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On the formulation of a lesson

 Language Learning Forum : Lessons in Polyglottery Post Reply
Espling
Diglot
Newbie
Sweden
Joined 5706 days ago

17 posts - 18 votes
Speaks: Swedish*, English
Studies: Japanese, German

 
 Message 1 of 5
22 August 2008 at 12:33am | IP Logged 
Dear Professor Arguelles,

My name is John Espling and I am a native Swedish speaker. I am currently studying Japanese and German and I was utterly fascinated when I saw your reviews on the different language series, quite specifically on how you saw the newer ones were "dumbed down". This started a thought process in me.

You see, I am a bit of a writer. You might call it a hobby, but I have some ambitions in the field and I must admit that I think a bit too highly of myself in that regard. In either case I love writing stories, short and longer, so I thought... Why not try to do some small lessons using what I write? Like making a short story into episodes with an English translation and/or some notes and then putting them on a website were people could use them a tool for their learning?

It would of course be on a advance level with less grammatical explanation, but instead more focus on independent thinking and perhaps some explanations of expressions. Still, since you have tried many study methods in your days, I think that your advice could be very useful in structurising the presentation of the text.

Things I am wondering include
   - If there should be questions instead of just explanations. Example: What do you think Rudolph meant when he said "Där lade du näsan i blöt"? Answer key would of course be given in some form.
   - Being an advance level piece, if there should be a complete translation of the text and if so, how literal the translation should be.
   - If there should be a vocabulary, and if so, how detailed it should be at a minimum.
   - How long each chunk of text should be, or if the episodic nature of the lessons should depend more on the natural flow of the story. It might be irritating to have it break of in the middle of a discussion, for example.

I am also thinking about adding poetry to the lessons, not only my own, but also some classics which have had their copyrights expired, like the works of Bellman.

The website I will create would ideally be a wiki were people could freely contribute, but I find my current knowledge of webdesign quite unsatisfactory for a project of that magnitude. Still, I would appreciate any help or contributions through this forum and would espacially appreciate if you would later take your time to view the webpage when it has been created and give constructive critisism on my methods and presentation.

The result I am hoping for with this initiative is for others to follow my example, giving lessons in a not only interesting way, but also a genuinely useful way and making our endeavour, as would be polyglots, just a little bit more colourful.

Please do keep in mind that I am a writer before a teacher and that my time is limited, being a student as I am.

Thank you and have a good day // John Espling.

P.S. I will add a link to the site when it has been created.
1 person has voted this message useful



Kugel
Senior Member
United States
Joined 6298 days ago

497 posts - 555 votes 
Speaks: English*

 
 Message 2 of 5
23 August 2008 at 12:32pm | IP Logged 
John Espling, would this website be more beneficial to you, the aspiring polyglot, or to the language learner who is using the website as a learning tool? For instance, would a student learning Japanese be better off reading Soseki's Ten Nights of Dreams(the dreams are only a few pages long) or a story written by an aspiring polyglot whose native languages isn't Japanese? I don't want to be the wet blanket, but coming from a language learner's perspective I don't see the benefit. Of course, it would benefit you immeasurably to create such a website.

I hope it's okay to add to this discussion on the question of whether or not it would be helpful to to reconstruct(maybe even deconstruct) sentences from popular short stories in order to not only learn different styles of prose, but also to get a better idea of sentence structure(grammar.) It would be just like picking an opening sentence from anything and rewriting it in a completely different style, sort of like taking the famous, "Invisible God created the visible world," and change the world order to take on different propositions.

The line, "Invisible God created the visible world," carries three propositions.
1. That God is invisible
2. That God created the world.
3. That the world is visible.

One would then arrange the 3 propositions to create different meanings, that is to say, the propositions count more than the actual sequence of words.

In studying cumulative sentences in short stories one could arrange a list of base clauses and modifying phrases.

Coordinate patterns

1. The elated truck driver drove down the road
2. having completed all of his deliveries,
3. having successfully navigated the concrete jungle and its construction zones,
4. so excited to be back on the main drag in unison with the red lava of tail lights
5. so proud of his driving he wouldn't mind doing the same deliveries all over again the next day

Then create a list of subordinate patterns

1. The elated truck driver drove down the road
2. having completed all of his deliveries,
3. those inescapable duties of the job,
4. its impossible time tables and blind spotted back-ins hardwiring its drivers to view Chicagoland as a cold and silent universe,
5.   absurdities accepted by some and rejected by others.

Then mix the patterns to create a rhythm.

But would a language learner be better off studying coordinate and subordinate patterns from writers and scholars, not a truck driver with an interest in languages?
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Espling
Diglot
Newbie
Sweden
Joined 5706 days ago

17 posts - 18 votes
Speaks: Swedish*, English
Studies: Japanese, German

 
 Message 3 of 5
24 August 2008 at 1:42am | IP Logged 
Allow me to first point out that my main aspiration in life is writing, and then that sajro is right. I would never presume to be able to write anywhere near a native's fluency in a language that I am not a native speaker of.

If my lessons would be useful, or not, can be discussed I suppose, but if nothing else it would be a good way to judge how good your reading abilities are. Even if it would be completely useless for the learner it might still help me, teaching me whatever faults I have in English and Swedish and helping me correct them.

I found the reconstruction/deconstruction quite fascinating and will see if I can implement it in pedagogic fashion. Thank you for taking your time demonstrating what you meant, Kugel.



//John Espling

Edited by Espling on 24 August 2008 at 1:44am

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Williy
Diglot
Newbie
Canada
Joined 5702 days ago

30 posts - 31 votes
Speaks: English*, German
Studies: Spanish, French

 
 Message 4 of 5
24 August 2008 at 9:42pm | IP Logged 
"Allow me to first point out that my main aspiration in life is writing, and then that sajro is right. I would never presume to be able to write anywhere near a native's fluency in a language that I am not a native speaker of."

I understand your point fully, But just look at Joseph Conrad (the author of "Heart of Darkness", said by many to be one of the finest novels in the English language.) He was born Józef Teodor Konrad Korzeniowski, a Pole, and didn't learn English until well into his twenties. Although he spoke English with an accent all his life, his writing more than matches the vast majority of modern native English writers.

Perhaps hard work and focus can overcome lack of nativity.

Just a thought...

Edited by Williy on 24 August 2008 at 9:44pm

1 person has voted this message useful



Espling
Diglot
Newbie
Sweden
Joined 5706 days ago

17 posts - 18 votes
Speaks: Swedish*, English
Studies: Japanese, German

 
 Message 5 of 5
25 August 2008 at 8:44am | IP Logged 
Williy, that is quite fascinating. I will make sure to read that book in the near future so I might see for myself how such a thing could be possible. It makes me want to someday try writing a novel of some sort to see if I am able to convey what I want to say without using what we could call "clumsy grammar". The kind of grammar that I feel I use all the time when writing in English. In any case I thank you for the encouragement.

And to Snoogles, the only thing stopping me from launching such an ambitious site right now is the fact that I have absolutely no talent for webdesign or the like. The page I am currently creating, with painstaking difficulties, will be extremely simple and direct. If anyone feels that they are proficient with MediaWiki, or anything else of the kind, and have an interest in helping, then please contact me by PM.

//John Espling



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