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Georgian Notes, Doubts and Tips TAC 2013

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Expugnator
Hexaglot
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Brazil
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3335 posts - 4349 votes 
Speaks: Portuguese*, Norwegian, French, English, Italian, Papiamento
Studies: Mandarin, Georgian, Russian

 
 Message 121 of 758
19 March 2012 at 10:51pm | IP Logged 
FInally I could study again. I'm currently doing book2. When it starts, I'll try to do the exercises in the 200 Familiarization Course.

მე არ მაქვს ხურდა ფული.     I have no change.
ხურდა means "change" just regarding money?

I did Lesson 01 of SF 200 Hour Familiarization Course. It's nice to run into useful, daily vocabulary again. Grammar is fine so far, I'm already familiarized (pun unintended =P ).

Now if I have time I will read some Aronson at home and do some exercises the next day I'd have time again.

===============
I do need an overall reading on verbs, especially the function of each tense. Any specific grammar you guys recommend?

After I finish SF200, I will retake Hewitt. Will keep doing Aronson in parallel, overall the grammar has been rewarding. Only the exercises bother me.

Edited by Expugnator on 19 March 2012 at 11:04pm

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TixhiiDon
Tetraglot
Senior Member
Japan
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772 posts - 1473 votes 
Speaks: English*, Japanese, German, Russian
Studies: Georgian

 
 Message 122 of 758
19 March 2012 at 11:42pm | IP Logged 
Expugnator wrote:
I do need an overall reading on verbs, especially the function of each
tense. Any specific grammar you guys recommend?


This is a real problem, I think. There is no one text that provides a nice, clear
summary of all the verb types, how to form them, and what they mean in each tense. So
what tends to happen (or at least what happened with me, and seems to be happening to
you) is that after you get past the basics, which are quite easy to understand, you
slowly start becoming completely lost with all but the simplest verbs.

I think reading a lot will help, and otherwise it just takes some time for it all to
become clear.
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Expugnator
Hexaglot
Senior Member
Brazil
Joined 3801 days ago

3335 posts - 4349 votes 
Speaks: Portuguese*, Norwegian, French, English, Italian, Papiamento
Studies: Mandarin, Georgian, Russian

 
 Message 123 of 758
20 March 2012 at 3:44am | IP Logged 
Found it at Kurze Grammatik der Georgischen Sprache!!

Funktion der Verbalreihen

- Präsens

Das Präsens bezeichnet eine Handlung oder einen Zustand in der Gegenwart oder eine zeitlos gültige Aussage.

- Imperfekt

Das Imperfekt dient zur Wiedergabe einer Tätigkeit der Vergangen-heit. Diese Tätigkeit erstreckt sich entweder iiber eine längere Zeit-spanne oder wird mehrmals wiederholt. Außer der Zeitangabe enthält die Imperfektform demnach noch zusätzlich die Markierung des unvoll-endeten Aspekts:

- Konjunktiv Präsens

Der Konjunktiv Präsens bezeichnet die Dauer oder Gewohnheitsmäßigkeit einer möglichen Tätigkeit, die in der Gegenwart bzw. in der Zukunft stattfinden könnte. Die Reihe des Konjunktivs Präsens driickt also wie alle Verbalreihen gleichzeitig Tempus, Modus und Aspekt aus. Der Konjunktiv Präsens wird in einem fest begrenzten Bedingungsgefüge verwendet: in Wunschformeln (meist gepaart mit dem Wort netavi «wenn doch») und bei irrealen Bedingungen

- Futur

Das Futur gibt eine in der Zukunft ablaufende, indikativische, den vollendeten Aspekt ausdrückende Handlung wieder. Mit dem Futur werden im Georgischen auch in der Zukunft liegende Handlungen bezeichnet, die im Deutschen präsentisch wiedergegeben werden

- Konditional

Der Konditional wird gebraucht, wenn wiederholte, auch gewohnheitsmäßig ablaufende, abgeschlossene Handlungen ausgedriickt werden solien. In diesem Fall tritt häufig xolme «im allgemeinen, stets (im Sinne von «zu tun pflegen»)» zu der Verbform. Oft entspricht der Konditional deutschen Verbformen mit «wiirde». In dieser Funktion steht er auch im irrealen Bedingungssatz, wo im Hauptsatz der Konditional, im Nebensatz der Konjunktiv Präsens oder Futur erscheint

- Konjunktiv Futur
Der Konjunktiv Futur bezeichnet einmalige, abgeschlossene Handlungen, die in der Zukunft stattfinden könnten. Wie der Konjunktiv Präsens begegnet der Konjunktiv Futur meist in Wunschformeln und bei irrealen Bedingungen.

- Aorist

Der Aorist verfugt im allgemeinen iiber zwei Formen: eine mit Präverb und eine ohne Präverb. Der Aorist mit Präverb bezeichnet eine einmalige, abgeschlossene Handlung in der Vergangenheit, bringt also den perfektiven Aspekt zum Ausdruck:

Der selten gebrauchte Aorist ohne Präverb dient dagegen zur Wieder-gabe einer wiederholten, aber nicht gewohnheitsmäBig vollzogenen Handlung in der Vergangenheit und drtickt den imperfektiven Aspekt aus.

- Konjunktiv Aorist

Beim Konjunktiv Aorist, der gleichfalls Formen mit und ohne Präverb unterseheidet, zeigen die Formen mit Präverb den vollendeten Aspekt an, während die präverblosen den unvollendeten Aspekt verkörpern. Der Konjunktiv Aorist bezeichnet eine in der Gegenwart oder Zukunft liegende Möglichkeit, oft auch einen Wunsch oder eine Aufforderung.

Der Konjunktiv Aorist steht auch dann, wenn ein Verb von einem anderen Verb abhängig ist (den Infinitiven, Infinitivkonstruktionen oder Objektsätzen des Deutschen entsprechend).

Auch in Finalsätzen, die mit der Konjunktion rom «damit, um zu» eingeleitet werden, wird der Konjunktiv Aorist gebraucht.

Bei bestimmten Wendungen wie unda «müssen», SeiZleba «können», sach'iroa «es ist nötig» u. a. steht zur Bezeichnung von präsentischen bzw. futurischen Handlungen der Konjunktiv Aorist.

- Perfekt

Perfekt

Auch beim Perfekt unterscheidet man mit und ohne Präverb gebildete Formen, die wie in der Aoristgruppe den vollendeten bzw. den unvollendeten Aspekt zum Ausdruck bringen, wobei die präverblosen Formen selten auftreten. Das Perfekt bezeichnet eine Handlung in der Vergan-genheit, die bis in die Gegenwart Bezug hat und von der man oft nur vom Hörensagen weiB. Daher wird die Perfektform häufig zusätzlich mit den Partikeln turme «angeblich», titkos «als ob» u.a. versehen, die dieses Ungewisse noch unterstreichen. Teilweise dient das Perfekt auch zur Bezeichnung der Gegenwart selbst.

Werden Handlungen, die durch den Aorist ausgedrückt werden, negiert, so verwendet man gewöhnlich ar «nicht» zusammen mit einer Perfektform.

- Plusquamperfekt

Wie beim Perfekt können vom Plusquamperfekt perfektive Formen (mit Präverb) und imperfektive Formen (ohne Präverb) gebildet wer-den. Das Plusquamperfekt bezeichnet wie das Perfekt eine vom Hören-sagen bekannte, also nicht selbst erlebte Handlung der Vergangenheit, deren Auswirkungen schon völlig abgeschlossen sind. Diese Reihe entspricht oft dem deutschen Plusquamperfekt.

- Konjunktiv Perfekt

Der .Konjunktiv Perfekt begegnet vor allem in Wunschformeln und in Konstruktionen, in denen eine vergangene Handlung von einem Vollverb oder bestimmten Wendungen abhängig ist.

Doch die Reihe des Konjunktivs Perfekt ist im Schwinden begriffen. Als Ersatz wird in Abhängigkeitskonstruktionen das Plusquamperfekt verwendet.

============
Which tenses are missing from those?

Each of these tenses came with examples, but since they were in transcription and the whole text was in German, I'll leave it as a homework for myself to pick up the translation then transcribe and translate the Georgian sentences =D I just couldn't wait for tomorrow to post the whole text, that's why I pasted it in German. Hope it helps!



Edited by Expugnator on 20 March 2012 at 3:52am

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Expugnator
Hexaglot
Senior Member
Brazil
Joined 3801 days ago

3335 posts - 4349 votes 
Speaks: Portuguese*, Norwegian, French, English, Italian, Papiamento
Studies: Mandarin, Georgian, Russian

 
 Message 124 of 758
20 March 2012 at 11:19pm | IP Logged 
book2

საიდან შეიძლება დავრეკო?     Where can I make a call?
საიდან is Where from? Is it obligatory to use the -dan ending in those cases?

ვულკანიზაციას ვეძებ.     I'm looking for a garage.
ვეძებ is the verb 'looking for'? Is it 4th conjugation? May I have more info?

SF200

I've come across this sentence:

კაბა მოგწონს თუ ჩანთა? Do you like dress or bag?
I just don't get it. Is a bag another type of clothe I don't know?

- Give a brief introduction of yourself, listing your name, where you are from, where you live, and what your occupation is.

ჩემი სახელია ექსპუგ. მე ვარ ბრაზილიელი, ბაჰიადან, მაგრამ ვცხოვრობ მინასში. ვმუშაობ მაგრამ არ ვსწავლობს.
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Expugnator
Hexaglot
Senior Member
Brazil
Joined 3801 days ago

3335 posts - 4349 votes 
Speaks: Portuguese*, Norwegian, French, English, Italian, Papiamento
Studies: Mandarin, Georgian, Russian

 
 Message 125 of 758
20 March 2012 at 11:26pm | IP Logged 
Function of the verbal series:

The present tense denotes an action or condition in the present or a timeless statement.

ორთქმავალი გრუხუნებს მთებს შორის. The locomotive drones between the mountains.
კაცები ხომ ოცდახუთ წლამდე იზრდებიან. Men grow up until they are 25 years old (?).


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Expugnator
Hexaglot
Senior Member
Brazil
Joined 3801 days ago

3335 posts - 4349 votes 
Speaks: Portuguese*, Norwegian, French, English, Italian, Papiamento
Studies: Mandarin, Georgian, Russian

 
 Message 126 of 758
22 March 2012 at 12:42am | IP Logged 
Imperfect

The imperfect is used to reproduce a work of the past. This activity extends either over a longer period of time or is repeated several times. Besides the temporal value, the imperfect also marks the imperfect/unfinished aspect, as the name suggests:

სიზმარცხადში მარტო იმ გოგოსა ხედავდა. In dreams and waking, he saw only that girl.
შორიდან ზვერავდა უცნობს. From far away he watched the foreigner.
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TixhiiDon
Tetraglot
Senior Member
Japan
Joined 4099 days ago

772 posts - 1473 votes 
Speaks: English*, Japanese, German, Russian
Studies: Georgian

 
 Message 127 of 758
22 March 2012 at 12:34pm | IP Logged 
Expugnator wrote:
ვულკანიზაციას ვეძებ.     I'm looking for a garage.
ვეძებ is the verb 'looking for'? Is it 4th conjugation? May I have more info?


ეძებს is just a normal 1st conjugation verb in the present (i.e. ვეძებ, ეძებ, ეძებს), and
the imperfect is regular too, but I'm not exactly sure what happens with it in the future
and aorist.
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Expugnator
Hexaglot
Senior Member
Brazil
Joined 3801 days ago

3335 posts - 4349 votes 
Speaks: Portuguese*, Norwegian, French, English, Italian, Papiamento
Studies: Mandarin, Georgian, Russian

 
 Message 128 of 758
22 March 2012 at 4:10pm | IP Logged 
Working in the morning today. A calm morning. book2's lesson had no doubts. Looking forward to finishing it up to August. Still doing one lesson a day, but sometimes I think I could take more than once. How are you doing this, zecchino1991?

I think I've reduced the rant =D Even though I'm learning quite slow, specially when it comes to vocabulary, it's been very pleasure so far. Besides, I have plenty of resources. I'm even anxious about finishing a book so I can dive into another! In the end, I'll come across some of these books and understand they're too elementary for me.

======
SF200

გოგო ჭამს გვიან საუზმეს. The girl ate a (late?) breakfast.
What's that? A sort of a brunch?

What are the most common differences between მიდის and დადის? (to go)

The first Georgian text I'd read!! (Lesson 04)

დათო არის მოსწავლე. ის სწავლობს სკოლაში. ყოველ დღე ის დგება შვიდ საათსა
და თხუთმეტ წუთზე. ის საუზმობს შვიდ საათსა და ოცდაათ წუთზე. ის სკოლაში
მიდის რვა საათზე. სკოლის შემდეგ ის თამაშობს კალათბურთს. ის კითხულობს
წიგნებს და უყურებს ტელევიზორს საღამოს. დათო არ სწავლობს შაბათს და კვირას.

Dato is a student. He studies at school. He wakes up at 7:15 am everyday. He has breakfast at 7:30 am. He goes to school at 8:00 am. After school, he plays basketball.He reads books and watches TV in the evening. Dato doesn't study on saturdays and sundays.

a. The text uses სკოლის შემდეგ. Should I always use genitive with postposition შემდეგ? I'mm still getting used to the fact that it is a POSTposition =D

b. Do I always have to use the expression შაბათს და კვირას? No single word for "weekends"?

I'm impressed with the quality of the exercises in the Familiarization Course. They are many, and varied. They resemble actual classroom textbooks while the whole material is still suitable for self-learning. I'm even leaving some exercises up for tomorrow so I can do them more carefully. There are compositions too.



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