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 Language Learning Forum : Learning Techniques, Methods & Strategies |  | |
| Antigrav_7 Newbie Philippines Joined 5086 days ago 17 posts - 20 votes | Message 1 of 4 22 July 2010 at 9:29am | IP Logged |
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I've been learning Polish for several weeks, have mastered all the grammar in 'Colloquial Polish' and 'Intermediate Polish' and I've finally gotten to the point where I could converse (text chat) with other Poles about simple things (difficulty of other languages, work, studies, etc.). But the biggest problem I have is that it takes me so long to reply, which due to the fact that I've been getting used to thinking in English, and then translating to Polish. As a result, my speaking skills are almost nonexistent (since I have to think in English, apply the right Polish grammar rules when translating, etc., which takes quite a while).
How do I reverse this big mistake I've made? One guy on the net said something about learing how to reproduce texts and mimicking everyone else, until you can write by yourself. I can write very well, but only if I think in English, and then translate to Polish. But when it comes to trying to think only in Polish, it's just terrible, I feel like a really slow Kindergartner writer. But at the same time I'm not so sure whether it's really worth it reproducing hundreds of words of text and then recalling them by memory. I'm completely lost.........At the moment, I'm just simply continuing on writing essays on simple questions (e.g. describe your family, etc.), and I simply can't help thinking in English, and then translating to Polish. I don't know whether this will repair itself in time.... And is there someone who have made the same mistake, but was able to repair it quickly? I'd also like to think in the language while in the bus, but again, English keeps getting in the way. I'm only able to think in the language successfully, only after I let my brain think in English, after which I translate. Edited by Antigrav_7 on 22 July 2010 at 9:31am 1 person has voted this message useful | |
| Antigrav_7 Newbie Philippines Joined 5086 days ago 17 posts - 20 votes | Message 2 of 4 22 July 2010 at 9:32am | IP Logged |
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And also does reproducing texts, and memorizing them help with writing? Or is there a better, more efficient method? By the way when it comes to directly comprehending in the target language through listening, I barely have any problems. I don't need to translate every sentence to English in order to understand what's being said, I only do it when there's an unfamiliar word, or sometimes it just happens spontaneously, but very rarely (but I'm only talking about simple podcasts like those in Bloggypolish). But my writing and speaking skills are simply terrible (unless, I let myself think in English). Edited by Antigrav_7 on 22 July 2010 at 9:39am 1 person has voted this message useful | |
| treehouse Newbie United States Joined 5198 days ago 19 posts - 22 votes Studies: Russian | Message 3 of 4 29 July 2010 at 5:38pm | IP Logged |
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==What's wrong with "thinking in English, and then translating to Polish"?
It is hard to create new speech on the spot. Even in English, it's hard to think "on your feet" and speak "extemporaneously". You really can't compete with experienced native speakers and they could be inhibiting your playing with their language. It's like you're trying to "re-invent the wheel" with each sentence. Your newly-minted ideas aren't ready quickly enough to use them and they aren't ready for "prime time". And what you say might sound quaint or faintly amusing to native speakers on their ground, within their culture. Trying to be creative or inventive on the spot isn't the best way and it's not the only way. ==What we are talking about is developing or building a "repertoire". There is so much cliche and well-worn in languages and that's what I'm trying to blend with my own ideas. I had tried collecting a scrapbook of clippings from Polish newspapers and magazines and phrasebooks, but found I hadn't internalized these well enough for prime time or to remember them. I think a repertoire is a collection that starts with what you are doing, only writing it down in a diary instead of trying to use it on a native speaker. Start putting two words together in a creative way and "tinkertoying" with language to create ideas (phrases) and full ideas (sentences) and let your diary grow and get perfected "internally" before you use it with others in prime time. ==Using "games" to think in a foreign language. One of my classmates was trying to think in Polish by using games. If you think about it, that's what Schliemann was doing. There were three parts of Schliemann's game: 1. Comparing dual-language books to crack the "code" and learn the meaning of the book. 2. Reading out loud to a native tutor and reciting to himself until he had memorized passages during his daily activities and until he went to sleep and dreamed in the language. 3. Keeping a written diary in his target language. Writing down his own creative personal observations in the foreign language in his diary. ==Bibliography, Heinrich Schliemann, (1822-1890) http://www.jstor.org/pss/324234 http://www.mlahanas.de/Greeks/NewArch/HeinrichSchliemann.htm l http://www.netbeans.org/community/magazine/html/03/schlieman n/ http://www.language-learning-tips.com/17_Schliemanns_method. htm http://www.language-learning-tips.com/20_How_long_will_I_nee d_to_learn_a_language.htm ==Definition of "diary", Merriam-Webster Collegiate® Dictionary 1 : a record of events, transactions, or observations kept daily or at frequent intervals : JOURNAL especially : a daily record of personal activities, reflections, or feelings 2 persons have voted this message useful | |
| Waegukin Newbie Korea, South Joined 5296 days ago 19 posts - 22 votes Speaks: English* Studies: Korean | Message 4 of 4 02 August 2010 at 7:49am | IP Logged |
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From my experience so far with Korean, is that this will fade with time once you use
those words, grammar, etc. more often. Now I can say simple sentences without much thought, but when I use grammar patterns and words that I have only recently learned, I have to do the mental translation beforehand, but after doing that a few times you will be able to say it faster. I think reading a lot helps with writing, because you become accustomed to more grammar patterns and way of wording things that you'll start to notice if something 'sounds right' or not. I've never tried memorizing large blocks of text, but I do memorize sentences and that has helped me. Hope this helps and good luck on your Polish studies! 2 persons have voted this message useful |
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