Are most people monolingual? (General discussion) Language Learning Forum

Are most people monolingual?
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sctroyenne
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Message 9 of 25

13 October 2013 at 6:51pm | IP Logged

Ari wrote:

Amongst urban well-educated people, monolingualism is probably pretty rare
outside of the Anglosphere. But there
are still a lot of poor and/or rural people who don't travel, don't have access to
international media and so on. They
are likely monolingual, except in places with a large linguistic diversity, like
Malaysia or Nigeria.

I suspect any statement about how common monolingualism is is mostly a statement about
money and education.
And comparing a monolingual American with a monolingual Swede is just silly. English is
the global language, and
learning other languages is a matter of interest for most, and necessity for very few.
Whereas learning English is a
must in pretty much every country except North Korea if you want to work your way up
the social ladder.

I'd say to the contrary that in many countries, poor minority language groups are often
multilingual due to necessity as well as outright discrimination/persecution. In other
countries that are wealthier but have small languages on the world stage, yes I think
multilingualism through education is a norm, but in other wealthy countries such as
Anglophone countries, France, etc the proportion of urban elite who are fluent in at
least one of the foreign languages they studied seems to be rarer aside from a very
elite who are diplomats, may have sent their children to international schools, got
foreign au pairs/nannies for their children for the purpose of raising them
multilingual, etc.
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beano
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Message 10 of 25

13 October 2013 at 7:00pm | IP Logged

Ari wrote:

Amongst urban well-educated people, monolingualism is probably pretty rare outside of the
Anglosphere. But there
are still a lot of poor and/or rural people who don't travel, don't have access to international media and so on.
They
are likely monolingual, except in places with a large linguistic diversity, like Malaysia or Nigeria.

I suspect any statement about how common monolingualism is is mostly a statement about money and
education.
And comparing a monolingual American with a monolingual Swede is just silly. English is the global
language, and
learning other languages is a matter of interest for most, and necessity for very few. Whereas learning
English is a
must in pretty much every country except North Korea if you want to work your way up the social ladder.

I don't think you have to be poor and/or rural in order to be monolingual, or poorly-educated for that matter.
For example, go to any Italian city and you will find clever people with good jobs who speak only the national
language. That situation will be repeated in many countries across the globe.

Ok, English may be linked with social advancement in Sweden but is that also the case in Russia and Brazil?

Edited by beano on 13 October 2013 at 7:10pm
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shk00design
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Message 11 of 25

15 October 2013 at 4:06am | IP Logged

Depends on the country and the situation. People tend to be fluent in the language being spoken by the majority
in their region. If you are living in a country like Canada for instance, there are some first-generation Italians,
Portuguese, Chinese, etc. who have never learned to be fluent in English but instead associate within their own
ethnic neighbourhoods. Otherwise you'd expect people who immigrated from Italy or Portugal to Canada to be
fluent in their mother-tongue and English. A majority are but a small minority are not.

A place like Hong Kong and Macau are odd cases. Being repatriated as part of Mainland China in the 1990s both
maintain their Cantonese. Despite Mandarin being the official language of China there are very few in Hong Kong
who are fluent in Mandarin or English. One of the reasons is to maintain a distinct society within China. The locals
often resent efforts to transform the society to something more like the Mainland including the use of simplified
Chinese characters.

A place like the Philippines there are half dozen languages spoken and all of them influenced by Spanish who
once colonized the islands. Met a man from the island of Mindanao in the south who is fluent in his native
language and Tangalog (with an accent). He said that although Tangalog is the official language but by population
it is spoken by only 4% of the population around the capital Manilla.

In many places in Europe people have always been brought up to be multilingual. It is an advantage because the
countries are small and you naturally pick up radio and TV signals from your neighbours.
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I'm With Stupid
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Message 12 of 25

15 October 2013 at 9:09am | IP Logged

Ari wrote:

I suspect any statement about how common monolingualism is is mostly a statement about money and education.
And comparing a monolingual American with a monolingual Swede is just silly. English is the global language, and
learning other languages is a matter of interest for most, and necessity for very few. Whereas learning English is a
must in pretty much every country except North Korea if you want to work your way up the social ladder.

This is, I suspect, one of the reasons why Japan and South Korea have a lack of proficient English speakers (other than it being fairly difficult for them to learn). These countries got rich before they learned English, as so any native in those countries can basically achieve anything they want without needing English. Compare that to poorer countries in the region and English really is a way to get ahead. Getting a job in a Western company is nothing special in Japan. Getting a job in a Western company in Vietnam is huge. It's also why in Western Europe, it's typically the bigger countries (with the exception of Germany) that aren't as good at English. French people aren't really going to suffer going their entire life only speaking French. Danish people might.
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I'm With Stupid
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Message 13 of 25

15 October 2013 at 9:26am | IP Logged

shk00design wrote:

A place like Hong Kong and Macau are odd cases. Being repatriated as part of Mainland China in the 1990s both
maintain their Cantonese. Despite Mandarin being the official language of China there are very few in Hong Kong
who are fluent in Mandarin or English. One of the reasons is to maintain a distinct society within China. The locals
often resent efforts to transform the society to something more like the Mainland including the use of simplified
Chinese characters.

Yeah, I went to Hong Kong fairly soon after going to Singapore, and there's quite a big difference in the standards of English (still both much better than the wider South East Asian region). And the difference must purely come from the fact that Singapore has 3 distinct language groups that all represent a pretty sizeable chunk of the population, so it's impossible to get by in most jobs without speaking English. In Hong Kong, most people speak a reasonable standard of English, but they probably don't get the same volume of regular practice as Singaporeans.
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tarvos
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Message 14 of 25

15 October 2013 at 1:43pm | IP Logged

beano wrote:

Ari wrote:

Amongst urban well-educated people, monolingualism is
probably pretty rare outside of the
Anglosphere. But there
are still a lot of poor and/or rural people who don't travel, don't have access to
international media and so on.
They
are likely monolingual, except in places with a large linguistic diversity, like
Malaysia or Nigeria.

I suspect any statement about how common monolingualism is is mostly a statement about
money and
education.
And comparing a monolingual American with a monolingual Swede is just silly. English is
the global
language, and
learning other languages is a matter of interest for most, and necessity for very few.
Whereas learning
English is a
must in pretty much every country except North Korea if you want to work your way up
the social ladder.

I don't think you have to be poor and/or rural in order to be monolingual, or poorly-
educated for that matter.
For example, go to any Italian city and you will find clever people with good jobs who
speak only the national
language. That situation will be repeated in many countries across the globe.

Ok, English may be linked with social advancement in Sweden but is that also the case
in Russia and Brazil?

Yes. Every Russian is trying to learn English nowadays. Not sure about Brazil.
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schoenewaelder
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Message 15 of 25

15 October 2013 at 2:20pm | IP Logged

I think I tend to agree that multilingualism is probably exaggerated. Thinking about the
history of Europe over the last few centuries, it's pretty clear that most people were
monolingual. I have read, that in 1914, many french troops from different regions could
not communicate with each other. Obviously people who dealt or traded with other lands or
nations or peoples could communicate in other languages, but I assume that for most of the
population, monolingualism was the rule. Obviously in cases like English, it presumably
evolved as a result of Germanic speakers trying to speak Norman French, but I don't think
I would class that as multilingualism. More like "a coping strategy".

I assume the situation in most of the less developed world today is much the same. Could
be wrong of course.
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sctroyenne
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Message 16 of 25

15 October 2013 at 4:48pm | IP Logged

schoenewaelder wrote:

I think I tend to agree that multilingualism is probably
exaggerated. Thinking about the
history of Europe over the last few centuries, it's pretty clear that most people were
monolingual. I have read, that in 1914, many french troops from different regions
could
not communicate with each other. Obviously people who dealt or traded with other lands
or
nations or peoples could communicate in other languages, but I assume that for most of
the
population, monolingualism was the rule. Obviously in cases like English, it presumably
evolved as a result of Germanic speakers trying to speak Norman French, but I don't
think
I would class that as multilingualism. More like "a coping strategy".

I assume the situation in most of the less developed world today is much the same.
Could
be wrong of course.

In Western Europe, yes (though minority languages were stronger the further back in
history you go) but those living in the former Ottoman Empire were multilingual and the
areas that were incorporated into the Soviet Union remained so. Not to mention the
educated and upper classes tended to learn Latin and French.

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