Register  Login  Active Topics  Maps  

Language Learning Orthodoxy You Ignore

 Language Learning Forum : General discussion Post Reply
116 messages over 15 pages: << Previous 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 ... 14 15 Next >>
Ari
Heptaglot
Senior Member
Norway
Joined 4950 days ago

2314 posts - 5695 votes 
Speaks: Swedish*, English, French, Spanish, Portuguese, Mandarin, Cantonese
Studies: Czech, Latin, German

 
 Message 105 of 116
11 December 2014 at 6:01pm | IP Logged 
I still have a few vestiges of language conservatism that I'm trying to shed. It's mostly in writing, though. Intellectually, I think the Swedish word "juice" ought to be spelled, as some people spell it, "jos". When I have to write the word, I hesitate. "Jos" looks ridiculous to my poor brain, but I want to think it looks great. It's a little struggle every time I have to write the word.

In the spoken language, however, I have fewer problems. I pride myself on being able to hear "I couldn't care less" without cringeing, and one day I might even be able to use the expression myself without making a conscious effort. The same goes for "literally" being used to mean "figuratively". I mean, if literature isn't literal, we clearly need to change the meaning of one of those words, and some people are brave enough to be the vanguard of that movement.
1 person has voted this message useful



Josquin
Heptaglot
Senior Member
Germany
Joined 3212 days ago

2266 posts - 3992 votes 
Speaks: German*, English, French, Latin, Italian, Russian, Swedish
Studies: Japanese, Irish, Portuguese, Persian

 
 Message 106 of 116
11 December 2014 at 8:30pm | IP Logged 
Ari wrote:
In the spoken language, however, I have fewer problems. I pride myself on being able to hear "I couldn't care less" without cringeing, and one day I might even be able to use the expression myself without making a conscious effort.

I'm not sure if I got lost in your little game of sarcasm, but you are aware that "I couldn't care less" is the correct version of this idiom, aren't you?

"I could care less", however, is depraved of any meaning and sense. If you could care less than you actually do, you're still caring about the matter about which you meant to say that you don't care about it.

Edited by Josquin on 11 December 2014 at 8:33pm

4 persons have voted this message useful



Jeffers
Senior Member
United Kingdom
Joined 3277 days ago

2151 posts - 3960 votes 
Speaks: English*
Studies: Hindi, Ancient Greek, French, Sanskrit, German

 
 Message 107 of 116
11 December 2014 at 11:07pm | IP Logged 
[rant]In my limited experience, people who start a sentence with "I literally... " usually have something stupid or inane to say, so it's not surprising they don't understand the literal meaning of the word literal. I generally accept new idioms or new uses of old idioms, but when they actually don't make sense, I rage inwardly.[/rant]
2 persons have voted this message useful



vonPeterhof
Tetraglot
Senior Member
Russian FederationRegistered users can see my Skype Name
Joined 3140 days ago

715 posts - 1527 votes 
Speaks: Russian*, EnglishC2, Japanese, German
Studies: Kazakh, Korean, Norwegian, Turkish

 
 Message 108 of 116
11 December 2014 at 11:44pm | IP Logged 
I wonder if people got this annoyed back when "really" started to get used as a subjective intensifier rather than a marker of objective reality. Ditto for "truly" denoting something that isn't indisputable truth. Heck, even the most neutral-sounding intensifier "very" originally started out as a marker of truth (etymologically related to "veritable", "veracious" and the French "vrai"). Looks like, at least in English, the desire to exaggerate consistently outweighs the demand for a word unequivocally denoting that one means exactly what one says. Not even exaggerating here, this whole thing quite literally makes my blood boil, I s**t you not ;)
5 persons have voted this message useful



chokofingrz
Pentaglot
Senior Member
England
Joined 3557 days ago

241 posts - 430 votes 
Speaks: English*, French, Spanish, German, Italian
Studies: Russian, Japanese, Catalan, Luxembourgish

 
 Message 109 of 116
12 December 2014 at 1:03am | IP Logged 
Jeffers wrote:
[rant]In my limited experience, people who start a sentence with "I literally... " usually have something stupid or inane to say, so it's not surprising they don't understand the literal meaning of the word literal. I generally accept new idioms or new uses of old idioms, but when they actually don't make sense, I rage inwardly.[/rant]


Knowing that the OED officially acknowledged the construction you describe as acceptable last year, my eyes literally popped out of my head when I read your post! :p
1 person has voted this message useful



chiara-sai
Triglot
Groupie
United Kingdom
Joined 2076 days ago

54 posts - 146 votes 
Speaks: Italian*, EnglishC2, French
Studies: German, Japanese

 
 Message 110 of 116
12 December 2014 at 3:18pm | IP Logged 
Josquin wrote:
Ari wrote:
In the spoken language, however, I have fewer problems. I pride myself on
being able to hear "I couldn't care less" without cringeing, and one day I might even be able to use the
expression myself without making a conscious effort.

I'm not sure if I got lost in your little game of sarcasm, but you are aware that "I couldn't care less" is the
correct version of this idiom, aren't you?

"I could care less", however, is depraved of any meaning and sense. If you could care less than you actually
do, you're still caring about the matter about which you meant to say that you don't care about it.


‘I couldn’t care less’ is also a lie, because I think most people could care less when they claim that they
couldn’t. Indeed the least you care about it the least likely you may be to even bothered saying that you do not
care about it, and saying ‘could’ instead of ‘couldn’t’ saves you one syllable which means you’ll be wasting
less time talking about something you do not care about.
I know I’m being a bit of a devil’s advocate here, but I think in the end people should just accept that human
language is often not supposed to be interpreted literally.
2 persons have voted this message useful



Jeffers
Senior Member
United Kingdom
Joined 3277 days ago

2151 posts - 3960 votes 
Speaks: English*
Studies: Hindi, Ancient Greek, French, Sanskrit, German

 
 Message 111 of 116
12 December 2014 at 3:52pm | IP Logged 
chiara-sai wrote:
I think in the end people should just accept that human
language is often not supposed to be interpreted literally.


Never?

(Begin endless loop)

Edited by Jeffers on 12 December 2014 at 3:53pm

1 person has voted this message useful



Ari
Heptaglot
Senior Member
Norway
Joined 4950 days ago

2314 posts - 5695 votes 
Speaks: Swedish*, English, French, Spanish, Portuguese, Mandarin, Cantonese
Studies: Czech, Latin, German

 
 Message 112 of 116
12 December 2014 at 8:26pm | IP Logged 
Josquin wrote:
I'm not sure if I got lost in your little game of sarcasm, but you are aware that "I couldn't care less" is the correct version of this idiom, aren't you?

"I could care less", however, is depraved of any meaning and sense. If you could care less than you actually do, you're still caring about the matter about which you meant to say that you don't care about it.


Haha, typo, or Freudian slip, maybe. Yes, of course I meant "I could care less". I love that expression. I always imagine there's a little "… but it wouldn't be easy" or something like that. "I couldn't care less", on the other hand, is just dull and unimaginative. Language at its worst. What's the point of having a set expression if it just means what the words mean? It's like saying "You shouldn't say 'pardon my French' unless you're actually speaking French. The correct expression is 'pardon my curse'". People who get upset about "I could care less" are taking all the joy out of language.

Edited by Ari on 12 December 2014 at 8:28pm



4 persons have voted this message useful



This discussion contains 116 messages over 15 pages: << Prev 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15  Next >>


Post ReplyPost New Topic Printable version Printable version

You cannot post new topics in this forum - You cannot reply to topics in this forum - You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum - You cannot create polls in this forum - You cannot vote in polls in this forum


This page was generated in 0.3594 seconds.


DHTML Menu By Milonic JavaScript
Copyright 2020 FX Micheloud - All rights reserved
No part of this website may be copied by any means without my written authorization.