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The Super challenge!

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Serpent
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 Message 537 of 713
04 June 2012 at 8:29pm | IP Logged 
Imo, watching vs listening is not a straight-forward thing. There's football, there are films about various locations... there are dubbed movies too.
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anarion21
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 Message 538 of 713
04 June 2012 at 8:38pm | IP Logged 
I join this challenge. :)

I'm more or less B2 in English and C1 in Spanish.
That's why I want to do it in both languages.

100 movies and 100 books in English.
And the same in Spanish.

I wanted to do the super advanced in Spanish but it seems to me it is too difficult to reach 200 interesting movies in Spanish. ;)

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RMM
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 Message 539 of 713
04 June 2012 at 9:43pm | IP Logged 
Thanks Surrealix. I think I'll go ahead and start on the writing now and just add them later to Twitter when the update comes.

As far as music goes, I think it's a good idea to listen to foreign music, but it really seems very different from films or even audio books to me. With some music, it's hard to hear the lyrics clearly. For other songs, the lyrics are really short and repetitive. I think the way you memorize song lyrics is tied up with the melody and rhythm, which is not at all like memorizing normal dialogue or narration. There's also the point that people tend to pay more attention to watching movies, whereas people often listen to music while doing other things. If we do this, I really think it should be a separate, optional category (like writing and conversations), or just something people can keep track of on their own. "Films" is already the "easy" category compared to books and to water it down even more with something quite different would not I think be the best, most helpful idea. Anyway didn't Solfrid Cristin already nix the idea of music for this category somewhere earlier in this huge thread, or am I imagining that?


Edit: After thinking about this for a bit, I just wanted to add that if we do have a separate category for "Music/Listening," then I think it should be optional whether we want to count audio books under Films or Music. In some ways I think audio books are much closer to movies, in that they both tell stories, typically have dialogue, and have a lot of spoken speech unlike music. However, there is also the lack of visual context, etc. that Jeffers mentioned that make them more like music that you also listen to. Even if we don't add this category officially now, perhaps this is the sort of thing we can keep in mind if we do this over again a year and half from now ;).

Edited by RMM on 04 June 2012 at 11:33pm

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Solfrid Cristin
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 Message 540 of 713
04 June 2012 at 11:31pm | IP Logged 
anarion21 wrote:
I join this challenge. :)

I'm more or less B2 in English and C1 in Spanish.
That's why I want to do it in both languages.

100 movies and 100 books in English.
And the same in Spanish.

I wanted to do the super advanced in Spanish but it seems to me it is too difficult to reach 200 interesting movies in Spanish. ;)


I am afraid you are too advanced to do the Super Challenge which are for those who have a maximum B1 level, but you are most welcome at the Advanced Super Challenge :-). Find a couple of series you like which are dubbed into Spanish, and it will be a breeze. If you live anywhere near Paris, Virgin Store at the Champs Elysees have lots of American series, some of which are dubbed also into Spanish.
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surrealix
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 Message 541 of 713
05 June 2012 at 1:33am | IP Logged 
maydayayday wrote:
It would be really good if we could have all the challenges in one place and our own personal objectives in the
same framework.

Can you explain this in a bit more detail? The twitter bot currently lists all users with their objectives (ie, which challenge/s)
and clicking on a name will give the precise target numbers. However I know you're using the bot, so it can't be this you're talking
about ...

Jeffers wrote:
The Film title isn't really misleading, it is supposed to be about films. It's just that audio has been allowed to
count because it's not always possible for people to find 100 films in their target language.

I guess I have a slightly different perspective on this because I mostly listen to audio books, and films are incidental - and for
whatever reason audiobooks ended up being in the same category, I had the mental label "audio stuff". But saying that, I agree with
the fact they're quite different.

Serpent wrote:
Imo, watching vs listening is not a straight-forward thing. There's football, there are films about various
locations... there are dubbed movies too.

Jeffers wrote:
I think if we were starting all over again, it would make the most sense to have 5 categories anyway: reading,
writing, listening, speaking and watching. However, as I said, I'll just list the albums I listen to on the update thread, as an
informal addition (a bit of dessert on the side) to the main course!

RMM wrote:
Edit: After thinking about this for a bit, I just wanted to add that if we do have a separate category for
"Music/Listening," then I think it should be optional whether we want to count audio books under Films or Music. [...] Even if we
don't add this category officially now, perhaps this is the sort of thing we can keep in mind if we do this over again a year and
half from now ;).


Yikes, this suddenly got complicated. Did we have an official ruling on CDs/Music somewhere earlier in the thread, as mentioned? I
can't remember anything, but I have trouble keeping up with such a mass of information! I agree that the best route would have been
to have Audio as a separate category from the start, and from a technical standpoint it's almost as easy to add it in now. However
from a how-does-this-fit-in-with-current-challenges standpoint it seems to get really messy. For a start it upsets the balance of
the competition (adding more to the challenge and/or changing people's goals). Switching items between a 'film' and 'audio' category
would be even more confusing, and adding an audio category outright means editing a huge number of existing entries that would then
have been placed wrong.

As usual I'll go with the communities thoughts (or the 'official' ruling) on this, but my personal view is that it's going to be a
mess to try and change things now. Maybe a good half-way measure is adding sub-category tracking on personal pages (that splits up
your films based on which tag you used, so you can see what percentage of "films" were actually books, or CDs, etc). It doesn't
change the twitter/ranking/challenges at all, and I've been planning to do this anyway.
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kanewai
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 Message 542 of 713
05 June 2012 at 1:58am | IP Logged 
My thoughts are: keep it simple.

I also have a hard time considering listening to music as 'language study.' It seems
like this is more a way to rack up points on twitter than a way to challenge yourself to
improve in your TL.

Edited by kanewai on 05 June 2012 at 3:20am

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RMM
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 Message 543 of 713
05 June 2012 at 2:24am | IP Logged 
surrealix wrote:

Switching items between a 'film' and 'audio' category
would be even more confusing, and adding an audio category outright means editing a huge number of existing entries that would then
have been placed wrong.


Actually, I thought that avoiding this was one reason why it would be important to give people the option of how to classify audio books. If they’ve classified audio books they’ve already done as films then they should just leave it that way. But in the future they could choose which category to use. This would also give people more leeway if they don’t really have easy access to 50 or 100 disparate music albums. As far as fitting in with the current challenges, could it just be added on to the existing categories like the conversations and writing options are? This is, of course, getting even more complicated and I don’t even know if there really is demand enough to justify this at any rate. I’m just throwing out ideas. I’m cool with it however it goes.

I do think that tracking music is a good idea, but as far as previous rulings go, I went back and searched the thread and this is what I found (the “I think” perhaps indicates that she wasn’t dead-set about this, but she has indeed already “ruled” on it):

Solfrid Cristin wrote:
GRagazzo wrote:
I accept, I'm at a b1/b2 don;t really know which one in Italian. I hope I can still join!
anyway I am super excited for this and truly do believe this will help. And if I read
news in Italian should I do 100 articles= 1 book, also is it ok to watch 2 hours of
Italian TV and count it as a movie?

also what is your stance on watching music videos, or just listening to music?


B1/B2 should be ok. The articles and the Italian TV too. The music and music I think will fall outside OF
this particular challenge :-)

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Serpent
Octoglot
Senior Member
Russian Federation
serpent-849.livejour
Joined 6357 days ago

9753 posts - 15779 votes 
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Speaks: Russian*, English, FinnishC1, Latin, German, Italian, Spanish, Portuguese
Studies: Danish, Romanian, Polish, Belarusian, Ukrainian, Croatian, Slovenian, Catalan, Czech, Galician, Dutch, Swedish

 
 Message 544 of 713
05 June 2012 at 4:04am | IP Logged 
kanewai wrote:
I also have a hard time considering listening to music as 'language study.' It seems like this is more a way to rack up points on twitter than a way to challenge yourself to improve in your TL.
IDK, I consider it an essential part of language study, as important as, say, grammar. I'm unlikely to reach fluency if there are no or very few songs that I like in the language.

And don't judge. :E


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