|
 |
German: nicht vs. kein | ||
Share with:
| ||
 Language Learning Forum : Specific Languages |  | |
| arkady Bilingual Diglot Groupie United States rightconditi Joined 5399 days ago 54 posts - 61 votes  Speaks: English*, Russian* Studies: German | Message 1 of 14 15 February 2010 at 4:01pm | IP Logged | ||
|
Hallo!
I got another one for you. I can't seem to understand why one would use kein vs. nicht 100% of the time, although I am sensing kein = 'not a', while nicht = 'not'. Still, this does not explain this situation. Ich bin kein Deutsch. (I am not German.) I would be tempted to say: Ich bin nicht Deutsch. However the Pimsleur lesson is using 'kein' and I have no idea why. Meanwhile they insist on: Ich verstehe nicht Deutsche What is the difference? Edited by arkady on 15 February 2010 at 4:01pm 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| ellasevia Super Polyglot Winner TAC 2011 Senior Member Germany Joined 6141 days ago 2150 posts - 3229 votes Speaks: English*, German, Croatian, Greek, French, Spanish, Russian, Swedish, Portuguese, Turkish, Italian Studies: Catalan, Persian, Mandarin, Japanese, Romanian, Ukrainian | Message 2 of 14 15 February 2010 at 6:11pm | IP Logged | ||
|
Okay, I'm not very advanced in German yet, but I think I understand the difference well enough to give you a coherent explanation. Here it goes...
So, for your example with "I am not German," it uses kein because it's really saying "I am NO German (person)." You would use the same construction for any nationality or profession. For example, you could say Du bist keine Krankschwester (You are NO nurse). For your second example, I don't believe that is correct as it is written (remember, though, I'm no expert!). I would have written it in one of two ways, but probably the first: Ich verstehe kein Deutsch. (I understand NO German.) Ich verstehe nicht die Deutsche Sprache. (I don't understand the German language.) So, in general, I think kein is used when you are making a noun negative, but nicht is used when making a verb negative. Here are some more examples: Sie ist kein Junge. (She is NO boy.) Der Baum ist nicht rot. (The tree is not red.) Ich habe keine Zeit. (I have NO time.) Wir essen nicht. (We aren't eating.) Das Zimmer war nicht dunkel. (The room wasn't dark.) I hope that this helps! 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
 Fasulye Heptaglot Winner TAC 2012 Moderator Germany fasulyespolyglotblog Joined 5846 days ago 5460 posts - 6006 votes 1 sounds Speaks: German*, DutchC1, EnglishB2, French, Italian, Spanish, Esperanto Studies: Latin, Danish, Norwegian, Turkish Personal Language Map | Message 3 of 14 15 February 2010 at 6:17pm | IP Logged | ||
|
kein = nicht ein (m. n.)
keine = nicht eine (f.) Examples: Es ist kein Hund draußen. = Es ist nicht ein Hund draußen. (There is no dog outside.) Meine Freundin hat keine Tochter. = Meine Freundin hat nicht eine Tochter. (My friend has no daughter.) So if you can subtitute with "nicht ein, nicht eine", you should use "kein" or "keine". Perhaps this simple rule helps? Fasulye 3 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| Bao Diglot Senior Member Germany tinyurl.com/pe4kqe5 Joined 5765 days ago 2256 posts - 4046 votes Speaks: German*, English Studies: French, Spanish, Japanese, Mandarin | Message 4 of 14 15 February 2010 at 6:53pm | IP Logged | ||
|
Honestly, "Ich verstehe nicht Deutsche" doesn't work because that would be "I don't understand Germans (people!)" with a wrong word order. "Ich verstehe nicht Deutsch" also sounds really strange to my ears, especially as the word order is wrong ...
"Ich verstehe kein Deutsch" would be one of the natural ways to express "I don't know any German", though the most natural way to say this is "Ich kann kein Deutsch." Just for your information. Now, I think that the difference between kein and nicht might actually be something like whether it's permanent or temporary or whether it's general or specific. Here are some rules. 2 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| arkady Bilingual Diglot Groupie United States rightconditi Joined 5399 days ago 54 posts - 61 votes Speaks: English*, Russian* Studies: German | Message 5 of 14 15 February 2010 at 7:26pm | IP Logged | ||
|
Thank you kind folks, that makes more sense. I wonder if it's just my memory or did Pimsleur just use a bad example. Hard to believe they would screw something like that.
1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Sprachprofi Nonaglot Senior Member Germany learnlangs.comRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 6469 days ago 2608 posts - 4866 votes Speaks: German*, English, French, Esperanto, Greek, Mandarin, Latin, Dutch, Italian Studies: Spanish, Arabic (Written), Swahili, Indonesian, Japanese, Modern Hebrew, Portuguese | Message 6 of 14 15 February 2010 at 8:47pm | IP Logged | ||
|
Note: it should be "Ich bin kein Deutscher" (if you're a man) or "Ich bin keine
Deutsche". Simply "Deutsch" is not correct in this sentence. Then, there are two different ways of saying you don't understand German: "Ich verstehe Deutsch nicht" = I don't understand German. (maybe just a little) "Ich verstehe kein Deutsch" = I don't understand ANY German. Ellasevia said it right that "nicht" negates the entire sentence while "kein" negates the object alone. Another example: "Ich gehe nicht ins Kino." = I'm not going to the cinema. (maybe I'm doing something else right now) "Ich gehe in kein Kino." = I don't step into any cinema. (I have a strong personal aversion to cinemas) 8 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| IronFist Senior Member United States Joined 6436 days ago 663 posts - 941 votes Speaks: English* Studies: Japanese, Korean | Message 7 of 14 15 February 2010 at 10:19pm | IP Logged | ||
|
I remember seeing a picture in my German book in school that had a fountain and there was a sign on it that said "Kein Trinkwasser" (lit. "no drinking-water" but means "this is not drinking water")
I remember thinking it was weird cuz that sounded like "no drinking-water" which doesn't make sense in English. I just figured the "Kein" was for emphasis. Like "(this is) NOT drinking-water." 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| arkady Bilingual Diglot Groupie United States rightconditi Joined 5399 days ago 54 posts - 61 votes Speaks: English*, Russian* Studies: German | Message 8 of 14 16 February 2010 at 1:20am | IP Logged | ||
So is nicht more directive to the issue at hand while kein is a more abstract negation? I am especially amused by this explanation: "Ich verstehe Deutsch nicht" = I don't understand German. (maybe just a little) "Ich verstehe kein Deutsch" = I don't understand ANY German. One would think according to the lessons provided taht the two phrases are identical, but they are very different. How would you say I am not doing well? Es ghet mir nicht gut? or Es ghet mir kein gut? According to your explanation the latter would not work, but could it somehow? 1 person has voted this message useful |
|  | 
Printable version
|
| Copyright 2024 FX Micheloud - All rights reserved No part of this website may be copied by any means without my written authorization. |
