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Are Japanese natives generally exclusive? | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Specific Languages | ( Topic Closed) |  |
| qklilx Moderator United States Joined 5968 days ago 459 posts - 477 votes  Speaks: English* Studies: Korean Personal Language Map | Message 57 of 66 18 October 2009 at 10:39pm | IP Logged | ||
I've never experienced this. There were one or two people who were shocked briefly and had to confirm what I said, but that's all. I was always understood, and I was in Tokyo the whole time. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Gon-no-suke Triglot Senior Member Japan Joined 6216 days ago 156 posts - 191 votes Speaks: Swedish*, Japanese, EnglishC2 Studies: Korean, Malay, Swahili | Message 58 of 66 18 October 2009 at 11:48pm | IP Logged | ||
Ten years living here this has never happend. Sorry to be blunt, but perhaps you need to work even more on your pronunciation? Edit: I did experience what Siddy explained today, but I have chalked it up on my speech being slurred at 3 in the morning! Edited by Gon-no-suke on 19 October 2009 at 11:31pm 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| srunni Newbie United States Joined 5296 days ago 4 posts - 21 votes Speaks: English* Studies: Japanese | Message 59 of 66 20 October 2009 at 4:52am | IP Logged | ||
Edited by srunni on 20 October 2009 at 4:54am 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Clintaroo Diglot Senior Member Australia Joined 6653 days ago 189 posts - 201 votes Speaks: English*, Japanese Studies: Tagalog, Indonesian | Message 60 of 66 21 October 2009 at 9:32am | IP Logged | ||
hombre gordo, When I watched a Tagalog news bulletin today I immediately thought of what you said here! Even in a more formal setting such as news bulletins and reports code switching is very liberally used in the Philippines. One example was a graphic of worldwide petrol prices, and the heading (if I remember correctly) was 'PRESYO NG IMPORTED NA PETROL SA WORLD MARKET' which translates simply into 'Prices of imported petrol on the world market'. In interviews with public officials, some lines included: "mayroon maraming (many) meetings with trusted colleagues" and "...o sa (or in) English parlance, cleansing". It can be very hard as a learner because sometimes you don't really know when or if code-switching is acceptable and if the English you choose to use is well understood by Filipinos. Japanese haven't really code-switched with me but I did notice that some tended to use more katakana words in conversation. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Thuan Triglot Senior Member GermanyRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 6712 days ago 133 posts - 156 votes Speaks: Vietnamese, German*, English Studies: French, Japanese, Romanian, Swedish, Mandarin | Message 61 of 66 23 October 2009 at 9:17am | IP Logged | ||
Maybe you should work on your pronunciation? Speaking from my own experience, I have to strongly disagree with your statement. I began to study Japanese with a friend of mine four or five years ago, and both of us speak never had any problem to speak Japanese with a Japanese person once we became fluent Japanese speakers. The few times that I did experience something similar to what you`ve described was when I messed up the pronunciation. Pronouncing Katakana words in English would get a confused look for a splitsecond. But nothing like the blank face and repeated requests that you mention. On the other hand, I have the problem that most Japanese often overestimate my Japanese. Just last month a Japanese friend asked me to help her answer a few questions of the English language for her friend. And gave me two printed pages of Japanese on English grammar. She also assumes that I can read Japanese newspapers without any problems. The same things often happen to my friend. This summer he was asked to interpret for a medical exchange meeting (don`t know what that`s called), simply because he assumed that he could do that. He had to decline and explain that his Japanese is not on that level yet. Before I began to study Japanese I`ve heard the same stories about Japanese being exclusive and that they would refuse to talk to me in Japanese and such. I`m glad that still studied Japanese. I have made a lot of Japanese friends and I have yet to meet one who resented me for wanting to speak Japanese. I sometimes have to force myself to stop using Japanese just get them a chance to practice a foreign language (English or German). I`ve often been told that my Japanese is better than their German/English, so it just feels unnatural not to talk in Japanese. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| hombre gordo Triglot Senior Member Japan Joined 5365 days ago 184 posts - 247 votes Speaks: English*, Spanish, Japanese Studies: Portuguese, Korean | Message 62 of 66 26 October 2009 at 11:23am | IP Logged | ||
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Now time for my once a month English language internet session!
I have not used English at all for a month so please forgive any grammatical or spelling errors! Wow! Is this thread still running! Now I have been living in Japan for about a month I feel that I can answer my own question. Now having lived here I feel that Japanese people are the opposite�I�@Fortunately I haven't encountered many exclusive Japanese people. I have made many friends here (99 percent of them are Japanese because I try to avoid hanging around with English speaking westerners) and they have been really friendly towards me. I don't want to sound like I am bragging, but most of them tell me they are impressed with my Japanese and when they find that I am capable of discussing all kinds of strange topics they seem even more welcoming. In fact as soon as I got off the plane, left the airport and got onto the bus I immediately found myself in a conversation with an unknown Japanese girl who ended up forming a real friendship with me. Here in Japan one of my goals was to be more outgoing (I was always very introverted and even scared of social situations) and so I am trying to meet many people. Even most people who speak English to a decent level still prefer to speak Japanese and the number of language leach people who we have previously discussed have been very few (this ain't China!). However, there has still been one thing that p*sses me off. Although these kind of people have been relatively few, I still sometimes encounter the "stupid white guys cant speak Japanese" types. In Japanese, two words come to mind. �n�������@(idiot treatment) and �������@(showcase). I still occasionally meet (though rarely) the bigoted type who always takes a strange attitude towards white guys (but not towards other foreigners like non-Japanese Asians) even if the white guy has more Japanese knowledge and experience. By strange attitude I refer to the way they always speak down to us as if we were completely stupid and incapable of learning Japanese (just because we have white skin) (example for idiot treatment) and seem to be obsessed with repeating certain sentences in their broken incomprehensible English (which they cannot even speak except for a few incoherent words they have memorized in school or somewhere). Despite having not encountered this type of bigoted person for about a month, the other day in church I encountered some middle aged geezer who fit this description. During our Japanese conversation he wouldn't stop asking me if I under stand a certain word in every other sentence, for example �؋� (evidence) and even �搶 (teacher)! What a tool! What a brain dead moron! I listen to full sermons ever week entirely in Japanese and understand virtually everything, I participate in Bible study discussion entirely in Japanese, I read the Bible (and many other books) entirely in Japanese, I sing gospel in Japanese, I attend university entirely in Japanese, I am even attending a foreign language class (Korean) which is taught in Japanese and I only hang around with Japanese people, yet this halfwit bigot still talks to me as if I am a complete beginner or a completely retarded kid (just because I am white)! What is wrong with this mental patient guy?! He was really getting on my nerves and inside I just felt as if I want to get up, tell him that I am not a freaking beginner, and crack him in the face for being a racist b****rd! Because of my anger, in that moment I actually felt the adrenaline that we feel in the instance just before we enter a fight! I really was that close to kicking off! Of course, realizing that self-control is a virtue necessary for life, I managed to conceal my anger and my fantasy remained a fantasy. What peed me off most of all is that in church we are supposed to feel joy and a sense of peace and relaxation, however this time I was just being degraded and insulted by this bigot geezer. Social superior or not, I wont tolerate this kind of strange treatment any more. If he had been a guy my own age or below, I would have embarrassed him so badly! There is another bigot in church who I must mention. Because I won't let this language vampire use me for English practice, and because he is super jealous of the fact that I can handle Japanese well, he is really bitter towards me. He seems to take any opportunity he can to insult my Japanese tacitly. For example when certain church members were half-jokingly discussing who would make a suitable bride for me within our church, this nutjob nimrod told me that it would be impossible because non of the girls at our church speak English! Is this pathetic jealous jerk completely blind!!! Like I said before, I get through just about every aspect of life in Japanese and have been studying the language intensively for several years! I hope to take JLPT level one this time round. As for how to deal with this should this arise again, I am uncertain what to do. I am tempted to express my discontent directly and be frank and open about why I think their attitude towards me is ridiculous and offensive. I am sorry for the long rant! I just needed to get something off my chest. I was once told that writing about our experiences is a good was to deal with our anger. My experiences in Japan have been 99 percent positive and most people have greeted my with welcome. I certainly have made some real genuine friends. Edited by Keith on 27 October 2009 at 6:29am 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Captain Haddock Diglot Senior Member Japan kanjicabinet.tumblr. Joined 6550 days ago 2282 posts - 2814 votes Speaks: English*, Japanese Studies: French, Korean, Ancient Greek | Message 63 of 66 26 October 2009 at 11:52am | IP Logged | ||
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There are jerks in every country. I suppose avoiding them and extricating yourself from unpleasant situations is just
one more area in which a language learner needs to gain expertise. Fortunately, Japanese culture imposes stronger taboos against inconveniencing other people than most other cultures do. Edited by Captain Haddock on 26 October 2009 at 12:02pm 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| ericspinelli Diglot Senior Member Japan Joined 5565 days ago 249 posts - 493 votes Speaks: English*, Japanese Studies: Korean, Italian | Message 64 of 66 26 October 2009 at 12:05pm | IP Logged | ||
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Yes, there are jerks everywhere but I recommend that you, Hombre Gordo, reread this thread in its entirety. Perhaps the prejudice, exclusiveness, and malice (among other negative attitudes) you've displayed throughout this discourse are part of your problems.
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