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Hindi/Urdu Profile | ||
 Language Learning Forum : Collaborative writing |  | |
| liddytime Pentaglot Senior Member United States mainlymagyar.wordpre Joined 6214 days ago 693 posts - 1328 votes  Speaks: English*, Spanish, Italian, Portuguese, Galician Studies: Hungarian, Vietnamese, Modern Hebrew, Norwegian, Persian, Arabic (Written) | Message 9 of 15 21 May 2012 at 7:09pm | IP Logged | |||||
I strongly second this! Hindi/Urdu needs to be on the main page. Professor Arguelles' post on Urdu is also excellent: http://how-to-learn-any-language.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?T ID=65&PN=1&TPN=1 ( Sigh ... just another reminder of what underdogs the Indo-Aryan languages are ;-) ... ) 2 persons have voted this message useful | ||||||
| zooplah Diglot Senior Member United States zooplah.farvista.net Joined 6353 days ago 100 posts - 116 votes Speaks: English*, Esperanto Studies: German | Message 10 of 15 22 May 2013 at 11:36am | IP Logged | |||||
So the difficulty rating here would probably be 4/5? 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| liddytime Pentaglot Senior Member United States mainlymagyar.wordpre Joined 6214 days ago 693 posts - 1328 votes Speaks: English*, Spanish, Italian, Portuguese, Galician Studies: Hungarian, Vietnamese, Modern Hebrew, Norwegian, Persian, Arabic (Written) | Message 11 of 15 22 May 2013 at 3:23pm | IP Logged | |||||
Nah.. I would say it is more of a 2 or 3 out of 5. It's on par with German or Greek. The bulk of it is familiar to an Indo-European language speaker, but the cases, abugida and concepts of transitive/intransitive verbs make it a bit more challenging than, say Spanish or Italian. Certainly not a 4 anyhow! 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| Talib Diglot Senior Member United States Joined 6646 days ago 171 posts - 205 votes Speaks: English*, Arabic (classical) Studies: Arabic (Egyptian) | Message 12 of 15 22 May 2013 at 4:43pm | IP Logged | |||||
Thanks for the that. I am eagerly awaiting my TY Beginner's Hindi course to come, and I was under the false impression that Hindi/Urdu would be a 4 because of the retroflex consonants and the ornate Urdu script. By the way, is the Hindi script easier than the Urdu script, and is the Hindi script written with the vowels? Edited by Talib on 22 May 2013 at 4:44pm 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| napoleon Tetraglot Senior Member India Joined 5001 days ago 543 posts - 874 votes Speaks: Bengali*, English, Hindi, Urdu Studies: French, Arabic (Written) | Message 13 of 15 23 May 2013 at 3:41pm | IP Logged | |||||
Difficulty is a relative thing, is it not? Someone who already knows an indic script can pick up another indic script quite easily. Just as it is easy for someone to learn the urdu script if they already know the arabic script. To answer the scond question, the devanagari script indicates vowels very clearly. 2 persons have voted this message useful | ||||||
| Medulin Tetraglot Senior Member Croatia Joined 4653 days ago 1199 posts - 2192 votes Speaks: Croatian*, English, Spanish, Portuguese Studies: Norwegian, Hindi, Nepali | Message 14 of 15 24 May 2013 at 9:42am | IP Logged | |||||
Except for the most common vowel: SWHA: '' Schwa deletion in Hindi Although the Devanagari script is used as a standard to write modern Hindi, the schwa ('ə') implicit in each consonant of the script is "obligatorily deleted" at the end of words and in certain other contexts, unlike in Sanskrit.[1] This phenomenon has been termed the "schwa syncope rule" or the "schwa deletion rule" of Hindi.[1][3] One formalization of this rule has been summarized as ə -> ø | VC_CV. In other words, when a schwa-succeeded consonant is followed by a vowel-succeeded consonant, the schwa inherent in the first consonant is deleted.[3][4] However, this formalization is inexact and incomplete (i.e. sometimes deletes a schwa when it shouldn't or, at other times, fails to delete it when it should), and can yield errors. The rule is reported to result in correct predictions on schwa deletion 89% of the time.[4] Schwa deletion is computationally important because it is essential to building text-to-speech software for Hindi.[4][5] As a result of schwa syncope, the Hindi pronunciation of many words differs from that expected from a literal Sanskrit-style rendering of Devanagari. For instance, राम is Rām (not Rāma), रचना is Rachnā (not Rachanā), वेद is Véd (not Véda) and नमकीन is Namkeen (not Namakeen).[4][5] The name of the script itself is pronounced Devnāgrī (not Devanāgarī).[6] Correct schwa deletion is also critical because, in some cases, the same Devanagari letter-sequence is pronounced two different ways in Hindi depending on context, and failure to delete the appropriate schwas can change the sense of the word.[7] For instance, the letter sequence 'रक' is pronounced differently in हरकत (har.kat, meaning movement or activity) and सरकना (sarak.na, meaning to slide). Similarly, the sequence धड़कने in दिल धड़कने लगा (the heart started beating) and in दिल की धड़कनें (beats of the heart) is identical prior to the nasalization in the second usage. Yet, it is pronounced dhadak.ne in the first and dhad.kane in the second.[7] While native speakers correctly pronounce the sequences differently in different contexts, non-native speakers and voice-synthesis software can make them "sound very unnatural", making it "extremely difficult for the listener" to grasp the intended meaning.[7]'' http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schwa_deletion_in_Indo-Aryan_la nguages [devnagri] is a perfect script for Sanskrit and Nepali (since shwa's are not reduced), but it's not perfect for Hindustani. Even the name of actress Ranaut is problematic, the wrong spelling Kangana is used instead of the correct Kangna. Were [devnagri] perfect, her name wouldn't be pronounced (and Romanized) incorrectly, more often than not. (She is Kangna and not Kangana). Edited by Medulin on 24 May 2013 at 9:46am 4 persons have voted this message useful | ||||||
| linguaholic_ch Triglot Groupie IndiaRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 5033 days ago 69 posts - 96 votes Speaks: English, Hindi, Bengali Studies: Japanese, Esperanto, French | Message 15 of 15 07 April 2014 at 7:50pm | IP Logged | |||||
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I believe in Hindi and other Indic languages too, a single letter like "g" is pronounced as "ga" seperately (pronounced like u in but, that is schwa I presume). The schwa is deleted only because I believe Hindi in its modern form has become more smooth and the pronunciation has become more fluid. That is why people pronounce "Kangna" differently. But Sanskrit required it. That is why a a sign (`) used to be used under each letter which needed a schwa. Even Hindi and Bengali uses this sign but not much nowadays. Only some pure Sanskrit words uses it today. 3 persons have voted this message useful |
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