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Iversen’s Multiconfused Log (see p.1!)

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Hobbema
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 Message 1673 of 3959
08 February 2010 at 4:04am | IP Logged 
Iversen wrote:
I have been spending the weekend at a family visit and it is quite late now, so I'll just mention briefly what I have done.

I have studied some bilingual printouts about Peter I (the Great) of Russia

I have read most of the Kauderwälsch Book about Irish (including the section about the word forms and expressions used instead of 'to be', 'to have' and the modal verbs

I have read the beginning of Satyricon in Latin (with less help than expected from the Italian translation, which is very free in places)

I have watched a lot of German television, including programs from the zoos of Bremerhaven, Berlin, Stuttgart and Münster. These programs are in fact a fine source for listening to different varieties of German.

.. and I have spent a couple of hours surfing in different languages, even though I ought to have written a proper contribution to this thread instead.


Actually, details of your family visit might be interesting as well, if that is something you would want to share.

There's a branch of my family that gets together on an infrequent basis. Reunions with that group tend to involve alcohol, arguments, and firearms. In that order, too. Noone has been seriously hurt there yet,but those aren't events I would recommend, especially if there are small children, and as for me I breathe easier when we leave and get back to our normal lives...

Edited by Hobbema on 08 February 2010 at 4:06am

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Iversen
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 Message 1674 of 3959
08 February 2010 at 9:55am | IP Logged 
I have already shared one relevant detail, namely that my mother has got ASTRA (i.e. a satellite system that is used mostly by German senders). But I will share one detail more: we don't shoot at each other, and our alcohol consumption is negliable.

My mother is an expert of solving crosswords (in Danish) and speaks English and German. My sister is an unofficial communications expert: if you bring her into a museum or a castle she will immediately start talking to the staff and other guests, and if we 'loose' her somewhere we know that the reason is that she is busy talking to someone (in English, German or French).

- -

Speaking about the weekend's activities: I would like to divulge a few details about some common Irish verbs. Point one: there are two kinds of verbal forms: synthetic and analytic. In other words: some forms have a root that is fused with an ending, while others have a 'neutral' form followed by a personal pronoun, which eerily ressembles the way I write verb forms in some languages in hyperliteral translations (e.g. LAT. credo = believe(-I)). For instance: "tuigim" = "understand-(I)", but "tuigeann is" = "understand he" (with 'he' marking the subject, but not simply being a subject - a proper subject may come later in the sentence).

There isn't just one verb corresponding to 'is': in general "I am" is "tá mé", but in the present there is a special verbal form for repetitive occurences: the synthetic 1p.sing. is "bím" = "I am (often)", - but the rest of the forms in the same paradigm are analytical: "bíonn tú" = you[SING] (often) are ". There is another special verb "is" for the copula -function: "Is Éireannach í Maire" = (Kauderwälsch: 'ist Irin sie Maria') is! Irish she Maria --> Maria is Irish. But "Is í Maire an t-Éireannach' = (Kauderwälsch: "Maria ist die Irin") is! the Irish(lady) is Maria ---> It is Maria who is the Irish person.

Please note that the verb normally is placed at the beginning of the sentence. So in my hyperliteral translations I put ! after it to mark that it isn't a question (or ? if it is).    

Of course - after all this is a Celtic language - there are special forms in interrogative, negative and negative interrogative sentences: "I'm not" = "Níl mé", "Am? I" = "bhfuil me". The copulative "is" (see above) in the negative is absorbed by the negative particle "ní", and after "ní" the pronouns é, í and iad (he, she, they) naturally have special forms: hé, hí resp. hiad (this h- before a vowel is quite normal in Irish, and it is for instance also found in the declension of nouns).

The "bhfuil" form - called dependent - is used with the interrogative particle "an" (roughly = Latin "num"), with the negative particle "ní" (however ní + bhuil --> níl), with "go" and "nach" in subordinates (= that / that not (German daß (..nicht))) and with the particle "a" that is the small and unobtrusive companion of the interrogative pronoun/conjunctions in interrogative subordinates: "cén fáth a bfhuil ..." = why ... is.

"ce aige a bhfuil..." (in interrogative subordinates) of course means "who has" (3p sing.masc.). It is clear that this construction is the logical consequence of the fact that Irish doesn't have a simple word for "to have". Instead it uses a construction that is similar to the Russian one: the preposition "ag" plus the verb "tá" ("by... is..") is a close parallel to the Russian: у меня есть... Though contrary to Russian, Irish preposition have inflected forms that incorporate personal pronouns: "ag + mé" (by+me) = "agam". So in a normal head sentence "he has..." becomes "Tá ... aige..", which in a subordinate interrogative phrase logically becomes ".... , ce aige a bhfuil ...".

Irish is a fascinating language - but I'm glad that I don't have a deadline looming above my head!


Edited by Iversen on 08 February 2010 at 11:19am

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Fasulye
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 Message 1675 of 3959
08 February 2010 at 2:23pm | IP Logged 
Iversen wrote:

I have watched a lot of German television, including programs from the zoos of Bremerhaven, Berlin, Stuttgart and Münster. These programs are in fact a fine source for listening to different varieties of German.


Iversen, you have watched so many zoo programs on German TV in your life. Do they broadcast the zoo of Krefeld as well? I could imagine that this zoo is not important enough, but I have no clue.

Fasulye

Edited by Fasulye on 08 February 2010 at 2:24pm

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 Message 1676 of 3959
08 February 2010 at 4:19pm | IP Logged 
Iversen wrote:
My mother is an expert of solving crosswords (in Danish) and speaks English and German. My sister is an unofficial communications expert: if you bring her into a museum or a castle she will immediately start talking to the staff and other guests, and if we 'loose' her somewhere we know that the reason is that she is busy talking to someone (in English, German or French).


Language skills of my family:

My father speaks fluent English, a bit of French and has quite some passive knowledge of Latin. My sister used to speak English (I don't know how much is left) and my brother speaks fluent English. My mother is dead and my father's girl-friend speaks no foreign language.

Fasulye

Edited by Fasulye on 08 February 2010 at 4:24pm

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Hobbema
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 Message 1677 of 3959
08 February 2010 at 5:07pm | IP Logged 
Fasulye wrote:
Iversen wrote:
My mother is an expert of solving crosswords (in Danish) and speaks English and German. My sister is an unofficial communications expert: if you bring her into a museum or a castle she will immediately start talking to the staff and other guests, and if we 'loose' her somewhere we know that the reason is that she is busy talking to someone (in English, German or French).


Language skills of my family:

My father speaks fluent English, a bit of French and has quite some passive knowledge of Latin. My sister used to speak English (I don't know how much is left) and my brother speaks fluent English. My mother is dead and my father's girl-friend speaks no foreign language.

Fasulye


My paternal great-grandparents immigrated to western Michigan from the Netherlands, and my grandparents spoke Dutch, but not in the home. My maternal grandparents immigrated to New Jersey from the Groningen area in the Netherlands, and they spoke Dutch at home for years. I have uncles and aunts who speak fluent Dutch; my mother still speaks some, and we grew up hearing words and phrases but never learning the language ourselves.

My father in school took German, because at that time it was considered to be the language of choice for anyone going into the sciences.

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Fasulye
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 Message 1678 of 3959
08 February 2010 at 5:15pm | IP Logged 
Hobbema wrote:
Fasulye wrote:
Iversen wrote:
My mother is an expert of solving crosswords (in Danish) and speaks English and German. My sister is an unofficial communications expert: if you bring her into a museum or a castle she will immediately start talking to the staff and other guests, and if we 'loose' her somewhere we know that the reason is that she is busy talking to someone (in English, German or French).


Language skills of my family:

My father speaks fluent English, a bit of French and has quite some passive knowledge of Latin. My sister used to speak English (I don't know how much is left) and my brother speaks fluent English. My mother is dead and my father's girl-friend speaks no foreign language.

Fasulye


My paternal great-grandparents immigrated to western Michigan from the Netherlands, and my grandparents spoke Dutch, but not in the home. My maternal grandparents immigrated to New Jersey from the Groningen area in the Netherlands, and they spoke Dutch at home for years. I have uncles and aunts who speak fluent Dutch; my mother still speaks some, and we grew up hearing words and phrases but never learning the language ourselves.

My father in school took German, because at that time it was considered to be the language of choice for anyone going into the sciences.


All my four grandparents didn't speak any foreign language. That's nice to have so many Dutch roots in the family. My parents were anti-Dutch and anti-Esperanto for many, many years. Now my father has to admit that there are some jobs offered which require fluency in Dutch, so he now sees a usefulness in this language.

Fasulye

Edited by Fasulye on 08 February 2010 at 5:17pm

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Iversen
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 Message 1679 of 3959
09 February 2010 at 1:01am | IP Logged 
Ich habe niemals eine Sendung vom Krefelder Zoo gesehen, aber dies bedeutet ja nicht daß es ein schlechter oder uninteressanter Zoo ist.Es gibt Sendereihen von Leipzig, von die zwei Berliner zoos, von Zoo am Meer in Bremerhaven, von Münster Alwetterzoo und Wilhelma in Stuttgart, und ich habe auch Sendungen von Hagenbeck in Hamburg und Hellabrun in München irgendwann gesehen. Darüber hinaus gab es einst eine gemischte Sendereihe von verschiedene Zoos von Niedersachsen, darunter vom Safaripark Hodenhagen und dem Vogelpark Walsrode. Aber Zoos wie Köln, Duisburg, Wuppertal, Dortmund, Frankfurt, Nürnberg, Leipzig, Schwerin und so weiter haben keine eigene TV Serien, so Krefeld is dort in gutem Gesellschaft.

Ich bin nur einmal dort gewesen. Ich war damals Projektleiter von einem problematischen Journal-Projekt, und ich konnte mir nur ein paar Tage Ferien leisten - und ich mußte auch täglich nach Hause telefonieren um in dem Projekt Notfalls einzugreifen.. aber trotzdem war meine Winterferien im Ruhrgebiet sehr gelungen. Ich habe die Zoos in Krefeld, Duisburg, Düsseldorf, Wuppertal, Gelsenkirchen, Bochum und Wuppertal besucht, plus das Neanderthal-Museum im Neanderthal und ettliche andere Museen. Weil daß Ruhrgebiet im breitesten Sinne so dicht bevölkert ist gibt es dort eine Fülle von Kulturelle Institutionen und Ereignisse die vorwiegend vom Lokalbefölkerung benutzt wird.

Ein Herr Petzoldt hat eine hervorragenden Heimseite aufgebaut mit Daten der deutschen Zoos: www.zoo-infos.de. Er hat tatsächlich mehr Zoos gesehen als ich!

--------

In the German text I list some zoos that have their own series in German TV ... plus some that haven't got such a series (including the one in Krefeld where Fasulye lives). I once spent a winter holiday in the Ruhr Gebiet, in spite of its bad reputation as a dirty boring industrial zone. But most of the heavy industry has gone now, and with a population that for the whole area rivals those of places like Tokyo, New York and Los Angeles it has a lot of cultural institutions and events. However few tourists visit the area so their customers are mostly the local population.


Edited by Iversen on 09 February 2010 at 1:46am

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Fasulye
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 Message 1680 of 3959
09 February 2010 at 7:50am | IP Logged 
Iversen wrote:
Ich bin nur einmal dort gewesen. Ich war damals Projektleiter von einem problematischen Journal-Projekt, und ich konnte mir nur ein paar Tage Ferien leisten - und ich mußte auch täglich nach Hause telefonieren um in dem Projekt Notfalls einzugreifen.. aber trotzdem war meine Winterferien im Ruhrgebiet sehr gelungen. Ich habe die Zoos in Krefeld, Duisburg, Düsseldorf, Wuppertal, Gelsenkirchen, Bochum und Wuppertal besucht, plus das Neanderthal-Museum im Neanderthal und ettliche andere Museen. Weil daß Ruhrgebiet im breitesten Sinne so dicht bevölkert ist gibt es dort eine Fülle von Kulturelle Institutionen und Ereignisse die vorwiegend vom Lokalbefölkerung benutzt wird.


DE: Ich kenne nur die Zoos von Münster, Krefeld, Düsseldorf und Duisburg. Als Kind war ich auch mal im Zoo von München. Mir tun immer die Tiere leid, die in den Zoos leben müssen. Bei einigen habe ich starke Zweifel, ob die wohl dort glücklich sind.

Ich glaube in Bonn gibt es keinen Zoo, sonst würde ich den kennen.

Vor zwei Jahren war ich mal im Winter (JAN-FEB) in unserem Zoo. Die Tiere hatten sich fast alle irgendwo versteckt, ich bekam nichts zu sehen. Langweilig!

Fasulye

Edited by Fasulye on 09 February 2010 at 8:37am



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