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5 years of 日本語 TAC 13 桜/Schnitzel | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Language Learning Log |  | |
| g-bod Diglot Senior Member United KingdomRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 5786 days ago 1485 posts - 2002 votes  Speaks: English*, Japanese Studies: French, German | Message 129 of 436 25 March 2013 at 3:13pm | IP Logged | ||
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I was aware of some patterns and groupings for genders but even with these I find it's taking some time to absorb them. And if I need to communicate on the spot I still make mistakes, the difference is I can wince myself as it comes out my mouth (e.g. "ein Reservierung" has slipped out at least once while we've been in Germany, even though I know that nouns ending in -ung are feminine).
And you're right, English isn't exactly a pushover. If you don't have definite/indefinite articles in your native language they are hard to get used to. And I don't think prepositions (or postpositions/particles) map well across any language. But this is what makes things so interesting, right? Anyway, I'm online today because we became holiday refugees this morning! The last hotel we stayed in was pretty awful. I wondered if I was just overreacting as I had a bad feeling about it as soon as we arrived, but then I developed a migraine the next day which can do weird things to my mood. So I was trying to make the best of things and convince myself it wasn't too bad... and then this morning after trying some of the fruit salad at the breakfast buffet which tasted none too fresh, I found myself sharing the breakfast room with a mouse! So we packed our bags and are now taking an unscheduled stop in Frankfurt instead. We've managed to find a much nicer place for a similar price which is a huge relief! I've never fled from a hotel before! 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Brun Ugle Diglot Senior Member Norway brunugle.wordpress.c Joined 6424 days ago 1292 posts - 1766 votes Speaks: English*, NorwegianC1 Studies: Japanese, Esperanto, Spanish, Finnish | Message 130 of 436 25 March 2013 at 3:40pm | IP Logged | ||
Even after all these years, I still do that. It doesn't matter how well I know it, it just comes out wrong sometimes. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| g-bod Diglot Senior Member United KingdomRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 5786 days ago 1485 posts - 2002 votes Speaks: English*, Japanese Studies: French, German | Message 131 of 436 25 March 2013 at 7:50pm | IP Logged | ||
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Well if someone with such a tendency towards precision as yourself does this, there is no hope for someone as sloppy as me!
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| kraemder Senior Member United StatesRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 4988 days ago 1497 posts - 1648 votes Speaks: English* Studies: German, Spanish, Japanese | Message 132 of 436 26 March 2013 at 4:25am | IP Logged | ||
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lol sorry about thee mouse in your hotel XD. I found my German grammar book. You probably have one too but here's some more feminine endings.. -ei, -ie, -ion-, -heit (lots of these!), -schaft, -taet, -ung (supposedly abstract kinds of nouns); -e, -a
So many endings that make a noun feminine it's no wonder I started calling everything die when in doubt. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| kraemder Senior Member United StatesRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 4988 days ago 1497 posts - 1648 votes Speaks: English* Studies: German, Spanish, Japanese | Message 133 of 436 26 March 2013 at 4:27am | IP Logged | ||
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For what it's worth I'm sure messing up the article in German is similar to English - it sounds funny but meaning wise it doesn't matter and after you've talked to someone for a bit you sometimes stop even hearing it. At least I do.
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| g-bod Diglot Senior Member United KingdomRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 5786 days ago 1485 posts - 2002 votes Speaks: English*, Japanese Studies: French, German | Message 134 of 436 28 March 2013 at 9:11pm | IP Logged | ||
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I'm back in the UK now, although I'm still not quite back home. I'm on an overcrowded intercity which I had to wait three hours for - not because there were no earlier trains but because it costs a small fortune to leave London between 4pm and 7pm. So I spent my time in London having an early dinner, which consisted of burnt lasagna and a sad salad. I am missing Germany so much already!
The mouse in the hotel incident turned out for the best after all. I would never have planned to spend three nights in Frankfurt but the city turned out to have more appeal than I was expecting. I was totally captivated by the architecture (also I enjoyed an afternoon in the architecture museum!) and the weather was perfect for strolling around what turned out to be a surprisingly compact city centre. Nevertheless, three nights was definitely enough for Frankfurt and I was ready to move on by this morning! So, after 12 nights in the country, how is my German? I've definitely got the role play exercise for hotels and restaurants nailed now. I even managed to deviate from the script slightly a couple of times, although of course I got out of my depth very quickly. The most awesome thing is that I realised very quickly that I'm no longer scared to speak a foreign language, no matter how badly. This is such a big deal for me as I used to be absolutely terrified. I guess I'm an old hand now at making a fool of myself in Japanese - but in that case it's always been in the relatively safe environment of a class or language exchange. Mistakes were expected and my dinner never depended on it! I think maybe in the past I always felt like speaking a language was almost like putting on a performance, and as a result I ended up suffering a certain amount of performance anxiety. But speaking a language in real practical situations isn't some kind of exam. It's just about communicating at a very human level and it really doesn't matter if you screw up. Anyway, every successful exchange (or even partially successful) felt like a small victory. It was good. I also want to put in a good word for Assimil. I've studied a total of 57 passive wave and 7 active wave. The lessons are so quirky I never expected them to have immediate practical value, and yet plenty of things I learned from Assimil cropped up in my tourist experience, which I found rather interesting (not to mention helpful)! But there is still a limit to my tourist German and I return to the UK hungry for more. I could pick up snatches and fragments from TV and newspapers but I was lost for most of the time. I had a couple of opportunities to actually have a real conversation in German - but my lack of language failed me. Since I was already carrying two weeks worth of clothes plus more books than I actually needed, I didn't go crazy on shopping for language materials. I did pick up a grammar book I wanted (with both explanations and exercises) and a couple of DVDs (Sex and the City and Big Bang Theory dubbed into German - figured I may as well stick with something I'm familiar with in English). Anyway, once I'm back into the normal routine I don't think I'll be making any major changes to my approach to German. Assimil plus textbook plus Deutsche Welle courses seems to be a great combination for me. I think I want to start making more active use of the language but I'm nowhere near proficient enough for a language exchange. I'm considering using a tutor again, but I think I just need to do the basics on my own first - I don't need to pay someone to tell me what I can learn myself from a grammar book, but I wouldn't mind paying for someone to guide and correct some conversation. I find it quite interesting how my experience and associations for German are already so different for those I have for Japanese. There's no correct reason to learn or way to use a language, of course. But Japanese for me is the language for tv drama and conversation with Japanese friends. Whereas German is the language for when I'm in Germany (being a tourist...) Both are great! 2 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| Sunja Diglot Senior Member Germany Joined 5889 days ago 2020 posts - 2295 votes 1 sounds Speaks: English*, German Studies: French, Mandarin | Message 135 of 436 29 March 2013 at 1:03pm | IP Logged | ||
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Great post, it's nice to know that you're having some practical experience with Assmil. I didn't have as much luck with my tourist script when I was in Paris last summer. "We speak English, Madam" was always the response to my French, but to be fair, they were probably just trying to be efficient^^. Coincidentally, I've gone back to the first Assmil for a second look at some of the excercises. They're nice and short and easy to recall.
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| g-bod Diglot Senior Member United KingdomRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 5786 days ago 1485 posts - 2002 votes Speaks: English*, Japanese Studies: French, German | Message 136 of 436 31 March 2013 at 7:58pm | IP Logged | ||
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@Sunja I think that Paris is possibly the worst place you can go to practice French. In my experience people are most likely to switch to English in big international cities and tourist traps. I think Paris ticks both those boxes. While I was in Germany, more people switched to English in Frankfurt than anywhere else but even there I still met a few restaurant staff who were quite happy to keep up the act as long as I wasn't obviously struggling. I appreciated it every time.
As for Assimil, or any other study for that matter, it's been a real struggle to get back into it. I think routine is my best friend when it comes to regular, consistent study, and my routine is totally out of whack now! My two weeks in Germany actually marked the longest time I haven't sat down and studied language (ie. with a textbook or Anki deck) pretty much since I started my Japanese project some five years ago. And I didn't touch Japanese at all while I was in Germany. When I got back I listened to some Japanese internet radio for a very short time. I also opened up Anki, saw that 270 cards were due in my Kanji in Context deck, so closed it down again right away! When it comes to German, I'm trying to hold on to the enthusiasm I brought home with me. This has stretched to watching one and a half discs from the Big Bang Theory box set I bought (surprisingly comprehensible and amusing, especially with German subs and prior knowledge). I think I need to stretch it a bit more to actually studying something though. It's not that hard to just pick up a book and work with it for a few minutes, is it? 1 person has voted this message useful |
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