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What is bilingual to you? | ||
Tags: Multilingual | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : General discussion |  | |
| Solfrid Cristin Heptaglot Winner TAC 2011 & 2012 Senior Member Norway Joined 5121 days ago 4143 posts - 8864 votes  Speaks: Norwegian*, Spanish, Swedish, French, English, German, Italian Studies: Russian | Message 1 of 63 04 November 2013 at 7:49am | IP Logged | ||
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We have discussed both the definition of fluency and polyglottery many times, but one term we seldom
discuss is bilingual ( or trilingual etc). The first time I came across it was in Spain at the age of 11 when they asked me if I spoke any other languages. "I speak some English", I said. And they answered "Oh, so you are bilingual". I just stared in surprise, because to me the term bilingual entails that you are native, or native like in the languages concerned. And that was not where I was in English at that point. I heard it many times later in Spain used in the same way, by people who said that they were bilingual, when what they meant was that they could speak their native Spanish, and a tiny bit English. Here when we say bilingual we still mean "native or being able to use both languages equally well", for instance someone with a French mother and a Norwegian father, or who has an English wife with whom he speaks English at home. I consider that I now have a fairly high level in both English, Spanish and French, but I am nowhere near being able to call myself bilingual with any of them. A couple of years more of immersion might do the trick, but right now I am not there. How is the term used in your languages? Do you qualify if you can communicate in more than one language, do you need to have a very high level, or would you need to know both languages equally well? 3 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| luke Diglot Senior Member United States Joined 6992 days ago 3133 posts - 4351 votes Speaks: English*, Spanish Studies: Esperanto, French | Message 2 of 63 04 November 2013 at 8:19am | IP Logged | ||
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I once spoke with a man from Guatemala who called called us both "bilingue", although his English and my Spanish were nothing to brag about at the time. He wasn't just being nice either.
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| Henkkles Triglot Senior Member Finland Joined 4040 days ago 544 posts - 1141 votes Speaks: Finnish*, English, Swedish Studies: Russian | Message 3 of 63 04 November 2013 at 9:38am | IP Logged | ||
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I think the people who have two native languages or a "mother tongue" and the language of the country are bilingual. Like finlandssvenskar, who might speak Swedish with friends but write their shopping list in Finnish and so on.
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| beano Diglot Senior Member United KingdomRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 4409 days ago 1049 posts - 2152 votes Speaks: English*, German Studies: Russian, Serbian, Hungarian | Message 4 of 63 04 November 2013 at 10:09am | IP Logged | ||
I have never described myself as bilingual. I agree 100% with your definition of the term. But I can see where the Spanish were coming from in your case. Back then, the vast majority of Spanish citizens probably only spoke Spanish, so anyone with a decent knowledge of another language would have been a novelty to them. A couple of times, people in the UK have referred to me as bilingual, precisely because we have no culture of foreign-language learning and someone who can babble into a phone for 5 minutes is often classed as "fluent" Within education circles in the UK, the term "bilingual" refers to a child who - for whatever reason - has had extensive immersive experiences in two languages. Edited by beano on 04 November 2013 at 10:20am 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| eyðimörk Triglot Senior Member France goo.gl/aT4FY7 Joined 3886 days ago 490 posts - 1158 votes Speaks: Swedish*, English, French Studies: Breton, Italian | Message 5 of 63 04 November 2013 at 10:16am | IP Logged | ||
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The word "bilingual" (in English) holds no connotation of advanced fluency in my opinion. It seems to imply some basic conversational skills and creating sentences of your own instead of parroting something back from a phrase book, but there's nothing native or near native about it. That's the way the word has always been used when I've encountered it, not the way I necessarily think it should be used.
EDIT: As beano pointed out, "bilingual education" means something different though. As does "bilingual diploma", "bilingual household", etc. "Tvåspråkig" (Swedish) on the other hand implies to me a level of fluency that is more or less native. It's someone who speaks one language at home and at school/work. It's a community where a large part of the population is native in one language, and another part of the population is native in another. Since the question was about the word "bilingual" though, I'll go with the first definition. Edited by eyðimörk on 04 November 2013 at 10:18am 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| vermillon Triglot Senior Member United Kingdom Joined 4465 days ago 602 posts - 1042 votes Speaks: French*, EnglishC2, Mandarin Studies: Japanese, German | Message 6 of 63 04 November 2013 at 10:17am | IP Logged | ||
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This may be a romance thing, but in France we would definitely call someone who speaks 2 languages (one natively, one not) "bilingue", and same for "trilingue". And though we have the word "polyglotte", nobody ever uses things like "diglotte" or "triglotte".
So in French (and I suppose Spanish, from your description), X-lingual is just the way to refer to what HTLAL calls X-glot. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
 Iversen Super Polyglot Moderator Denmark berejst.dk Joined 6490 days ago 9078 posts - 16473 votes Speaks: Danish*, French, English, German, Italian, Spanish, Portuguese, Dutch, Swedish, Esperanto, Romanian, Catalan Studies: Afrikaans, Greek, Norwegian, Russian, Serbian, Icelandic, Latin, Irish, Lowland Scots, Indonesian, Polish, Croatian Personal Language Map | Message 7 of 63 04 November 2013 at 10:23am | IP Logged | ||
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I would reserve the term bilingual (and trilingual etc.) for native speakers, and native speakers have learnt their languages as children - preferably before the age of 5 (based on some brain research which I have referred to earlier). However you can probably sneak under the cloak of native skills if you learn a language well before the onset of puberty, though I mostly say that out of deference for the normal definition.
NB: the presence of a language in your surroundings doesn't guarantee that you learn it - and even less learn it well. Children in families speaking a minority language will probably also have to learn the majority language, whereas it is less certain that 'majority children' learn the minority language or languages. My first memories concerning the English language date back to the early sixties, where people around me got TV with Fred Flintstone (my first English word was probably "Yabadabadooo") - i.e. within the time bracket where you should be able to acquire a native language no. 2. And I had English in school from around age 10 or 11. But I don't feel that English is a native language for me because I didn't walk around speaking it. A Danish child nowadays is however exposed to so much English (right from it is born) that you might argue that it is hard for those kids not to become bilingual with English as their second native language. Hey, those kids even have to endure Disney Channel in English, and all the pop music that bellows out of their phones is in English! Edited by Iversen on 04 November 2013 at 2:28pm 5 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| Solfrid Cristin Heptaglot Winner TAC 2011 & 2012 Senior Member Norway Joined 5121 days ago 4143 posts - 8864 votes Speaks: Norwegian*, Spanish, Swedish, French, English, German, Italian Studies: Russian | Message 8 of 63 04 November 2013 at 12:27pm | IP Logged | ||
I know what you mean. There are times when I have to translate English terms that my kids are perfectly familiar with, and use in their Norwegian, and explain to them that we already have a term for that in Norwegian. My youngest daughter says she hates reading Norwegian and is more comfortable in English. Sigh. I am getting worried for the future of the smaller languages. 4 persons have voted this message useful |
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