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Extremely Passive Learning | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : General discussion |  | |
| DaraghM Diglot Senior Member Ireland Joined 5940 days ago 1947 posts - 2923 votes  Speaks: English*, Spanish Studies: French, Russian, Hungarian | Message 17 of 28 15 March 2013 at 10:20am | IP Logged | |||||
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My enquiry is to how much of the language you would learn. Would a grammar awareness allow you to pick up some of the language passively ? I don't think this is a method that could be used to fully learn a language. I've never watched the Danish television series, "The Killing", but a lot of friends rave on about it, as well as the other Danish series Borgan. Considering that language study occupies all of my spare time, I wouldn't feel justified watching it. However, if I read a Danish grammar, would that assuage my guilt ? Would I slowly pick up small fragments of the language, none or more than expected ?
Edited by DaraghM on 15 March 2013 at 10:21am 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| iguanamon Pentaglot Senior Member Virgin Islands Speaks: Ladino Joined 5051 days ago 2237 posts - 6731 votes Speaks: English*, Spanish, Portuguese, Haitian Creole, Creole (French) | Message 18 of 28 15 March 2013 at 1:43pm | IP Logged | |||||
That would move you beyond the realm of pure "passive" and slightly more into "active" with the goal of getting involved with the language. The more active you get the more effective you'll be. I'd say you'd learn a thing or two and probably end up with yet another language to add to your "studies" list. You'll never really know until you try. If it's a good tv show and you enjoy it, then it's not a waste of time, regardless of whether or not you learn anything about Danish. As for somehow "passively" picking up Danish, I'm doubtful but then again, vamos ver. Give it a month or so and see how it goes. 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| Mistermark21 Newbie United Kingdom Joined 4401 days ago 23 posts - 26 votes Studies: Swedish* Studies: French, German, Spanish, Polish | Message 19 of 28 15 March 2013 at 1:49pm | IP Logged | |||||
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You'd have to be careful, whenever i watch foreign films with English subtitles the translation occasionally differs to whats actually been said.
I dont think it's a good way to learn a language, but i do think it'd be useful to bring back words/phrases you already know. 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| tarvos Super Polyglot Winner TAC 2012 Senior Member China likeapolyglot.wordpr Joined 4496 days ago 5310 posts - 9399 votes Speaks: Dutch*, English, Swedish, French, Russian, German, Italian, Norwegian, Mandarin, Romanian, Afrikaans Studies: Greek, Modern Hebrew, Spanish, Portuguese, Czech, Korean, Esperanto, Finnish | Message 20 of 28 15 March 2013 at 4:46pm | IP Logged | |||||
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In my experience, if you don't use the words themselves they won't stick. I don't understand more Spanish now than a year ago.
I understand more Russian because I've used those phrases more. If I don't know what the words mean or I cannot decode the sounds, it doesn't function. You need some form of active ability to use the listening. Reading is a different story though, you could very well learn to passively understand a language even though you cannot utter much in it. 2 persons have voted this message useful | ||||||
| Serpent Octoglot Senior Member Russian Federation serpent-849.livejour Joined 6386 days ago 9753 posts - 15779 votes 4 sounds Speaks: Russian*, English, FinnishC1, Latin, German, Italian, Spanish, Portuguese Studies: Danish, Romanian, Polish, Belarusian, Ukrainian, Croatian, Slovenian, Catalan, Czech, Galician, Dutch, Swedish | Message 21 of 28 15 March 2013 at 7:25pm | IP Logged | |||||
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Or more like, if you don't want to remember the words, you won't. If you consciously throw them away, you'll have to pick them up again.
I think we're different because you're more visual. I can't remember words from reading if I worry about pronouncing them incorrectly to myself (I don't have this problem with French because I don't care about developing any skills in it. I pronounce it as Portuguese, Italian or Romanian in my head and it doesn't bother me. I don't like French.) Basically, for me there are two categories of cognates/etymologically related words - those that I COULD understand (sometimes with a bit of decoding), and those I DO understand effortlessly. I've needed a lot of input in Spanish, Italian, Polish to move the words from the first to the second category. As for Danish, that's the language in which I've made the least progress with my usual methods. Mostly because it's quite, well, unclear. Sometimes I feel that I've picked up more Swedish just from visiting Finland. However dubbed Disney cartoons are among the most efficient things I've tried, compared to my usual LR and football matches. And I LR'ed HP books 5-6 in Danish. 2 persons have voted this message useful | ||||||
| leosmith Senior Member United States Joined 6339 days ago 2365 posts - 3804 votes Speaks: English* Studies: Tagalog | Message 22 of 28 15 March 2013 at 8:10pm | IP Logged | |||||
Who's mind works like this? 2 persons have voted this message useful | ||||||
| dcbaok Groupie United States Joined 4271 days ago 46 posts - 63 votes Speaks: English* Studies: Mandarin | Message 23 of 28 15 March 2013 at 8:21pm | IP Logged | |||||
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I've been following this thread because I'm using passive listening as a part of my listening routine and have been curious to see what people have to say about it.
I feel that accompanied by active study, passive listening is definitely beneficial, though people who question input based methods may not agree. Having L2 playing in the background for as many hours of the day as is possible adds the "massive" to "massive input" you tune in and out of actually listening but it's everpresent and consciously or subconsciously begins to sink in. I agree that active interest, and an active component in the study routine are necessary to realize these benefits, and further that the benefits are "soft" and difficult to quantify, but for me at least, I'm gaining some facility from this practice. It's highly inefficient but low cost and low effort. For me it's basically "free" as I listen while I'm working at the computer doing other things. I get my work done and have L2 as a constant background. Edited by dcbaok on 15 March 2013 at 8:22pm 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| tarvos Super Polyglot Winner TAC 2012 Senior Member China likeapolyglot.wordpr Joined 4496 days ago 5310 posts - 9399 votes Speaks: Dutch*, English, Swedish, French, Russian, German, Italian, Norwegian, Mandarin, Romanian, Afrikaans Studies: Greek, Modern Hebrew, Spanish, Portuguese, Czech, Korean, Esperanto, Finnish | Message 24 of 28 15 March 2013 at 10:11pm | IP Logged | |||||
If you don't want to remember the words then you're best off doing something you'll want to remember.
I am indeed more visual but I do consciously work on my auditive development (listening is always my weakest skill). But no amount of hearing nonsense will make it stop being nonsense. You need the subtitles and the other aids to start understanding what you are watching, and then it snowballs because you associate the word to the sub. If I listen to an episode of non-subtitled Greenlandic shows, I won't magically understand them if I listen to them over and over. I have to get subtitles and a transcript and a textbook to explain unknown grammar rules of Greenlandic to me. That's not because I'm not auditive, but because if I never learn how Greenlandic sounds correspond to meaning and in what rhythm and phrase and consciously associate them and repeat them over and over, then I will never. No magical amount of listening to the radio will make me fluent in Breton. Only me using Breton actively in some way will help me to actually understand the Breton. 3 persons have voted this message useful |
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