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Native Spanish speaker lacks "rr" | ||
Tags: Pronunciation | Spanish | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Specific Languages |  | |
| sfuqua Triglot Senior Member United States Joined 4568 days ago 581 posts - 977 votes  Speaks: English*, Hawaiian, Tagalog Studies: Spanish | Message 1 of 11 09 September 2012 at 5:05pm | IP Logged | ||
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I have a student in my class, a ten year old boy who is a native speaker of Mexican
Spanish (he has one parent from somewhere else in Latin America), who doesn't seem to use the trilled "rr" sound when he speaks Spanish. He uses a "th" sound in place of the "rr". The structure of his mouth seems normal. His English seems fine. Is this the usual way that native speakers of Spanish, who lack the "rr" sound, speak, or is he doing something idiosyncratic? Are there variations on "rr" used in parts of South America? It's always possible he is speaking this way because he thinks it is easier for English speakers to understand. steve 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| outcast Bilingual Heptaglot Senior Member China Joined 4752 days ago 869 posts - 1364 votes Speaks: Spanish*, English*, German, Italian, French, Portuguese, Mandarin Studies: Korean | Message 2 of 11 09 September 2012 at 5:18pm | IP Logged | ||
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Not using the alveolar trill is considered a speech defect in all Spanish dialects and standards.
Yes, I think it is possible that speakers that can't make the sound replace it with a dental consonant. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Peregrinus Senior Member United States Joined 4295 days ago 149 posts - 273 votes Speaks: English* | Message 3 of 11 09 September 2012 at 8:50pm | IP Logged | ||
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I have to constantly practice producing a correct alveolar trill in Spanish, as I naturally seem to want to produce an uvular trill. If he absolutely can't produce an alveolar trill, perhaps he can be taught to trill the uvula as a substitute, though one that is more a French guttural one. It seems to me that would be preferable to no trill and would distinguish meaning in words where it really makes a difference.
Still, perhaps you can teach him proper placement of the tongue, as almost touching the alveolar ridge instead of behind the teeth which will produce the dental sound he is producing. If he can be taught to properly place the tongue and practice blowing out with that placement, then he should be able to make a proper trill. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| megazver Triglot Newbie Lithuania Joined 5797 days ago 34 posts - 52 votes Speaks: Lithuanian, Russian*, English Studies: French, Spanish, Polish | Message 4 of 11 10 September 2012 at 1:27pm | IP Logged | ||
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It's a speech defect. (Think Jonathan Ross.) It's the speech therapist's job to correct
this, not yours. The English r is an entirely different sound, so he doesn't have any problem with it. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| sfuqua Triglot Senior Member United States Joined 4568 days ago 581 posts - 977 votes Speaks: English*, Hawaiian, Tagalog Studies: Spanish | Message 5 of 11 11 September 2012 at 3:54pm | IP Logged | ||
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I don't think I'm competent to help anybody with their Spanish RR :)
steve 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Dagane Triglot Senior Member SpainRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 4314 days ago 259 posts - 324 votes Speaks: Spanish*, EnglishB2, Galician Studies: German Studies: Czech | Message 6 of 11 11 September 2012 at 7:55pm | IP Logged | ||
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It's a speech defect. Mixtaking some sounds is not rare when you're a child, and they should be corrected. Some people go to logopedas (I ignore the English equivalent) to learn how to talk.
I remember that when I was three years old I couldn't pronounce the "s" sound, which is quite strange. I used to utter a "z" (English th) instead, but I could correct it in a few months at home with my parent's help. 2 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| Gala Diglot Senior Member United States Joined 4353 days ago 229 posts - 421 votes Speaks: English*, Spanish Studies: Italian | Message 7 of 11 12 September 2012 at 7:51pm | IP Logged | ||
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@Dagane: To "ignore" in English is not the same as "ignorar." It implies a conscious and
deliberate lack of attention to (Ex: "Just ignore him"= "No le hagas caso") someone or something. As a verb, it doesn't mean to lack knowledge of something. As a noun or adjective, though (ignorance, ignorant) it does mean (as noun) or describe (as adj) a lack of knowledge. I hope you don't mind me pointing this out; I'm kind of assuming that as a speaker of English as L2 you would want to know. If not, I apologize in advance. Edited by Gala on 13 September 2012 at 5:38am 2 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| Dagane Triglot Senior Member SpainRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 4314 days ago 259 posts - 324 votes Speaks: Spanish*, EnglishB2, Galician Studies: German Studies: Czech | Message 8 of 11 14 September 2012 at 5:41pm | IP Logged | ||
Thank you. You don't need to apologize at all. Actually I'd rather be corrected more often so that I could improve my skills. I always try to be aware of the false friends, but I didn't know this one. It's quite interesting. The English meaning as a verb ("No le hagas caso") does exist in Spanish as well ("Ignórale"), so I thought both words were synonyms. Thanks again for your explanation. 2 persons have voted this message useful |
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