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The Norwegian of Romance Languages? | ||
Tags: Romance Languages | Norwegian | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Specific Languages |  | |
| GRagazzo Diglot Senior Member United States Joined 4951 days ago 115 posts - 168 votes  Speaks: Italian, English* Studies: Spanish, Swedish, French | Message 25 of 41 05 January 2013 at 9:35pm | IP Logged | |||||
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Well since there does not seem to be a natural language which fits the description I
think Interlingua would be a pretty good middle language. From my experience I've been able to understand nearly all of it with my Spanish and Italian. But I don't think someone who speaks Interlingua would be able to understand other romance speakers. 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| tractor Tetraglot Senior Member Norway Joined 5443 days ago 1349 posts - 2292 votes Speaks: Norwegian*, English, Spanish, Catalan Studies: French, German, Latin | Message 26 of 41 06 January 2013 at 12:31am | IP Logged | |||||
Possibly, since the grammar is simplified in Danish/Swedish/Norwegian. By the way, Danish is a compulsory subject in Icelandic schools. 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
 jeff_lindqvist Diglot Moderator SwedenRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 6899 days ago 4250 posts - 5711 votes Speaks: Swedish*, English Studies: German, Spanish, Russian, Dutch, Mandarin, Esperanto, Irish, French Personal Language Map | Message 27 of 41 06 January 2013 at 12:33am | IP Logged | |||||
In that respect, I think Latin should be really helpful; like revealing a blueprint of the Romance languages. And perhaps Icelandic could give the avid student a similar feeling (similarly, Sanskrit to speakers of Hindi and so on...).
Just guessing, but I assume that the average native speaker of Icelandic has had more exposure to Da/No/(Sw) than the other way around, and exposure usually helps. Danish is even taught in school in Iceland. Even if we here in Sweden get the occasional movie or TV series in Icelandic, that doesn't help anyone but the hardcore student. By the way, I just came to think of the learning sequence which Professor Arguelles once suggested: Spanish, French, Italian and German. 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| Camundonguinho Triglot Senior Member Brazil Joined 4739 days ago 273 posts - 500 votes Speaks: Portuguese*, English, Spanish Studies: Swedish | Message 28 of 41 07 January 2013 at 7:21am | IP Logged | |||||
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The question is not well-formed, since we need to know what kind of Norwegian we're talking about. (Sissel Kyrkjebø's pensbergensk dialect is closer to Danish language than to Tone Damle's Sogndialect, which is closer to Swedish than to Danish...And it's funny but Sissel is more focused on Denmark, while Tone is on Sweden, collaborating with E. Saade ; ) ).
I'm learning Standard Vestnorsk (aka Nynorsk) and it's more similar to Swedish than to written moderate Bokmaal (which is like an embelished Danish). The main reason Norwegian children outside Oslo can understand Swedish is: they're forced to learn Nynorsk as their 2nd written standard (and have to deal with Ingvild Bryn and other Nynorsk newscasters on NRK ;) ). And sometimes the differences Norwegian dialects can be even greater than the difference between one Norwegian dialect and the Swedish language. So, Norwegians are eager to open their ears (and minds) more, to facilite the communication. (One more thing...Most Norwegians dialects are ''clear'', only in and around Trondheim the pronunciation gets really muffled). As for Spanish: most of Spaniards can't understand their neighbors (news programs from RTP or TF1 are impossible for them to follow with ease, unless they studied French or Portuguese). The understanding-of-the-spoken-language chain goes like this: Continental Portuguese>Brazilian Portuguese>Galician>Spanish>Valencian>Italian (French, Romanian and Catalan are difficult to put in this chain; Catalan and French because of their phonetics; Romanian and French because of grammar and lexicon). The most difficult is for Italians to understand spoken continental Portuguese. (let's use the language style used in soap operas as a test) The easiest to understand for those from Portugal: Brazilian Portuguese, Galician, Spanish, Valencian, and Italian. In Brazil, many people struggle with Continental Portuguese spoken in allegro-style (soap operas, movies) [although two written standards of Portuguese are like moderate Bokmaal and Danish, the pronunciation difference is similar to the one between NRK Bokmaal West Oslo accent and standard Danish pronunciation; Portuguese people, even actors in Portuguese movies and soap operas are difficult to understand because they have ''bad'' diction /bad as muffled/). That's why soap operas from Portugal (Morangos com açúcar and Olá Pai) had to be dubbed into Brazilian Portuguese before they could be shown on Brazilian BAND TV. Everytime there's a Portuguese actor in a Brazilian soap opera, the producers make sure (s)he gets some accent coaching, (s)he has to speak slowly, and pronounce everything in a way (s)he can be understood by Brazilians. They end up having some kind of inexistent transatlantic Portuguese accent. If we add Cape Verdean Creole: Cape Verdean Creole>Continental Portuguese>Brazilian Portuguese>Galician>Spanish>Valencian>Italian (All speakers of Cape Verdean Creole learn Continental Portuguese, because it's the official language in Cape Verde. On the other hand speakers of Portuguese outside Cape Verde and Guiné Bissau can't understand it: it's a mix of 16th century Portuguese and Bantu languages). Edited by Camundonguinho on 07 January 2013 at 8:07am 4 persons have voted this message useful | ||||||
| tarvos Super Polyglot Winner TAC 2012 Senior Member China likeapolyglot.wordpr Joined 4697 days ago 5310 posts - 9399 votes Speaks: Dutch*, English, Swedish, French, Russian, German, Italian, Norwegian, Mandarin, Romanian, Afrikaans Studies: Greek, Modern Hebrew, Spanish, Portuguese, Czech, Korean, Esperanto, Finnish | Message 29 of 41 07 January 2013 at 2:02pm | IP Logged | |||||
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What you mean is, in Portugal you eat your vowels more.
1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| Serpent Octoglot Senior Member Russian Federation serpent-849.livejour Joined 6587 days ago 9753 posts - 15779 votes 4 sounds Speaks: Russian*, English, FinnishC1, Latin, German, Italian, Spanish, Portuguese Studies: Danish, Romanian, Polish, Belarusian, Ukrainian, Croatian, Slovenian, Catalan, Czech, Galician, Dutch, Swedish | Message 30 of 41 08 January 2013 at 5:01am | IP Logged | |||||
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| Donaldshimoda Diglot Groupie Italy Joined 4080 days ago 47 posts - 72 votes Speaks: Italian*, English Studies: German, Russian | Message 31 of 41 08 September 2014 at 3:10pm | IP Logged | |||||
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my 2 cents....As Italian I can say Spanish and french are VERY easy to understand in
their written form, while portuguese is a little bit harder to the point we probably just get the main idea out of a medium-complex text, nothing more. Regarding oral comprehension Spanish is still quite easy if not spoken at speed of light while french starts becoming tricky and portuguese even more. that said, what I think could be eligible for the "norwegian of romance languages" title is rumenian. Even if I don't speak it at all, yesterday I had an interesting conversation with my father's wife (she's from Romania)about this. It turned out, besides their well known ability to learn languages that she can (without prior studies)understand quite easily spanish portuguese and french other than Italian, not saying some russian... She told me a huge amount of vocabulary originate from latin plus they have lots of words directly borrowed from french and many others come from slavic languages...oh and yes huge russian influence.... so I guess their language could really be the link among all the others.. 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
 Iversen Super Polyglot Moderator Denmark berejst.dk Joined 6693 days ago 9078 posts - 16473 votes Speaks: Danish*, French, English, German, Italian, Spanish, Portuguese, Dutch, Swedish, Esperanto, Romanian, Catalan Studies: Afrikaans, Greek, Norwegian, Russian, Serbian, Icelandic, Latin, Irish, Lowland Scots, Indonesian, Polish, Croatian Personal Language Map | Message 32 of 41 08 September 2014 at 5:14pm | IP Logged | |||||
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I have always compared the Scandinavian languages to the Iberoromance languages: Spanish reminds me of Swedish because of the lisp, Catalan has some of the Norwegian edginess and (European) Portuguese is almost as slurred as Danish. Icelandic? Well, not quite as far away as Latin, but something in that direction. Maybe Icelandic would be sitting as a vigorous old grandma in the boathouse, but then Latin would be living in the local nursery home.
Among the remaining Romance languages Italian is fairly close to the three languages on the Iberian peninsula, but the direct links - Occitan and the old dialects of Northern Italy - have been weakened, and instead French has conquered the territory down to the Mediterranian. And French is definitely further away from the other languages I have mentioned so far. As for Romanian I wouldn't exactly see it as a link - rather like a distant cousin with some peculiar mannerisms. The link between Romanian and Italian was broken when Dalmatian died out, and the large influx of French loanwords can't change the general picture. After all loanwords alone don't make a language useful as a ridge or link. If that was so Russian would be a suitable link to the Germanic languages because it has so many German loanwords. And speaking about the Germanic languages: the Scandinavian languages (except Icelandic) form one closely knit group, and Dutch, Afrikaans and Low German also form a distinct group (the Ingwäonian group). But English has been sailing alone around on the open seas with a container full of loanwords since it was shocked almost to death by Guillaume le Bâtard and his bastards in 1066. All in all the span of the Germanic languages is probably larger than that of the Romance languages, but even the Romance languages are quite diverse, and I can't see any single language in the group that could be used as a common denominator for all the others. If I had to choose one 'bridge' language without looking at population sizes then Catalan would probably be the best candidate - but it couldn't play the same role as Norwegian can among the three insular Scandinavian languages. Edited by Iversen on 08 September 2014 at 5:23pm 3 persons have voted this message useful |
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