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Can You Learn Using Only the Fun Stuff | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Learning Techniques, Methods & Strategies |  | |
| iguanamon Pentaglot Senior Member Virgin Islands Speaks: Ladino Joined 5072 days ago 2237 posts - 6731 votes  Speaks: English*, Spanish, Portuguese, Haitian Creole, Creole (French) | Message 17 of 24 21 June 2014 at 1:45pm | IP Logged | ||
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"Fun" vs "Boring", I see this all the time here. Here's what I believe about it and others will have their own opinions. If all one does to learn is "boring" then it won't be much use. If all one does is "fun" then perhaps one may not be challenging oneself enough and may not be learning needed concepts efficiently. The multi-track approach is all about finding a balance. Too much one way, either way, and the highly beneficial effects of synergy are lost.
So yes, do fun stuff. Do lots and lots of fun stuff. Also, do some boring stuff. Many people find FSI/DLI courses "dry" and "boring" and, if that's all I were doing, I would too. Many beginners take one look at FSI/DLI and reject the courses out of hand because of this, but they're looking at it as an either/or situation and it isn't. Combined with and alongside native materials, the courses become more of a help in actually solving problems and fleshing out what is being observed in the real world. The concepts covered in the course become readily apparent because you won't be learning in the abstract, you'll be seeing this played out in the real world outside of "course world". That's what I mean by synergy. If you are systematically going through the course as well as engaging with native material, then each one will reinforce the other. You will have fun stuff to keep you engaged and learning and a well designed course to to give you explanations and show you how to manipulate the language. So, basically what I'm trying to say is- don't depend on learning materials for fun stuff, get that on your own, as you have been doing. The fact that FSI may be considered "dry" and "boring" is a good thing because the drills do exactly what the word "drill" implies. They tend to drill the concepts into your brain. I will gladly do them because I know that they will help me learn to use and speak the language better. They help me better understand what I am reading, speaking and hearing in the real world use of the language. For that, I will gladly put up with a half an hour or even an hour's worth of "boring" drills. I'll gladly watch the same episode of a telenovela a few times (on occasion) until I get it right, or more right, because I know I won't always have to do that. There's a lot of benefit from extensive use of native materials and there's also a time for intensive use. By doing some intensive work, I know I will get better. Yes, that isn't "fun". The end result is. Being proficient in the language is my ultimate fun. Edited by iguanamon on 21 June 2014 at 1:53pm 2 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| Stelle Bilingual Triglot Senior Member Canada tobefluent.com Joined 3954 days ago 949 posts - 1686 votes Speaks: French*, English*, Spanish Studies: Tagalog | Message 18 of 24 21 June 2014 at 1:48pm | IP Logged | ||
I want to do this *so badly*. My husband doesn't speak Spanish yet, but he has an interest. We've talked about going to Central America to study Spanish for a month sometime in the next few years. I love the idea of each of us working with a one-on-one teacher at our own level, and then exploring the area in the afternoons and evenings. In Guatemala and Honduras, it seems pretty typical to get 20 hours of one-on-one instruction plus home stay for anywhere between 175 and 300 dollars per week. (Although I'm not sure how my husband would feel about home stays. He's a person who likes his privacy.) 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Cavesa Triglot Senior Member Czech Republic Joined 4819 days ago 3277 posts - 6779 votes Speaks: Czech*, FrenchC2, EnglishC1 Studies: Spanish, German, Italian | Message 19 of 24 21 June 2014 at 5:15pm | IP Logged | ||
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Intensive courses are basically the same as the long ones. Yes, you have a semester in two weeks but
methods are the same, students and teachers are the same, the progress is still slow if you measure it by the difference in skills between the beginning of the course and the end (but instead of getting to the nowhere destination in three months, you are there in two weeks), lots of things are missing from the process. The only exception would be a course really focused on conversation and not even most of those are good. Whether the course is in the target language country or in your hometown matters little in my opinion. The benefits of going abroad are not in the quality of the course but in the rest of your stay from my experience. If you have trouble with conjugations, than you should focus on them. It is probably number one common obstacle keeping people from speaking as they get stuck on them all the time. Most say "that is because of learning grammar too much" while the opposite is true. Get those damn conjugations down, put the damn tables into anki and drill them aside of your other (and more fun) activities. :-D It should do miracles for your speech fluidity if you don't get stuck on those anymore. Once upon a time is no cartoon. It is an abc show about fairy tale characters being stuck in our world due to a curse. It is just an exemple of a good low intermediate friendly show I understand your dislike for repetitive intensive rewatching of tv series episodes. That is fine. But remember that extensive doesn't mean lazy. What you leave out when it comes to intensity, needs to be balanced by amount. From my experience, it is extremely useful to get a few large doses of listening when moving to the next step (such as to tv series with subtitles in tl or later the removal of the subtitles). How much time have you been putting into listening? It appears to me from reading other people's logs around here, that most of us can see a significant jump forward after approximately one season. First pieces of progress should come earlier but that seems to be more individual. Large doses of listening should help with your speaking skills as well. It helped me with the automaticity greatly and there are more benefits to it 2 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| Serpent Octoglot Senior Member Russian Federation serpent-849.livejour Joined 6407 days ago 9753 posts - 15779 votes 4 sounds Speaks: Russian*, English, FinnishC1, Latin, German, Italian, Spanish, Portuguese Studies: Danish, Romanian, Polish, Belarusian, Ukrainian, Croatian, Slovenian, Catalan, Czech, Galician, Dutch, Swedish | Message 20 of 24 21 June 2014 at 6:40pm | IP Logged | ||
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Very true about extensive learning not being the same as lazy/leisurely. It can be extremely energy-consuming.
I'd say use drills/grammar exercises only if you find them at least somewhat fun or if you REALLY need grammatical accuracy asap, more than you need a good comprehension/overall picture. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| shk00design Triglot Senior Member Canada Joined 4254 days ago 747 posts - 1123 votes Speaks: Cantonese*, English, Mandarin Studies: French | Message 21 of 24 22 June 2014 at 3:28am | IP Logged | ||
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People tend to associate "fun" with anything aimed or marketed to children. When I'm learning
languages, I listen to hours of politics in Mandarin on a local Chinese radio station. And I watch all sorts of TV programs online including: 中国达人秀 (the Chinese version of "America's Got Talent" / "Britain's Got Talent") and 星光大道 (a singing show like American Idol"). Besides the TV drama series, movies, there are cooking shows and Travel series that take you places. Kids learn by watching cartoons and other animated series, educational shows on science. Somehow people think of these shows as childish but on the other hand, there is nothing bad about watching too much TV as long as you do it for educational purposes like learning other languages. You still want to limit your daily viewing so that you can do regular exercises. Edited by shk00design on 22 June 2014 at 3:29am 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Serpent Octoglot Senior Member Russian Federation serpent-849.livejour Joined 6407 days ago 9753 posts - 15779 votes 4 sounds Speaks: Russian*, English, FinnishC1, Latin, German, Italian, Spanish, Portuguese Studies: Danish, Romanian, Polish, Belarusian, Ukrainian, Croatian, Slovenian, Catalan, Czech, Galician, Dutch, Swedish | Message 22 of 24 22 June 2014 at 5:05am | IP Logged | ||
2 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| Gemuse Senior Member Germany Joined 3892 days ago 818 posts - 1189 votes Speaks: English Studies: German | Message 23 of 24 22 June 2014 at 5:09pm | IP Logged | ||
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I am incredibly lazy, so *anything* which requires effort is not fun for me. At the same time, anything which will get me to my goal is not boring. So pretty much all of the learning activities I do are not fun, but at the same time not boring.
2 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| montmorency Diglot Senior Member United Kingdom Joined 4638 days ago 2371 posts - 3676 votes Speaks: English*, German Studies: Danish, Welsh | Message 24 of 24 29 June 2014 at 4:08pm | IP Logged | ||
As you like audio courses, and are seeking automaticity of speaking, I had been going to suggest your having a look at Say Something in Spanish. I have used and enjoyed Say Something in Welsh to which I have a monthly subscription, which I've enjoyed, and found extremely effective. Unfortunately, they seem to have changed their pricing policy for the Spanish one. I'm not 100% sure how it works now, but they seem to have removed the monthly subscription option, which would have allowed you to try the later lessons for not much money. You might try the free lessons that are available (you have to register, but that's free), and see if you like the method, although the early lessons may be to easy for you. However, if you like the tecnique, you could adapt it for yourself, probably with the help of your boyfriend: Just write a script consisting of a series of English sentences, of increasing complexity, and then go through them and say the Spanish equivalent as well as you can, then get boyf to correct you then repeat. You could try recording yourself if that might help. More generally, I'd say that fun is good, but challenging can also be good, so be prepared to challenge yourself, and just try to speak as much as possible, especially with native speakers. EDIT: Warming to the "challenging can also be fun" theme, as has been mentioned, podcasts for native speakers can be fairly long and challenging. The ones I like the best are those involving reasonably intellectual spontaneous discussions between 2 or more people (not too many), and are typically based on already-broadcast radio programmes. I haven't looked for such things in Spanish, but I'd be surprised if such things didn't exist somewhere in the Spanish-speaking world. That is still passive understanding in one sense, although you have to keep on your toes to follow the discussion, so it's "intellectually active", if I can put it that way. Edited by montmorency on 29 June 2014 at 8:35pm 1 person has voted this message useful |
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