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Lower fluency in native language | ||
Tags: Native Language | Fluency | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : General discussion |  | |
| glidefloss Senior Member United States Joined 5765 days ago 138 posts - 154 votes  Speaks: English* Studies: Spanish, French | Message 1 of 13 24 July 2014 at 7:57am | IP Logged |
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When learning a second language, when you get to the point you can understand sentences, do you find yourself
having a limited ability to use your primary language, especially after using L2 for many hours? 1 person has voted this message useful | |
| eyðimörk Triglot Senior Member France goo.gl/aT4FY7 Joined 3896 days ago 490 posts - 1158 votes Speaks: Swedish*, English, French Studies: Breton, Italian | Message 2 of 13 24 July 2014 at 8:52am | IP Logged |
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No, not really.
When I am immersed in an intense translation project, however, and I get interrupted, I often have a hard time switching out of my language pair and into a different language. Since I live in France, the interrupting language is usually French. I still understand French at the same level as before, but I sound like a bumbling idiot. It's like getting anywhere in French requires a completely different vehicle than English or Swedish, and in right that moment I find that I'm in the wrong vehicle, and although it kind of looks the same but none of the levers or buttons are in the right place and the steering wheel is on backwards. Even if I can get moving, it's not pretty and… look out, she's swerving! This is why I don't answer the phone while translating any more. Setting myself up for failure does nothing for my anxieties. At least when you answer the door you can smile, nod, and take your time when responding [incorrectly]. 5 persons have voted this message useful | |
 emk Diglot Moderator United States Joined 5329 days ago 2615 posts - 8806 votes Speaks: English*, FrenchB2 Studies: Spanish, Ancient Egyptian Personal Language Map | Message 3 of 13 24 July 2014 at 12:26pm | IP Logged |
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There's some good examples of this in the Middlebury Language Schools videos I posted in my log the other day:
Oops, I forgot my English! (Bloopers video) Just don't forget your English- Middlebury Language Schools This is mostly a very short-term effect; they took these videos 20 minutes after 7 weeks of absolute immersion. If I've been exclusively in French mode for several days, and I switch back to English, then it sometimes takes me 5 to 30 minutes to stop translating from French to English in my head. Another odd effect is that when I'm deeply immersed in French, my English listening comprehension goes down slightly, and I sometimes have trouble understanding people who speak English with very heavy accents. There's a much longer-term phenomenon called language attrition, where people can either lose their first language entirely (if they stop using it before puberty), or suffer loss of vocabulary and general fluency (if they stop using it after puberty). However, I've personally observed that L1 attrition can often be significantly reversed by a few days or weeks in full immersion with other native speakers. It's not so much that the language is gone; it's more like somebody stored it in the attic and let it get all dusty. 4 persons have voted this message useful | |
| Serpent Octoglot Senior Member Russian Federation serpent-849.livejour Joined 6394 days ago 9753 posts - 15779 votes 4 sounds Speaks: Russian*, English, FinnishC1, Latin, German, Italian, Spanish, Portuguese Studies: Danish, Romanian, Polish, Belarusian, Ukrainian, Croatian, Slovenian, Catalan, Czech, Galician, Dutch, Swedish | Message 4 of 13 24 July 2014 at 3:14pm | IP Logged |
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My Belarusian friend had to write in Russian, Belarusian AND English within a year of learning how to write. She said she would sometimes use the Latin letters instead of Cyrillics, especially when a letter is present in both scripts but read differently (m, B etc)
1 person has voted this message useful | |
| glidefloss Senior Member United States Joined 5765 days ago 138 posts - 154 votes Speaks: English* Studies: Spanish, French | Message 5 of 13 24 July 2014 at 9:50pm | IP Logged |
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I enjoyed those Middleburry videos immensely, even though they are advertisements. The halting speech and
mixed word order is similar to what I experienced yesterday when I had a minor breakthrough with my Spanish--I had been following along to Harry Potter 1 for four hours during work, and then had to speak English right afterwards. I doubt anyone else noticed my hesitation though. 1 person has voted this message useful | |
| shk00design Triglot Senior Member Canada Joined 4241 days ago 747 posts - 1123 votes Speaks: Cantonese*, English, Mandarin Studies: French | Message 6 of 13 25 July 2014 at 6:19am | IP Logged |
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When you are talking about learning languages, it depends on the circumstance. I know people who
were born in Hong Kong and spoke Cantonese in school. They went through primary school there before relocating to Canada. Cantonese is still considered their mother-tongue. They can still speak the language fluently because they watch a lot of TV programs online. However, the ability of writing Chinese characters is totally lost. When it comes to the language of correspondence, they would use English because they can write the language as well as speak. Part of the problem of why some people would let their Chinese language skills slide "intentionally" is because they were brought up in traditional families and an education system that focused on repetitive exercises and tests throughout the year. Another factor is that they were taught to respect their teachers as someone with many years of experience. The idea that people learn languages on their own wasn't popular in a place like Hong Kong many years ago. When someone who used to be more fluent in Chinese gets older, they tend to associate the language as being difficult to maintain without a teacher instead of learning on their own for fun and personal satisfaction. Edited by shk00design on 25 July 2014 at 6:22am 1 person has voted this message useful | |
| robarb Nonaglot Senior Member United States languagenpluson Joined 4856 days ago 361 posts - 921 votes Speaks: Portuguese, English*, German, Italian, Spanish, Dutch, Swedish, Esperanto, French Studies: Mandarin, Danish, Russian, Norwegian, Cantonese, Japanese, Korean, Polish, Greek, Latin, Nepali, Modern Hebrew | Message 7 of 13 27 July 2014 at 6:17am | IP Logged |
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Somewhat related, I find it very difficult to speak an L3 for the few minutes immediately after speaking an L2 for
anything upwards of 20 minutes. The effect on L1 is a lot weaker though, and I haven't ever noticed it in myself (although, unlike some others here, I can't recall the last time I went more than a day without using any English). I might have an opportunity to do so in a couple weeks while traveling though-- so I'll see what happens. 1 person has voted this message useful | |
| geoffw Triglot Senior Member United States Joined 4485 days ago 1134 posts - 1865 votes Speaks: English*, German, Yiddish Studies: Modern Hebrew, French, Dutch, Italian, Russian | Message 8 of 13 29 July 2014 at 3:16pm | IP Logged |
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I definitely experience this effect. I think the stronger the L2, the more the effect because you are more likely to
react in that L2. I find I develop lots of favorite expressions and expressive patterns. I end up wanting to say things that use whichever one feels the most appropriate, but I don't have a very good filter for making sure that I only select from a certain language, even for L1. So I find myself translating in my head from German, French, etc. and sometimes looking like I'm a bit slow. 1 person has voted this message useful |
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