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Adventures in Cebuano, etc. (Goldlist)

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ElComadreja
Senior Member
Philippines
bibletranslatio
Joined 5470 days ago

683 posts - 757 votes 
2 sounds
Speaks: English*
Studies: Spanish, Portuguese, Ancient Greek, Biblical Hebrew, Cebuano, French, Tagalog

 
 Message 113 of 145
05 March 2014 at 9:02am | IP Logged 
Well after a long pause, I'm back on the FSI Portuguese. I think at this point I'm
going to go through the initial programming of the lesson (which is mostly
pronunciation now), and then just work with the dialog. I probably should edit the
audio so that there's no more 2 reps of everything. (I rep myself if need be).

I peek at the grammar points, but it's usually the same as Spanish anyway. The only
thing different I've seen so far is that in Spanish "estar" is always used for location
(even if it's a building and will never move), but that oddity is not in Portuguese.
I've heard about conjugated infinitives, but have not come across them in the course
yet. Portuguese makes more sense to me than Spanish so far.

The one thing I can't seem to hear right is the word "o" as in "o carro". I don't hear
it every time... it just seems to disappear when it's in front of something else.

I'll say this next part cautiously... I think my Cebuano listening comprehension is now
very close to my reading comprehension. I listened to the news yesterday, thought I
would have a harder time because I haven't really done any since my peak 2 days before
but I didn't. I had a hard time with some of the later stories though. So I read about
it in the newspaper and hmm, I had the same difficulties. The day after a day like that
is usually a bummer though :-/ the added element may have been that I was standing up
and walking around while listening (I didn't have a choice at first).

That was day 47.

Now I think the issue is "less than clear" speech.
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Expugnator
Hexaglot
Senior Member
Brazil
Joined 3398 days ago

3335 posts - 4349 votes 
Speaks: Portuguese*, Norwegian, French, English, Italian, Papiamento
Studies: Mandarin, Georgian, Russian

 
 Message 114 of 145
06 March 2014 at 8:44pm | IP Logged 
I really hope you're getting close to that listening 'epiphany'. The way it worked for
me in French, as much as the work is progressive, you really get some 'quantum leaps'
now and then when a lot of the previous vocabulary you've been just adding crazily as
input suddenly make sense when met in context.

As for the Portuguese, 'estufa' is greenhouse indeed, we'd never think of an oven. It's
not slang.

There's no b/v confusion at all. They're different letters, sounds, that's it. As
crystal clear as for a French or English speaker. There's no fricative bilabial either
(the second 'b' in trabajaba' in some Spanish accents, if not most).

As for the article 'o', it gets contracted to the previous preposition.
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ElComadreja
Senior Member
Philippines
bibletranslatio
Joined 5470 days ago

683 posts - 757 votes 
2 sounds
Speaks: English*
Studies: Spanish, Portuguese, Ancient Greek, Biblical Hebrew, Cebuano, French, Tagalog

 
 Message 115 of 145
08 March 2014 at 11:54am | IP Logged 
Day 47 & 48 was amazing for Cebuano. It kind of dropped off after that again. Personal
best I guess.

I've gone through all the double-rep dialogues in FSI Portuguese I. About half of them
today. I can definitely read them all at this point. I think I can say thank you to
Spanish as well as Goldlist. I was alternating between those and some Cebuano Bible
chapters.

There seems to be some missing double rep dialogues from the fsi-language-courses.org
files, but it's still plenty to internalize the sounds and grammar thus far I think.
There's about 70 minutes of this on my iPad. It would be 35 if I could cut out the
other rep. But in any case if I can find about an hour to listen to that everyday I'm
guessing I'll see good results. I could even try to mimic before rep 2.
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ElComadreja
Senior Member
Philippines
bibletranslatio
Joined 5470 days ago

683 posts - 757 votes 
2 sounds
Speaks: English*
Studies: Spanish, Portuguese, Ancient Greek, Biblical Hebrew, Cebuano, French, Tagalog

 
 Message 116 of 145
13 March 2014 at 5:45am | IP Logged 
well, a few days ago I listened through all the Portuguese lessons just fine, not really needing the 2nd rep much. I got stuck on lesson 20 though. Anyway, I think the only major piece of grammar that I was missing was the inflected infinitives. I just went and googled those. They weren't that hard and remind me of futures. Then I thought hmm, what could I read right now?

I tried the first 2 chapters of Genesis. No real problems there. I listened to some random news thing on youtube, and got zero, probably because it was just the anchor speaking, and I couldn't grab any context.

Listened to Matthew chapter 2 and got zero the first time, but nearly everything the 2nd time :)

Cebuano's not really progressing :( I do think that it's important that I move around or at least stand up while listening. In the past I would just sit back and relax because I thought that was the best state. That's how I went through FSI Spanish and learned some songs. I'm finding better results now with both Cebuano and Portuguese with some action,

Perhaps I should invest in some blue tooth earphones.

Edited by ElComadreja on 13 March 2014 at 5:47am

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ElComadreja
Senior Member
Philippines
bibletranslatio
Joined 5470 days ago

683 posts - 757 votes 
2 sounds
Speaks: English*
Studies: Spanish, Portuguese, Ancient Greek, Biblical Hebrew, Cebuano, French, Tagalog

 
 Message 117 of 145
14 March 2014 at 10:00am | IP Logged 
Every time I try something new, I hope it will be "the" fix. Today I got some Cebuano
comprehension back by repeating what I hear in my head... similar to shadowing. It's
very hard to keep up it up for a long time though.

Portuguese will probably end up taking a back seat soon. I currently have an itch for Romanian. Looks like the best material for me is the kindle teach yourself with audio, but the 60$ is holding me back. This may be a good thing :p

I started reading Luke again. I realized that the few problems that I have is, like in the intro, the writer sometimes takes a while to get to the point. There will be a series of phrases like "because of so and so" which are not the main idea, but I guess I'm impatient.

Edited by ElComadreja on 14 March 2014 at 5:31pm

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ElComadreja
Senior Member
Philippines
bibletranslatio
Joined 5470 days ago

683 posts - 757 votes 
2 sounds
Speaks: English*
Studies: Spanish, Portuguese, Ancient Greek, Biblical Hebrew, Cebuano, French, Tagalog

 
 Message 118 of 145
17 March 2014 at 7:33am | IP Logged 
"repeating what I hear in my head" is working! :) I think I was doing this before on a
good day but not consciously. It's been good for 4 days now. Not perfect, but
consistent. Sometimes when I stop doing this, I still understand, sometimes not. When
someone says something to me and I wasn't really paying attention, I start up my
"repeat machine" ask them to say it again, and it's there. Yeay.

Listening to people just talking to each other feels easier than listening to the news.


Here's a misunderstanding... some one talked to me about 2 legged and 3 legged
motorcycles. I thought, that's a weird way to say that. They were saying "ligid"
(wheel).

I noticed that the Teach Yourself books say that they will take you to B2. Yeah right.

Edited by ElComadreja on 17 March 2014 at 7:37am

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ElComadreja
Senior Member
Philippines
bibletranslatio
Joined 5470 days ago

683 posts - 757 votes 
2 sounds
Speaks: English*
Studies: Spanish, Portuguese, Ancient Greek, Biblical Hebrew, Cebuano, French, Tagalog

 
 Message 119 of 145
19 March 2014 at 6:36pm | IP Logged 
With my new found tool, I talked with someone last night who was speaking to me in Cebuano. it was not so hard and kind of cool. They had to repeat some things because there was allot of noise in the room. (hmm, if native speakers have to ask other native speakers to repeat something, why is it so bad that a non-native would have to ask sometimes?)


I kept responding in English, as my full attention was on understanding what that person was saying. Some Cebuano still slipped in though. At the moment, I can say stuff, but I have to think about it, and I didn't want the other person to get tired of waiting for my responses. As the night wore on, it got harder to do this. I might be able to claim B2 listening at this point. I need to beef up on the speaking.


I tried to do this with a taxi driver, even throwing out some Cebuano responses of my own, but he just seemed to want to practice his English :p

The silent shadowing is kind of strange, more and more it feels like the shadowing disappears and I just hear.

Edited by ElComadreja on 19 March 2014 at 6:42pm

1 person has voted this message useful



ElComadreja
Senior Member
Philippines
bibletranslatio
Joined 5470 days ago

683 posts - 757 votes 
2 sounds
Speaks: English*
Studies: Spanish, Portuguese, Ancient Greek, Biblical Hebrew, Cebuano, French, Tagalog

 
 Message 120 of 145
22 March 2014 at 4:16am | IP Logged 
Well, my goldlisting for FSI Hungarian lesson 2 was done last Tuesday, so I've started listening to it again this week, for maybe about 3 days. The first lesson was mostly clear, with just a few parts needing special attention. This time it's like the whole thing needs attention. As usual, after reading through the dialogue with English training wheels twice, I can read the thing. I don't bother with the slower dialogue with pauses, because even when I can do that, it's like I have to start all over again anyway when I go to full speed. I can see how it would be useful later though when I might focus on speaking. Every time I hear a new word on the tape, it's like I've found a new toy. I don't know if I'll ever pay attention to grammar. Right now it just tells me that, for example, "kavehazban" means "in a kavehaz", and I'm perfectly fine to leave it at that. I was reading some review of something the other day, and noticed that one was in Hungarian, although I didn't know what it said :p

For Portuguese I'm just listening to the Bible now and then (as my familiar text). I think if I was to just read it I'd be a bit lost but as far a listening goes the main difficultly is getting used to that accent. Sometimes I get in the right zone and everything becomes clear.

I'm about halfway though Luke in Greek, and it's gotten much easier. I think I got used to his style.

Cebuano news is almost always clear to me now :) and even when the times come when I have some difficulty, it's not in the abysmal pits of the past. Many times I understand and I don't feel that I really did anything. The man on the street is an added challenge though, because he doesn't talk as clearly. There are times on the news when they get a statement from someone standing near the scene and I have to listen to it several times.


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