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Learning a "Useless" Language? | ||
Tags: Choosing a Language | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Learning Techniques, Methods & Strategies |  | |
| tarvos Super Polyglot Winner TAC 2012 Senior Member China likeapolyglot.wordpr Joined 4650 days ago 5310 posts - 9399 votes  Speaks: Dutch*, English, Swedish, French, Russian, German, Italian, Norwegian, Mandarin, Romanian, Afrikaans Studies: Greek, Modern Hebrew, Spanish, Portuguese, Czech, Korean, Esperanto, Finnish | Message 9 of 23 20 February 2014 at 2:17pm | IP Logged | ||
I don't, but the grounds are not linguistic (I think the bonus you would get in terms of vocabulary is minimal, but maybe you will learn some grammarese). What will help you is the experience of learning a language in general (and then it can be Lithuanian or Uyghur or Hausa), and that will teach you how to learn the next once (whether that is French or Mandarin). But then Lithuanian is an arbitrary choice, so I agree that the choice for Lithuanian should be made on factors beside linguistic and personal growth aspects - namely, what interests you in Lithuanian? Otherwise you could learn French or Esperanto or Mandarin and get the same experience, but it would be an easier process in terms of materials. 3 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| leroc Senior Member United States Joined 4254 days ago 114 posts - 167 votes Speaks: English* Studies: German | Message 10 of 23 20 February 2014 at 2:33pm | IP Logged | ||
Lithuanian will give you a very large advantage in learning a specific IE language.. Latvian! 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Ogrim Heptaglot Senior Member France Joined 4582 days ago 991 posts - 1896 votes Speaks: Norwegian*, English, Spanish, French, Romansh, German, Italian Studies: Russian, Catalan, Latin, Greek, Romanian | Message 11 of 23 20 February 2014 at 3:05pm | IP Logged | ||
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tarvos, I did not see your post before posting my own, so it was not meant in reply to you, but to the OP. I of course agree with you that the experience of learning a language is in itself useful for learning a second or third or fourth language. I also think that learning a highly inflected language like Lithuanian (or Latin for that matter) will be more useful than learning e.g. French if you want to go for another inflected language like Russian, . What I question is the idea that learning Lithuanian in this case will give you an advantage for learning both Russian and German and Italian etc.
to leroc: Obviously, Latvian being of the same branch, that might be true, although as far as I know they are not mutually intelligible. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Lykeio Senior Member United Kingdom Joined 4187 days ago 120 posts - 357 votes | Message 12 of 23 20 February 2014 at 3:14pm | IP Logged | ||
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God damn it. As an actual Philologist this idiocy gets me so mad I will happily punch
someone in the face. I'm serious, I'll break someone's teeth for this idiocy. Serpent is, as so often, correct in stating it is an urban myth. It is unfortunately also one which people whole heartedly fall into. Meillet, otherwise a genius but a century out of date, once made some remark about Lithuanian peasants and people have not stfu since. It's also something that Lithuanians (understandably) endorse whole heartedly. The introductions to TYS and Colloquial Lithuanian are full of assinine inanities about how Lithuanian is a very ancient language (aren't all?) highly conservative (not really) that's its useful for PIEists (technically all languages are, Lithuanian is hardly exceptionally important and certainly not with the likes of Indo- Iranian or Greek etc). This is annoying as all hell. It possesses rather conservative o-stem nouns though it has lost the PIE genitive. It retains elements of a pitch accent as do all Baltic languages but do not assume direct equivalence. That is it. The verbal system, syntax and lexicon are highly innovative. Seriously its ok to point out the odd word like "sunnus" but for every one such there are a myriad more newer ones. There is a reason why handbooks devout scant pages to Lithuanian (as it is, as part of the wider Slavo-Baltic family, not on its own) now. There are reasons why my handouts are chock full of Greek and Latin and Sanskrit and Anatolian but hardly ever Lithuanian outside of some occasional curiosities. I think Old Irish comes up way more, even. Stop. Spreading. This. Crap. As for helping with other PIE languages, can you read Luvian? can you read Tocharian? You're an English speaker, it should be a breeze. Oh, rather that's not the case is it? Its almost as if these labels mean nothing to your average language learner. We can easily learn other European languages because we occupy the same sprachbund and have a shared history - look at how all European higher registers are dominated by Latin. That's what matters more than familial reconstruction. Now, since no one else has learnt Lithuanian I'm going to actually offer a very good book recommendation. There is a book called either "Beginner's Lithuanian" or "Modern Lithuanian" depending on printing by Leonardas Dambriunas. It is chock full of pseudo- historical idiocies where linguistics is concerned. It is also a phenomenal book. It presents a dialogue and then grammar and then exercises for 40 lessons. After that you can move onto native materials. I had to read Harry Potter and Twilight and stuff. But there are some nice intermediate textbooks written in Lithuanian. As for utility. Don't expect it to be "useful" for comp phil. Utility is what you make of it. I've Lithuanian neighbours, charming old people, and I enjoy partaking tea and chilling with them. 17 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| Chung Diglot Senior Member Joined 7099 days ago 4228 posts - 8259 votes 20 sounds Speaks: English*, French Studies: Polish, Slovak, Uzbek, Turkish, Korean, Finnish | Message 13 of 23 20 February 2014 at 6:04pm | IP Logged | ||
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Amen. This urban myth just won't die!
See also: Lithuanian and Sanskrit Popular misconceptions about languages? 9 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| Serpent Octoglot Senior Member Russian Federation serpent-849.livejour Joined 6540 days ago 9753 posts - 15779 votes 4 sounds Speaks: Russian*, English, FinnishC1, Latin, German, Italian, Spanish, Portuguese Studies: Danish, Romanian, Polish, Belarusian, Ukrainian, Croatian, Slovenian, Catalan, Czech, Galician, Dutch, Swedish | Message 14 of 23 20 February 2014 at 7:41pm | IP Logged | ||
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Also note how the original claim was about what PIE *sounded* like. Esperanto sounds like Italian or Spanish to someone who's only vaguely familiar with these languages. It's often very specific things that create such an impression - for example using la as an article or having nouns that end in -s.
2 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| Qaanaaq Newbie United States Joined 4067 days ago 14 posts - 25 votes Speaks: English* | Message 15 of 23 21 February 2014 at 1:04am | IP Logged | ||
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Thanks for all the thorough replies.
There seems to be a dearth of language learning materials when it comes to Lithuanian. I'm currently using the Teach Yourself course, and I find it dreadful. Lykeio, I'm curious as to how advanced you got in your studies of Lithuanian and why you chose to study it in the first place. Edited by Qaanaaq on 21 February 2014 at 1:04am 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| xMachiavelli Newbie United States Joined 4135 days ago 7 posts - 22 votes Studies: Russian | Message 16 of 23 09 March 2014 at 6:58am | IP Logged | ||
I saw linguistically your question has been addressed repeatedly here, and people ask why you want to learn this particular language. I will go off on a bit of an irrelevant, personal tangent to hopefully provide a unique perspective for you in regards to this question. I am a history major, and the number one question I have gotten is 'what do you plan to do with it?' I also hear 'that is not a very useful degree', and some even call it a 'useless degree' entirely. The people who say this, not surprisingly, are not history majors or know many history majors or know what any history majors do. So how can they say it is useless? Did you know intelligence agencies like the CIA employ history majors to be analysts because when things happen like the situation in Ukraine, a select few people know the history there? That is applicable to any region in the world. And yes, I have worked for the government for the last four years and I am intending to now write a novel on the side using the skills I have obtained from... you guessed it! My useless degree! In the same sense I do not know anyone that speaks Lithuanian personally, I know nothing about Lithuania, I know nothing of the language either. So what position am I in to judge the usefulness of this particular language to you? Maybe you can go there and see if you could provide a service they are not aware of that you are because of where you're from(like how VK was brought to Russia based off Facebook), maybe you could write a unique story yourself through some creative inspiration that comes from studying Lithuanian culture and tradition, maybe you could write a unique blog with pictures detailing a trip across this unique country. The possibilities for anything are limitless. The more scarce the language is, THE MORE UNIQUE THE STORY IS. What use would I have with something like Navajo? Well, I could use it to connect with its speakers and learn their culture and share that with the rest of the world. I could provide a story very few others could because they do not know that language. Again I think a blog detailing a native English speakers language journey with Navajo would be fascinating to read, especially if they frequently immerse themselves in their culture by visiting these people. These types of unique stories are the kind that regularly can end up on television like National Geographic because they give a voice to often voiceless people in our society. Never let anyone tell you knowledge is useless. Robert Greene got his degree in classical studies. Not many employers look for people who major in this field. He is now a best-selling author and millionaire because he decided to look at the concept of power through various notable historical figures and wrote about it. This is now the well known '48 Laws of Power'. When he writes books, they become best sellers, because people are thirsty for the knowledge he provides through researching the past and bringing it to the present. So any time someone asks you "why are you learning THAT language?" You can answer them "because I want a unique skill very few people have". Those skills ALWAYS hold value. "Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect." - Mark Twain 7 persons have voted this message useful |
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