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When would you bother? | ||
Tags: Reasons for study | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : General discussion |  | |
| Solfrid Cristin Heptaglot Winner TAC 2011 & 2012 Senior Member Norway Joined 5116 days ago 4143 posts - 8864 votes  Speaks: Norwegian*, Spanish, Swedish, French, English, German, Italian Studies: Russian | Message 1 of 25 14 October 2013 at 4:35pm | IP Logged | |||||
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How long a stay in a foreign country would you need to have, in order to bother to learn the local language?
I ask because generally I try to pick up a little of the language of a new country even if I am just going there for a couple of days. I am right now fighting hard against wanting to start on a couple of really obscure languages from countries where I might possibly spend a couple of days next year, knowing fully well that I: a) do not have the time to learn anything significant b) might not find any study material ( I have already looked at the biggest bookstore in Oslo, and they had nothing) c)need to stop spending money on language courses where I will only do the first three lessons before I forget it all again d) will get by beautifully with the languages I know already e) most likely will never, ever go back to those countries. So would you do French for a weekend in Canada (French speaking part), Catalan for a few days in Barcelona, Finnish for a weekend in Helsinki and Nynorsk for a few days in Western Norway? Oh, and in 15 minutes I am off to Estonia, but I am hoping that I will get by with Russian and English, so I have no Estonian books in my handbag :-) 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| Ogrim Heptaglot Senior Member France Joined 4421 days ago 991 posts - 1896 votes Speaks: Norwegian*, English, Spanish, French, Romansh, German, Italian Studies: Russian, Catalan, Latin, Greek, Romanian | Message 2 of 25 14 October 2013 at 4:56pm | IP Logged | |||||
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Well sometimes I cannot resist getting a course or at least an "Assimil poche" for a language I do not know if I am to visit the country for a few days. A couple of years ago I had a four-day trip to Armenia, and I bought a couple of books to get an idea of it and try to decipher the alphabet before I went. Now the books are gathering dust on my shelf.
Often though, the opposite happens. I go there, and I come back with a strong urge to add yet another language to my list. After my second trip to Croatia, I promptly bought Colloquial Croatian. After my first trip to Bulgaria, I had to fight long and hard to stop myself from forking out on yet another Assimil course. I need to keep telling myself that I will not start on another Slavic language before getting to a decent level in Russian, I have too little time as it is. However, if I went to a country for a stay of more than three months or so, I would definitely try to learn as much as possible of the language before going, and try to work intensively on it during my stay there. 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| tarvos Super Polyglot Winner TAC 2012 Senior Member China likeapolyglot.wordpr Joined 4489 days ago 5310 posts - 9399 votes Speaks: Dutch*, English, Swedish, French, Russian, German, Italian, Norwegian, Mandarin, Romanian, Afrikaans Studies: Greek, Modern Hebrew, Spanish, Portuguese, Czech, Korean, Esperanto, Finnish | Message 3 of 25 14 October 2013 at 4:58pm | IP Logged | |||||
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It depends on a couple things:
- Do I have prior knowledge of the language itself? (For example, if it's Romanian, then I might add a study boost, but I already have background) - Do I know a related language (if I am going to Italy, then I have a boost because French + Romanian). This will decrease the time I need to get good/get by. - How long will I stay there? (long term - more incentive to speak, although I generally would prefer to study even if I am going somewhere for a week or two) - is there a linguistic situation that allows the use of a vehicular language? You mention Barcelona, which implies Catalan, but Barcelona has almost as many Spanish speakers. In this case I might actually prefer to learn Spanish since it would have much the same effect BUT I would learn some Catalan words just in case. Also, Spanish would also give me a bonus elsewhere at the same time. So it depends. If I already know the vehicular language (for example, in Cape Verde, Portuguese is official but many people speak Creole) then if I don't know Portuguese, I'll learn that first, but if I already know Portuguese, then I might learn some Creole - Do I have a long-term intention of maintaining that language? I am quite happy to forget a language that I will use once in my life. Not so much if that language is a part of me. If I am stuck in Mongolia for three years, then yeah, I'll bother with Mongolian. No matter the stories people tell me. - What situation will I be in when I go there? If I am staying at a hotel with a lover in order to have a romantic getaway, then I will bother much less because I will be focused on my lover. Am I stuck solo in a hostel in the middle of Siberia and travelling long distances where I am mingling with locals? Russian it is. Both are very valid situations and they require me to have different levels. No matter what I do, I ALWAYS learn the polite phrases. Thank you, goodbye, how are you, hello, etc. This is just basic courtesy. How deep I go depends on my investment and the time I have. The longer I spend, the bigger my investment will be. As a ground rule, a month is the minimum for me to want to get to intermediate, and more than 3 months or so (so that I would qualify as a resident more or less and not a traveller passing through) for wanting to get really good. And in cases where a country has multiple languages (Belgium or Switzerland is a good example), then it pays to learn the other language of that country too, if only because you might find yourself back there in 5 years time and realise you got the job offer of your dreams, but it requires the OTHER official language of that country. In my case, Belgium is the perfect example - I could stick to Dutch, but I lived in Brussels where French is actually dominant. So knowing French does not lead you astray. In short though, language is a tool. I will hone those tools as I need them to be honed. Some might be a labour of love, some are most emphatically not, but you need them, and then you need to bite the bullet and find what is beautiful for you. And I cannot think of anything more beautiful than travelling abroad armed with the knowledge that the local language will make you better friends and let you integrate better with the local population when you are there. 7 persons have voted this message useful | ||||||
| hrhenry Octoglot Senior Member United States languagehopper.blogs Joined 4912 days ago 1871 posts - 3642 votes Speaks: English*, SpanishC2, ItalianC2, Norwegian, Catalan, Galician, Turkish, Portuguese Studies: Polish, Indonesian, Ojibwe | Message 4 of 25 14 October 2013 at 5:20pm | IP Logged | |||||
These would be mutually exclusive, no? In any case, if you're just aiming to learn a little of the language, obscure or not, why not opt for the many free resources out on the internet? You could knock worry "c" off your list doing so. For the couple of minor or obscure languages I've taken a look at, I've always been surprised at how much I can find online, although it may initially take some time to find stuff. R. == 2 persons have voted this message useful | ||||||
| chokofingrz Pentaglot Senior Member England Joined 4971 days ago 241 posts - 430 votes Speaks: English*, French, Spanish, German, Italian Studies: Russian, Japanese, Catalan, Luxembourgish | Message 5 of 25 14 October 2013 at 5:58pm | IP Logged | |||||
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I would only study it if staying for more than a week AND I have longer-term ambitions in that language.
If the trip is too short it will be over before you know it and you won't have the chance to use or hear phrases enough times to put them into long-term memory. With the added stress of travelling I know I would arrive back home with a blank slate and disappointment over wasted effort. 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| Solfrid Cristin Heptaglot Winner TAC 2011 & 2012 Senior Member Norway Joined 5116 days ago 4143 posts - 8864 votes Speaks: Norwegian*, Spanish, Swedish, French, English, German, Italian Studies: Russian | Message 6 of 25 14 October 2013 at 6:30pm | IP Logged | |||||
Not at all :-) I might not find any study material right now, but there is always the option of ordering things through the Internet or the bookstore - and that is when it starts getting expensive. 2 persons have voted this message useful | ||||||
| iguanamon Pentaglot Senior Member Virgin Islands Speaks: Ladino Joined 5044 days ago 2237 posts - 6731 votes Speaks: English*, Spanish, Portuguese, Haitian Creole, Creole (French) | Message 7 of 25 14 October 2013 at 6:34pm | IP Logged | |||||
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It is not humanly possible to learn all of the world's languages. As experienced language learners we know that we can apply our experiences in language learning to most any language and learn quite a bit in a few weeks but the effort put forth may not be worth the gain for such a short, one-off, trip. That's when learning a few phrases introducing yourself, phrases that say you don't speak X but speak W, Y and Z, some basic greetings (hello good morning, etc.), counting from one to ten, please and thank you will go a long way in most languages. Doing this won't require too much effort for an experienced language learner and will show some consideration and respect for the culture you are visiting.
For a few days, that's as far as I would go. If I were there for a few weeks I would go further... over a month and I would probably want to learn the language. Christina, you may find Benny's related article about Polish in one hour useful advice to apply to other languages: http://www.fluentin3months.com/polish-in-1-hour/ Edited by iguanamon on 14 October 2013 at 6:40pm 2 persons have voted this message useful | ||||||
| Solfrid Cristin Heptaglot Winner TAC 2011 & 2012 Senior Member Norway Joined 5116 days ago 4143 posts - 8864 votes Speaks: Norwegian*, Spanish, Swedish, French, English, German, Italian Studies: Russian | Message 8 of 25 14 October 2013 at 7:22pm | IP Logged | |||||
Thank you, I found it very useful indeed! I do not have any audio that I can use for any of the languages in question, but last year I met a native speaker who sold flowers on the market in the centre of Oslo, so I guess I'll go and hunt him down. There are always perks of living in a big city. :-) 1 person has voted this message useful |
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