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Present Subjunctive | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Questions About Your Target Languages |  | |
| FrenchSilkPie Senior Member United States Joined 6427 days ago 125 posts - 130 votes  Speaks: English* Studies: French | Message 1 of 10 08 June 2009 at 7:25am | IP Logged | ||
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So the other day in class we just learned about the subjunctive tense. Our teacher said that's all we needed to know for this year, but she didn't really explain what it was! She said it was used after "que" but how do you translate it?
For example....J'espere que vous fassiez vos devoirs. I get how to form it, but it seems to be like the present so why isn't the present used? I just don't really understand it. Any clarifications would be great :) 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| ExtraLean Triglot Senior Member France languagelearners.myf Joined 5804 days ago 897 posts - 880 votes Speaks: English*, French, Spanish Studies: German | Message 2 of 10 08 June 2009 at 8:01am | IP Logged | ||
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I think that this site explains it decently, and with buckloads of examples.
http://www.orbilat.com/Languages/French/Grammar/Syntax/Moods /French-Syntax-Moods-Subjunctive.html In your example, it is because 'hope' isn't certain, and expresses doubt, you should thus use the subjunctive. If in doubt, just search around a bit using google, there's heaps of stuff out there that helps. Thom. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| TheBiscuit Tetraglot Senior Member Mexico Joined 5733 days ago 532 posts - 619 votes Speaks: English*, French, Spanish, Italian Studies: German, Croatian | Message 3 of 10 09 June 2009 at 5:27am | IP Logged | ||
The subjunctive is fun, it opens the door to the language on a deeper level. What is implied here is I'm not certain whether you'll do your homework or not. It makes a little more sense if you go back a few years in English when people used to say things like 'it's important that he do it today'. There's your English subjunctive. It's not certain that he'll do it so there's a slight tense change. A few useful ones to start with are: Je veux que (tu)... (I want you to do something) or Je ne crois pas que... I don't believe/think (that)... Once you get the hang of it you'll start to see how we now use will/might and a few other things to express it in English. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Spiderkat Diglot Senior Member United States Joined 5622 days ago 175 posts - 248 votes Speaks: French*, English Studies: Russian | Message 4 of 10 09 June 2009 at 6:28am | IP Logged | ||
The example you wrote is wrong. We don't use the subjontive tense after the verb "espérer" unless it's a negative or interrogative sentence, or written using the present participle. J'espère que vous ferez vos devoirs J'espère que vous avez fait vos devoirs En espérant que vous fassiez vos devoirs Je n'espère pas de vous que vous fassiez vos devoirs... 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| FrenchSilkPie Senior Member United States Joined 6427 days ago 125 posts - 130 votes Speaks: English* Studies: French | Message 5 of 10 09 June 2009 at 7:46am | IP Logged | ||
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Ok I think I might be getting it. I guess I take all the subtle meanings of language for granted, so it's difficult for me to tell the difference in another language. Thanks for that little explanation, TheBiscut.
Spiderkat...thanks for the correction! Is it just with "espérer" the subjunctive isn't used because of its meaning? ExtraLean...Thanks for the link. I assumed it was like the present/future where you can use any verb to express it (minus the irregular verbs). That clears things up. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| RBenham Triglot Groupie IndonesiaRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 5453 days ago 60 posts - 62 votes Speaks: English*, German, French Studies: Indonesian | Message 6 of 10 22 June 2009 at 11:55pm | IP Logged | ||
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I am sorry to inform you that there are no reliable rules for knowing when to use the subjunctive in French. In many instances, usage varies, and it is evolving.
For example, it is quite common nowadays to use subjunctive after après que, even though it seems particularly senseless when the après que clause is describing a fait accompli. Similarly, after Il est dommage que (or C'est dommage que), the following clause normally describes a fait accompli, but again the subjunctive seems to have become de rigueur, to the extent that the Word syntax highlighter for French objects to the indicative. For example, it underlines es in Il est dommage que tu es si bête and suggests sois as the only alternative. You can do worse than to consult Grevisse for cases that give you trouble. Generally you would use indicative with espérer (and the natural tense, which is different from the case in English: sometimes we use present when we mean future and vice versa), and subjunctive with vouloir and souhaiter, even though the meaning is similar. When, if ever, you get to learn the imperfect subjunctive and pluperfect subjunctive, I suggest you use them whenever possible.... 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Thatzright Diglot Senior Member Finland Joined 5482 days ago 202 posts - 311 votes Speaks: Finnish*, English Studies: French, Swedish, German, Russian | Message 7 of 10 23 June 2009 at 8:48pm | IP Logged | ||
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I somehow don't "get" the subjunctive despite the explanations; I'd absolutely use "que" in every situation described here, I can't fathom how it's actually a case of it's own. The example sentence, RBenham's sentences, everything would seem completely illogical to me without "que" in them, but I just don't get how it's a special tense :D Edited by Thatzright on 23 June 2009 at 8:49pm 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| RBenham Triglot Groupie IndonesiaRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 5453 days ago 60 posts - 62 votes Speaks: English*, German, French Studies: Indonesian | Message 8 of 10 24 June 2009 at 6:20am | IP Logged | ||
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It's not a tense; it's a mood! There is a difference.
There are remnants of the subjunctive in English, but as I see that's not your native language, I don't suppose I could use that to help you understand it.... I can only suggest you just accept that the subjunctive is required in certain contexts, and just try to memorize those contexts until you start to get a feel for it. 1 person has voted this message useful |
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