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Learning multiple languages | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : General discussion |  | |
| Josquin Heptaglot Senior Member Germany Joined 4634 days ago 2266 posts - 3992 votes  Speaks: German*, English, French, Latin, Italian, Russian, Swedish Studies: Japanese, Irish, Portuguese, Persian | Message 17 of 23 24 June 2014 at 1:41pm | IP Logged | |||||
Close. It was Max Weber's Die protestantische Ethik und der Geist des Kapitalismus, one of the most influential books of the 20th century. Other than that, the influence of Protestantism in general and Puritanism in particular on American society certainly isn't to be underestimated. As Jeffers correctly said, the whole concept of Manifest Destiny is based on Calvinist ideas of being chosen and destined to do God's will. Edited by Josquin on 24 June 2014 at 1:53pm 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| Jeffers Senior Member United Kingdom Joined 4699 days ago 2151 posts - 3960 votes Speaks: English* Studies: Hindi, Ancient Greek, French, Sanskrit, German | Message 18 of 23 24 June 2014 at 2:25pm | IP Logged | |||||
I don't want to derail this thread too far, but it wasn't Max Weber I read. Of course the author made use of Weber's argument, but the author I read was writing in the 70s and 80s. I was thinking further along the lines of the discussion. This "work ethic" approach, the demand that everything you learn be "useful" is a further reason Americans are more likely to try to get a language to C1 or C2 before adding another. If you work in an office and can speak 3-4 languages to B1, that might be useful. But if there is anyone else in the office who can speak any of those languages to a C1 level, then they are the "go-to" person for that language, not you. In a large enough office, the person with 3-4 B1 languages is likely to be outclassed on every single one of them, and so never be called on to be the translator or contact for any of them. But if you can ensure that you know 1 other language better than anyone else in the office, then you become the point of contact. 2 persons have voted this message useful | ||||||
| kanewai Triglot Senior Member United States justpaste.it/kanewai Joined 4679 days ago 1386 posts - 3054 votes Speaks: English*, French, Marshallese Studies: Italian, Spanish | Message 19 of 23 24 June 2014 at 10:19pm | IP Logged | |||||
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I've always thought that "Calvinism" was something distinct from mainstream
Protestantism, and definitely different than the more Evangelical Great Awakenings. But when I tried to look up sources it seems that everyone has a different way of categorizing them. But I did find an interesting (and opinionated) article on multilingualism and the rise of national languages in the US and Europe: LR From the article: English nationalism has been around since at least the 16th century. Thomas More found out what happens to those who insist on a more internationalist view, as did others, but it was in the 19th century that states really began to insist on cultural conformity from their own citizens and the citizens of those living in their colonies and conquered territories. After 1870, the Italians simply made up a language based on a Tuscan variety. The French began demanding that all citizens speak the version of French spoken in Paris. Down the memory hold went languages like Piedmontese, Occitan, Mozarabic, and others. Since the time of Queen Isabella and the Reconquista, the rulers of unified Spain had been shoving Castilian down the throats of all Spaniards, and everyone in their colonies. They saw Castilian as a tool to hold the Empire together. Practically speaking, it was a good theory. Back when the United States was a free country, it was multilingual, and even a cursory look at 19th-century America reveals just how pervasive was the reality of a multilingual society: Louisiana was largely a French-speaking state (General Beauregard, Union Officer and later Confederate General, for example, didn’t speak English until he was 11 years old); German was widely spoken, and until World War I, and the anti-German bigotry that came with it, German-language private schools were common throughout the United States; New Mexico did not have an English-speaking majority until the 20th century; the Amish spoke the Pennsylvania German language; many Americans of the Maine and Vermont borderlands were French-speakers only. Edited by kanewai on 24 June 2014 at 10:21pm 3 persons have voted this message useful | ||||||
| BrianDeAlabama Groupie United States Joined 4309 days ago 89 posts - 113 votes Speaks: English* Studies: Spanish | Message 20 of 23 25 June 2014 at 4:11am | IP Logged | |||||
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I have not studied 2 languages before. I wanted to at least reach a solid intermediate level in Spanish before I
tackle anymore study goals or obligations. Where I live I can actually use Spanish regularly and most other languages would just be for personal pleasure except for Laotian because my in-laws are Lao-Americans. I've studied around 5 decent Spanish resources to a good degree and am currently finishing up Cortina's Spanish in 20 Lessons and about to start Assimil's Spanish with Ease. Listening & understanding Spanish had been a major weakness of mine because I had poor study habits but I have improved significantly over the last year & a half. Now I am about to embark on Lao and am considering Assimil's French with Ease. I could use French for future mission trips to Africa and plus Assimil seems to be have numerous languages I'd love to study but they are available only for French speakers. So I am about to start studying Lao and "dabbling" with French. I'll see how it goes. Edited by BrianDeAlabama on 25 June 2014 at 4:12am 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| Lugubert Heptaglot Senior Member Sweden Joined 6657 days ago 186 posts - 235 votes Speaks: Swedish*, Danish, Norwegian, EnglishC2, German, Dutch, French Studies: Mandarin, Hindi | Message 21 of 23 27 June 2014 at 12:48pm | IP Logged | |||||
OP:
Differs widely. When I was young, half a century ago, survival level in half a dozen of fairly related European languages seemed to be more than enough. Now, at 70+, I'm scared of Russia despite having passed University Russian 101, but am severely tempted to explore China which is quite beyond what I even get from my Lonely Planet guide book. Edited by Lugubert on 27 June 2014 at 12:49pm 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| PianoFish Newbie United Kingdom Joined 3599 days ago 11 posts - 28 votes Speaks: English* Studies: Italian, Mandarin, Japanese | Message 22 of 23 07 July 2014 at 11:41pm | IP Logged | |||||
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I learned French, Spanish, Italian and Japanese at various times in school and in one year I did all four at the same time. It was a nightmare, and not one I'm eager to repeat. Japanese had a bit of distance from the others but I especially strugged with separating Spanish and Italian. The problem was that my French and Spanish were maybe B1 at best, and that the course was mainly designed to get us an extra certificate to put on university applications rather than actually learn Italian. I passed because I could parrot the answers but I understood and absorbed very little, I've now started again more or less from scratch and am sticking to only Italian for a while to avoid confusion until it feels more secure.
Schools in the UK generally offer at least two languages, one of which is almost invariably French (Welsh is also compulsory in Wales and Irish in Northern Ireland, taught either as a first or second language). Language teaching in primary schools is a good idea but there are serious continuity issues. Mandarin is quite popular at primary level but very few secondary schools teach it, or they may split the year into two or three language groups and you end up in the German group in secondary although you did French in primary. I think the main problem with language teaching in the UK is extremely low expectations. One study by James Milton at Swansea University* estimated that GCSE candidates in French will know about 850 words, which is a) not a great deal objectively and b) not much to show for 5 years of studying a language. A grade C or above in a language GCSE is supposed to be B1, realistically I would say it's more like A2 but it varies a bit between languages. Add in several different exam boards with their own requirements and frequent (every 2-3 years in the last decade) structural changes to the exams and nobody really has much of a clue what it means to have a GCSE or A-level in X language. *https://www.llas.ac.uk/resources/paper/2715 Edited by PianoFish on 08 July 2014 at 12:56am 4 persons have voted this message useful | ||||||
| BaronBill Triglot Senior Member United States HowToLanguages.comRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 4479 days ago 335 posts - 594 votes Speaks: English*, French, German Studies: Spanish, Mandarin, Persian | Message 23 of 23 08 July 2014 at 6:48pm | IP Logged | |||||
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In response to the OP, I wrote a blog post several months ago about this very topic that pretty much sums up my take on multiple languages: Juggling Multiple Languages
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