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Chinese vs Indonesian: price/value ratio | ||
Tags: Indonesian | Mandarin | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Specific Languages |  | |
| Hungringo Triglot Senior Member United Kingdom Joined 3797 days ago 168 posts - 329 votes  Speaks: Hungarian*, English, Spanish Studies: French | Message 1 of 18 12 January 2014 at 4:15pm | IP Logged | ||
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I would like to know your opinion about what I call price/value ratio regarding the required time, effort etc. to learn Chinese (Mandarin) or Indonesian and their general usefulness.
I know that while the "price" element is more or less quantifiable (in hours of study), the "value" is a very vague concept. So when I say value and usefulness I mean financial, professional factors, but also cultural ones that might be needed to maintain your interest. For instance the price of learning Esperanto is very low, but (at least for me) its value is also very low, as knowing Esperanto wouldn't really boost your job prospects, neither could you visit and discover a new country and culture. Hence for me, however low its price is, Esperanto is just not worth it. I'd rather learn Spanish which is more difficult than Esperanto, but it's widely spoken, has potential financial benefits and I enjoy my adventures in Hispanic culture. How would you apply the above analogies to Chinese and Indonesian? Let's say you can reach a B2 in Indonesian in 1 year and in Chinese in 4 years. (I am just guessing.) What is the price/value ratio? Edited by Hungringo on 12 January 2014 at 5:18pm 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| tarvos Super Polyglot Winner TAC 2012 Senior Member China likeapolyglot.wordpr Joined 4516 days ago 5310 posts - 9399 votes Speaks: Dutch*, English, Swedish, French, Russian, German, Italian, Norwegian, Mandarin, Romanian, Afrikaans Studies: Greek, Modern Hebrew, Spanish, Portuguese, Czech, Korean, Esperanto, Finnish | Message 2 of 18 12 January 2014 at 5:15pm | IP Logged | ||
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I think job prospects and economy are an overrated concept because for me it's much
easier to move to Sweden to get a job than to China, even though there are many more Chinese people. Business cannot be simplified to say "1 billion Mandarin speakers". It doesn't really work that way at all. Job integration isn't only dependent on language, but also on culture, relative wealth of the population, and most importantly, your interest. I could make much more out of French and Russian than Chinese because I don't know any Chinese people here, but I know plenty of Russians, and a few francophones, but France/Belgium/Switzerland are easy to get to from where I live. Furthermore it depends on your sector as well, in which Indonesia may give more opportunities than Chinese, I don't know what you do for a living, so... So I'd find a business opportunity first, and then simply learn the language that you require for that. Edited by tarvos on 12 January 2014 at 5:16pm 7 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| Hungringo Triglot Senior Member United Kingdom Joined 3797 days ago 168 posts - 329 votes Speaks: Hungarian*, English, Spanish Studies: French | Message 3 of 18 12 January 2014 at 5:28pm | IP Logged | ||
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Well let's formulate it this way: If my initial assumption (Chinese requiring 4 times more time and effort than Indonesian) is true, then will a Chinese speaking tour guide or interpreter earn 4 times more than an Indonesian speaking one? Or will a Chinese speaking tour guide or interpreter have 4 times more job opportunities than an Indonesian speaking one? Edited by Hungringo on 12 January 2014 at 5:28pm 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| tarvos Super Polyglot Winner TAC 2012 Senior Member China likeapolyglot.wordpr Joined 4516 days ago 5310 posts - 9399 votes Speaks: Dutch*, English, Swedish, French, Russian, German, Italian, Norwegian, Mandarin, Romanian, Afrikaans Studies: Greek, Modern Hebrew, Spanish, Portuguese, Czech, Korean, Esperanto, Finnish | Message 4 of 18 12 January 2014 at 5:31pm | IP Logged | ||
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That depends on whether the initial assumption is true (4 times more effort to learn
what, exactly?), where in China, what variant of Chinese (Mandarin I assume?), the local government, bureaucracy, etc... I think Chinese will eventually be marginally more lucrative, but if your network consists of Indonesians... 2 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| Hungringo Triglot Senior Member United Kingdom Joined 3797 days ago 168 posts - 329 votes Speaks: Hungarian*, English, Spanish Studies: French | Message 5 of 18 12 January 2014 at 5:43pm | IP Logged | ||
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I have some basic understanding of Indonesian having gone through the Colloquial and TY books. I have much less experience with Chinese and at first glance I find that tones probably would be a bigger obstacle for me than the writing system.
I tend to believe that the price/value ratio would favour Indonesian. I have come across some young guys who spent a year in Indonesia with a scholarship and learnt the language so well as to become interpreters. On the other hand, the professor who taught me Chinese civilization at university had studied for several years in China but B2 was the highest level exam he was ever able to pass. Edited by Hungringo on 12 January 2014 at 5:51pm 2 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| Hungringo Triglot Senior Member United Kingdom Joined 3797 days ago 168 posts - 329 votes Speaks: Hungarian*, English, Spanish Studies: French | Message 6 of 18 12 January 2014 at 5:46pm | IP Logged | ||
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@tarvos I see you're learning Korean. What's your take on that language?
1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| tarvos Super Polyglot Winner TAC 2012 Senior Member China likeapolyglot.wordpr Joined 4516 days ago 5310 posts - 9399 votes Speaks: Dutch*, English, Swedish, French, Russian, German, Italian, Norwegian, Mandarin, Romanian, Afrikaans Studies: Greek, Modern Hebrew, Spanish, Portuguese, Czech, Korean, Esperanto, Finnish | Message 7 of 18 12 January 2014 at 5:50pm | IP Logged | ||
It's taking me a while to adapt to, but I'm also not always putting effort in due to other commitments. I don't really want to study it for any economic value either, I want to be able to understand enough when I travel to South Korea. So I don't really care from a price/value standpoint, because that's never been my motivation (travel and culture and social contacts are, to a lesser extent literature and history, and economy is basically last). I'm not fluent at all, but I don't know whether I will be or should be, so I don't really know whether that says anything. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| culebrilla Senior Member United States Joined 3806 days ago 246 posts - 436 votes Speaks: Spanish | Message 8 of 18 12 January 2014 at 6:59pm | IP Logged | ||
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Forbes published a study a few years ago showing that Spanish and French graduates didn't get a big boost from knowing their language, like 2-3%. People with good German had a bigger boost in income, probably since much fewer people know German in the US compared to the bigger two of Spanish and French. Arabic and Mandarin gave you even more of a boost in pay but the cost in time is obviously a lot higher for an English-speaking native.
Your individual circumstance is really most important but we obviously can speak about generalities in terms of economic benefit. If you live in Dearborn, MI, Arabic will probably be a bigger help in business than Spanish, for example. ("In Census 2000, 61.9% spoke only English, while 29.3% spoke Arabic") In your particular case, I would instead work on getting a very stable, well-paid degree or job. Languages are not a very good investment if you want money in general. 1 person has voted this message useful |
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