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yong321 Groupie United States yong321.freeshe Joined 5556 days ago 80 posts - 104 votes Studies: Spanish
| Message 1 of 13 11 April 2013 at 4:17am | IP Logged |
Google translator pronounces "s" at the end of "Coedès" (a person's name):
http://translate.google.com/#fr/zh-CN/Coed%C3%A8s
as well as made-up words "oedès", "edès", but obviously not "dès". If you were to pronounce Coedès, would you pronounce the last "s"?
(Georges Coedès is a scholar: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Georges_Coed%C3%A8s )
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| Cabaire Senior Member Germany Joined 5613 days ago 725 posts - 1352 votes
| Message 2 of 13 11 April 2013 at 6:00am | IP Logged |
It depends on the word. For example:
dès, près end in [ɛ],
ès, londrès end in [ɛs].
There are not always fixed rules for final consonants in French. My stomach says, that the pronunciation in [ɛs] is the expected one, but high frequency words like prepositions may have lost the [s].
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Iversen Super Polyglot Moderator Denmark berejst.dk Joined 6717 days ago 9078 posts - 16473 votes Speaks: Danish*, French, English, German, Italian, Spanish, Portuguese, Dutch, Swedish, Esperanto, Romanian, Catalan Studies: Afrikaans, Greek, Norwegian, Russian, Serbian, Icelandic, Latin, Irish, Lowland Scots, Indonesian, Polish, Croatian Personal Language Map
| Message 3 of 13 11 April 2013 at 10:33am | IP Logged |
The simplest rule would be to drop the s in common words (apart from the cases where you have to make a liaison), but expect that it may be used in proper names. The word "ès" ('en' + 'les' as in "docteur ès lettres") is obviously an exception - probably because it is meant to be quaint, old and precious.
Edited by Iversen on 11 April 2013 at 10:36am
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| DaraghM Diglot Senior Member Ireland Joined 6165 days ago 1947 posts - 2923 votes Speaks: English*, Spanish Studies: French, Russian, Hungarian
| Message 4 of 13 11 April 2013 at 11:35am | IP Logged |
What is the meaning of londrès ? I know London is londres in French, where the final s is silent.
Edited by DaraghM on 11 April 2013 at 11:36am
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| Cabaire Senior Member Germany Joined 5613 days ago 725 posts - 1352 votes
| Message 5 of 13 11 April 2013 at 12:26pm | IP Logged |
Londrès is a type of cigars from Cuba, a Havana.
Maybe someone can remember more usual words, which end in -ès? The capital is of course "Londres"
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| Ogrim Heptaglot Senior Member France Joined 4653 days ago 991 posts - 1896 votes Speaks: Norwegian*, English, Spanish, French, Romansh, German, Italian Studies: Russian, Catalan, Latin, Greek, Romanian
| Message 6 of 13 11 April 2013 at 1:21pm | IP Logged |
Unfortunately, for proper names there isn't any rule at all. In some geographical names you do pronounce the final s, e.g. Reims, Gigondas, Cornas, Le Gers. However, in Carpentras, Aubenas, Cassis, Sauternes, you do not pronounce the s.
You also have regional differences. French-speaking Belgians pronounce Anvers (Antwerp) with a final -s, but people from France normally do not. (By the way, in Belgian French the capital of Belgium is normally pronounced "brussell(e)", in France they tend to say "bruksell").
Now, if you see a name ending in -ès, it is highly likely that the s is pronounced.
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| Ogrim Heptaglot Senior Member France Joined 4653 days ago 991 posts - 1896 votes Speaks: Norwegian*, English, Spanish, French, Romansh, German, Italian Studies: Russian, Catalan, Latin, Greek, Romanian
| Message 7 of 13 11 April 2013 at 4:22pm | IP Logged |
Cabaire wrote:
Londrès is a type of cigars from Cuba, a Havana.
Maybe someone can remember more usual words, which end in -ès? The capital is of course "Londres" |
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I've been trying to find some, but ès is not a common ending in French. It appears above all in place names in Southern France, (Argelès-sur-Mer, Barcarès, Canohès, Arès) which leads me to believe that it comes from Occitan or Catalan.
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| Ogrim Heptaglot Senior Member France Joined 4653 days ago 991 posts - 1896 votes Speaks: Norwegian*, English, Spanish, French, Romansh, German, Italian Studies: Russian, Catalan, Latin, Greek, Romanian
| Message 8 of 13 11 April 2013 at 5:22pm | IP Logged |
yong321 wrote:
Google translator pronounces "s" at the end of "Coedès" (a person's name):
http://translate.google.com/#fr/zh-CN/Coed%C3%A8s
as well as made-up words "oedès", "edès", but obviously not "dès". If you were to pronounce Coedès, would you pronounce the last "s"?
(Georges Coedès is a scholar: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Georges_Coed%C3%A8s ) |
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And a final point: I checked the French wikipedia entry on Georges Coedès, which says:
"George Cœdès (prononcer [sedɛs])".
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