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Norwegian Pitch Accent | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Questions About Your Target Languages |  | |
| Cainntear Pentaglot Senior Member Scotland linguafrankly.blogsp Joined 6009 days ago 4399 posts - 7687 votes  Speaks: Lowland Scots, English*, French, Spanish, Scottish Gaelic Studies: Catalan, Italian, German, Irish, Welsh | Message 17 of 42 10 June 2011 at 12:12pm | IP Logged | |||||
Context is a cowardly traitor. Context often makes precision unnecessary, which means context doesn't encourage precision. If you want to learn a language well, you've got to learn it properly, and that means not relying on context. 3 persons have voted this message useful | ||||||
| Ari Heptaglot Senior Member Norway Joined 6580 days ago 2314 posts - 5695 votes Speaks: Swedish*, English, French, Spanish, Portuguese, Mandarin, Cantonese Studies: Czech, Latin, German | Message 18 of 42 10 June 2011 at 1:06pm | IP Logged | |||||
But what about the puns? The same distinction of "tanken" exists in Swedish and I regularly use it (probably too often) to make a cynical pun by using the common saying "Det är tanken som räknas" ("It's the thought that counts") by switching the tone to make it mean "It's the tank that counts" when discussing politics. Puns are the sprinkles on the ice cream that is language. 2 persons have voted this message useful | ||||||
| hrhenry Octoglot Senior Member United States languagehopper.blogs Joined 5128 days ago 1871 posts - 3642 votes Speaks: English*, SpanishC2, ItalianC2, Norwegian, Catalan, Galician, Turkish, Portuguese Studies: Polish, Indonesian, Ojibwe | Message 19 of 42 10 June 2011 at 4:09pm | IP Logged | |||||
Define "precision" and "well" and "properly" for a language that can use pitch accent, but is not necessary within the Norwegian spectrum of speech as evidenced by various dialects. Because one dialect of the same language doesn't use pitch accent, that doesn't mean it's less precise or proper. R. == 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| tractor Tetraglot Senior Member Norway Joined 5451 days ago 1349 posts - 2292 votes Speaks: Norwegian*, English, Spanish, Catalan Studies: French, German, Latin | Message 20 of 42 10 June 2011 at 5:33pm | IP Logged | |||||
That pun doesn't work too well in Norwegian anyway. While tanke (= thought) and tank (= container) are pronounced with a Norwegian a [a], tank (= armoured vehicle) is usually pronounced with an English a [æ]. Besides, some one-syllable English loanwords tend to be used with the English plural -s in Norwegian even when used as a singular noun, and tank, meaning 'armoured vehicle' is one of those words. Thus, "it's the tanks that counts" would be det er tanksen som teller instead of det er tanken som teller (different pitch, different vowel ([æ] vs. [a]) and an additional consonant (-s-)). Edited by tractor on 10 June 2011 at 5:38pm 4 persons have voted this message useful | ||||||
| Cainntear Pentaglot Senior Member Scotland linguafrankly.blogsp Joined 6009 days ago 4399 posts - 7687 votes Speaks: Lowland Scots, English*, French, Spanish, Scottish Gaelic Studies: Catalan, Italian, German, Irish, Welsh | Message 21 of 42 10 June 2011 at 6:46pm | IP Logged | |||||
I completely agree. I wasn't arguing that learning pitch is necessary for learning Norwegian. All I was saying is that it is a bad ideas to ignore something - anything - in a language simply because context can fill in the gaps. 2 persons have voted this message useful | ||||||
| Ari Heptaglot Senior Member Norway Joined 6580 days ago 2314 posts - 5695 votes Speaks: Swedish*, English, French, Spanish, Portuguese, Mandarin, Cantonese Studies: Czech, Latin, German | Message 22 of 42 10 June 2011 at 9:30pm | IP Logged | |||||
Interesting! Thanks for sharing. Have a vote! 2 persons have voted this message useful | ||||||
| Aquila123 Tetraglot Senior Member Norway mydeltapi.com Joined 5304 days ago 201 posts - 262 votes Speaks: Norwegian*, English, Italian, Spanish Studies: Finnish, Russian | Message 23 of 42 21 June 2011 at 4:38pm | IP Logged | |||||
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The differnce between the tunes are like this in standard Norwegian:
Tune 1 - the accented syllable hava a low or law rising tune Tune 2 - the accented syllable have a falling tune In both cases an unaccented syllable have a high tune. Tunes in verbs are mostly like this: All monosyllabic forms have tune 1 The present tense of strong verbs have tune one The present tense of weak verbs have tune 2 if disyllabic Other disyllabic forms have tune 2 -------------------------------------- But there are some complications of which one is: When monosyllabic verb forms are followed by a monosyllabic adverb, you will often pronounce the combination as a disyllabic word with tune 2. Example Gå ut - go out: Usually pronounced like gåut(2). Edited by Aquila123 on 21 June 2011 at 10:40pm 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| Camundonguinho Triglot Senior Member Brazil Joined 4747 days ago 273 posts - 500 votes Speaks: Portuguese*, English, Spanish Studies: Swedish | Message 24 of 42 25 May 2012 at 4:21pm | IP Logged | |||||
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In dialects it's easier, for example in Tromsø dialect,
all monosyllable verb forms have tone 1, and all 2-syllable verb forms have tone 2: to throw å kaste - kaste - kasta- ha kasta (all pronounced with the tone 2, which is LHL in this dialect) (source: An introduction to Norwegian dialects, by Olaf Husby; Tapari akademisk forlag) When people from Southern, Western and Northern Norway read a text in Bokmaal aloud, they do not copy the Oslo-style tones, rhythm and accent, but keep the tones from their own dialect. People who strive too much to put on Eastern tones (some journalists) end up sounding flat (because tones in low tone dialects and tones in high tone dialects have completely opposite vocal shapes, and are neutralized in this way: high tone dialects (Northern, Western, Southern Norway): tone 1: HL; tone 2: LHL Sentences are usually spoken with a falling intonation (as in English) low tone dialects (Eastern and Central Norway (Trondheim)): tone1: LH; tone: 2: HLH Sentences are usually spoken with a rising intonation (''uptalk'') (Uptalk in English: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High_rising_terminal) ''In the United States, the phenomenon of HRT may be fairly recent but is an increasingly common characteristic of speech especially among younger speakers (see Ching, 1982 for one of the few accounts of HRT in American English). However, serious scientific/linguistic inquiry on this topic has a much more extensive history in linguistic journals from Australia, New Zealand, and Britain where HRT seems to have been noted as early as World War II. It has been noted in speech heard in areas of Canada, in Cape Town, the Falkland Islands, and in the United States where it is often associated with a particular sociolect that originated among affluent teenage girls in Southern California (see Valleyspeak and Valley girl). Elsewhere in the United States, this intonation is characteristic of the speech heard in those parts of rural North Dakota and Minnesota that through migration have come under the influence of the Norwegian language.'') Edited by Camundonguinho on 25 May 2012 at 4:34pm 2 persons have voted this message useful |
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