr Ober". What
other expression would you use? Some films that explore (to some extent) "Ostalgie" are "Goodbye Lenin", and "Sonnenallee". Although I'm an outsider, and my study of the subject is necessarily somewhat superficial, and my knowledge of German still far from really adequate for the task, I've begun to get a feel for what it may be like for those who lived in the old east, and live there now, now that it has been (to some extent) westernised. It's not as black and white as some may imagine. Not everything thing in the western capitalist garden was (is) lovely. Not everything in the DDR was evil and hateful. And it's not as though the DDR replaced a smooth-running democracy: the DDR replaced 12 years of a brutal dictatorship, culminating in a catastrophic war. By comparison, almost anything would have seemed preferable, at least in the early days. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| BAnna Triglot Senior Member United States Joined 4625 days ago 409 posts - 616 votes Speaks: English*, German, Spanish Studies: Russian, Turkish | Message 13 of 39 06 September 2014 at 1:39am | IP Logged | ||
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A former classmate of mine has a cool blog about classic East German movies, if anyone's interested (in English):
East German Cinema Blog 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| daegga Tetraglot Senior Member Austria lang-8.com/553301 Joined 4524 days ago 1076 posts - 1792 votes Speaks: German*, EnglishC2, Swedish, Norwegian Studies: Danish, French, Finnish, Icelandic | Message 14 of 39 06 September 2014 at 1:55am | IP Logged | ||
You don't call him. Just give him a sign by nodding or raising a finger or so to get his attention when he looks your way. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| fnord Triglot Groupie Switzerland Joined 5036 days ago 71 posts - 124 votes Speaks: German*, Swiss-German, English Studies: Luxembourgish, Dutch | Message 15 of 39 06 September 2014 at 1:21pm | IP Logged | ||
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Getting a waiter's attention is preferably done by making eye contact, or (subtly!) raising a finger or a hand. Verbally, “Entschuldigung" / "Entschuldigen Sie!" will do. http://www.dw.de/herr-ober-zahlen-bitte/a-17258911 "Herr Ober" is still generally understood but archaic. It would probably be considered a bit inappropriate today. While I think that's true for Germany (and, by extension Belgium) and Switzerland. I really don't know about Austria, which might be different in that regard. Wikipedia at least notes the phrase as common. The Austrians, of course, are known for having a penchant for addressing people by job/academic title. I would address any sales or service personnel solely with “Sie”. Or, if appropriate, with “Du”, though the latter is highly informal and will probably be restricted among younger people (some companies seem to make a deliberate point of it though, e.g. IKEA, Apple…). Edited by fnord on 06 September 2014 at 1:43pm 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Cavesa Triglot Senior Member Czech Republic Joined 5012 days ago 3277 posts - 6779 votes Speaks: Czech*, FrenchC2, EnglishC1 Studies: Spanish, German, Italian | Message 16 of 39 06 September 2014 at 1:45pm | IP Logged | ||
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I quite agree with fnord and montmorency. Nothing is perfect in any regime and communism was seen as better than the nacism (which is one of the reasons it got so much power in Europe) but noone with half brain under 35 would want such a dictatorship back.
Still cultural comments, sorry if something might be seen as politics discussion: I highly doubt there was little envy. In Czechoslovakia, noone had "too much" as well and the only result was that the envy was sparked by much smaller things (a vinyl or a pair of shoes brought from abroad etc.). I highly doubt East Germany was so different in this aspect, the standards of living there and here were pretty much the same, from what I've heard from my family members or watched and read. Yes, I am young and cannot remember myself but I can see the residuals of what the forty years did to people's minds. And I think the Germans are very lucky to have had the opportunity to mix with a normal country despite all its mistakes. I cannot tell about Germany as a whole but the differences between fromer western Berlin and the eastern parts is still breathtaking in most places, in my opinion. Heavy accent on industrialism, esthetics of huge and breathtaking buildings and streets which must have been so uncomfortable to live in and their much poorer counterparts dealing with huge demand for new homes. Lack of green in the streets (or at least much lesser amounts compared to the western quarters), which is something difficult to add to an already built quarter. And I didn't find the eastern parts neat at all, truth be told. Yes, the central european countries were totally unprepared for the change in many ways and I believe Eastern Germany had it even harder in some aspects as the experienced Western badguys were ready to abuse the situation. However, the badguys are the first to learn anywhere and it was a mistake the government let it happen. And the egalitarism some people praise so much to give their vote to a successor party to the communists wasn't so true. In general, everyone was poor in comparison with the capitalist countries. But there were huge differences between party members and non members and so on. Eastern Germans may have had a little bit higher living standard but I doubt they were the saints among the socialist countries. Yes, there are people longing for the old times but they are usually 1.old 2.badly educated 3.with low IQ 4.unable of responsibility 5.were lucky in the old times not to know how all the communist regimes treated the seriously ill, the handicaped, those whose family members fled the country and so on. So, I would totally understand people from Western Germany to consider the past better than the present. But I don't believe anyone worth listening to will have fond memories of life under a dictature. p.s. the note about what kind of people misses the old times and votes communists isn't some hateful idea of mine, it is the result of every informative statistics before/during/after elections. They are not totally precise as they are gathered from just a sample of volunteer respondends but still pretty clear. Edited by Cavesa on 06 September 2014 at 1:48pm 3 persons have voted this message useful |
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