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Shadowing or LR using News | ||
Tags: Shadowing | Listening-Reading (L-R) | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Learning Techniques, Methods & Strategies |  | |
| Chicken_Monster Newbie United States Joined 3585 days ago 26 posts - 27 votes Speaks: English* Studies: Spanish | Message 1 of 12 05 August 2014 at 5:02am | IP Logged | ||
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Rather lengthy five-part question follows. Any detailed suggested courses of action would be greatly
appreciated. (1) Is there a good way to shadow and/or LR using news (for example) with audio and text in both L1 and L2? (2) My understanding is that LR requires several hours at a time, and should be done with a novel. I can't do that (unless it was only on weekends -- probably not enough to be fruitful then?). (3) Shadowing might work. However, the news is generally read VERY rapidly (unlike Assimil). Additionally, I'm not sure if the English (L1) versions match the L2 translations correctly. Would this paradigm work at all? (4) How necessary is it to repeat out loud when shadowing? I would think shadowing could be modified such that there is no repeating required...just absorption of comprehensible input. I have heard from multiple experienced sources (including incredible language instructors) that the speaking part is not required (at least until later stages) for learning as long as one is receiving comprehensible input. Of course, the goal is to eventually be able to speak. (4) What is "advanced shadowing?" (5) How critical is "Scriptorium?" Again, any detailed suggested courses of action would be greatly appreciated. Thanks. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Via Diva Diglot Senior Member Russian Federation last.fm/user/viadivaRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 4030 days ago 1109 posts - 1427 votes  Speaks: Russian*, English Studies: German, Italian, French, Swedish, Esperanto, Czech, Greek | Message 2 of 12 05 August 2014 at 5:19am | IP Logged | ||
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I think L-R can be done even with a short thing, but you have to know this thing well. I would never L-R something I don't like or don't even know. But, well, I am not really experienced, maybe there is a way to L-R things you've never read before.
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| slucido Bilingual Diglot Senior Member Spain https://goo.gl/126Yv Joined 6471 days ago 1296 posts - 1781 votes 4 sounds Speaks: Spanish*, Catalan* Studies: English | Message 3 of 12 05 August 2014 at 9:49am | IP Logged | ||
I agree with Via Diva. Don't make this stuff too complicated. Keep it simple. Find some audio or video and its text and just listen-read one minute,ten minutes or twelve hours, but listen and read something. That's it. 2 persons have voted this message useful | |||
 jeff_lindqvist Diglot Moderator SwedenRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 6705 days ago 4250 posts - 5710 votes Speaks: Swedish*, English Studies: German, Spanish, Russian, Dutch, Mandarin, Esperanto, Irish, French Personal Language Map | Message 4 of 12 05 August 2014 at 5:21pm | IP Logged | ||
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(1) Is there a good way to shadow and/or LR using news (for example) with audio and text in both L1 and L2?
You can shadow news right away, as long as you feel you're able to keep up with the speed. Transcript is not necessary (but a transcript helps when the language/accent is very new to you). For LR - see below. (2) My understanding is that LR requires several hours at a time, and should be done with a novel. I can't do that (unless it was only on weekends -- probably not enough to be fruitful then?). The strong benefit is the intensity. You don't get the stamina of a marathon runner from running 100 meters. (3) Shadowing might work. However, the news is generally read VERY rapidly (unlike Assimil). Additionally, I'm not sure if the English (L1) versions match the L2 translations correctly. Would this paradigm work at all? Some are happy with barely keeping up with the narrator's speed during the first attempt. As you keep going, your ability to listen and repeat (more) simultaneously will improve. But this only applies if you believe that the method is beneficial at all. If not - don't do it. And again, shadowing doesn't require a transcript (nor a translation), but it helps, and it helps a lot more if it's close to the original text. In other words - a poetic translation may even be less useful than Google translate. (4) How necessary is it to repeat out loud when shadowing? I would think shadowing could be modified such that there is no repeating required...just absorption of comprehensible input.(...) Your voice follows the narrator like a shadow. If you don't follow the narrator, it's just listening. (4) What is "advanced shadowing?" No idea. (5) How critical is "Scriptorium?" It isn't a part of shadowing itself, although both methods can be used for attacking the same content. Typically, I write down a lesson after I've shadowed it several times (over a few days - similar to what Alexander Arguelles suggests). Hope this helps. Edited by jeff_lindqvist on 05 August 2014 at 5:28pm 2 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| Retinend Triglot Senior Member SpainRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 4104 days ago 283 posts - 557 votes Speaks: English*, German, Spanish Studies: Arabic (Written), French | Message 5 of 12 25 August 2014 at 11:18pm | IP Logged | ||
I think it's highly advisable. Writing the shadowed material down is a chance to analyse it closely. Also it naturalizes the writing system. It can also be kept as a condensed form of the original book, for later re-reading. Finally, it's the evidence of your own hard efforts, an object to take pride in. All of this is good for the memory. 3 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| kanewai Triglot Senior Member United States justpaste.it/kanewai Joined 4685 days ago 1386 posts - 3054 votes Speaks: English*, French, Marshallese Studies: Italian, Spanish | Message 6 of 12 26 August 2014 at 12:37am | IP Logged | ||
I agree with everyone above, but this more than anything. Use the basic technique, but play with it until you find a method that you enjoy. Shadowing and L/R to the news always seemed like an excellent idea to me, but I never managed to do it more than two days in a row. And while a lot of people on HTLAL can listen to an audiobook for hours, I find I get too distracted or impatient. For me, these techniques have worked best with short 3-5 page chapters out of novels that I like. And even then I tend to L/R a chapter, read a few more, L/R a few, etc. 2 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| montmorency Diglot Senior Member United Kingdom Joined 4624 days ago 2371 posts - 3676 votes Speaks: English*, German Studies: Danish, Welsh | Message 7 of 12 26 August 2014 at 1:19am | IP Logged | ||
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The specific reason for scriptorium, if I remember correctly, is to slow you down, so
that you pay attention. Whereas in shadowing, you are doing your best to keep up. (There may also be some subtle hand-eye-brain co-ordination thing going on, but that's more difficult to be specific about). 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Chicken_Monster Newbie United States Joined 3585 days ago 26 posts - 27 votes Speaks: English* Studies: Spanish | Message 8 of 12 26 August 2014 at 1:20am | IP Logged | ||
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I'm thinking that this way I can keep myself apprised of world, national, and/or local events while learning
a language at the same time. The only drawback I see is that the news is often read so fast. 1 person has voted this message useful |
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