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Radioclare’s tac log 2015 (*jäŋe/*ledús) | ||
Tags: Macedonian | Serbian | Serbo-Croatian | Croatian | Esperanto | Total Annihilation Challenge (TAC) | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Language Learning Log |  | |
| basica Senior Member Australia Joined 3323 days ago 157 posts - 269 votes  Studies: Serbian | Message 105 of 292 25 March 2015 at 12:26am | IP Logged | ||||||||
This is the nature of languages though. You look at a lot of languages today and they have big portions of their vocabulary imported from other languages. A lot of English vocabulary is based on French or Latin words, but they were imported so long ago we think of them as English words now without cognizance of their foreignness. For me I'm glad if there are foreign loan words in use - less for me to learn and easier for me to hook onto the word even if the meaning is different :) 1 person has voted this message useful | |||||||||
| Radioclare Triglot Senior Member United Kingdom timeofftakeoff.com Joined 4370 days ago 689 posts - 1119 votes Speaks: English*, German, Esperanto Studies: Croatian, Serbian, Macedonian | Message 106 of 292 25 March 2015 at 10:12am | IP Logged | ||||||||
Always nice to find someone else who is interested in learning these languages :) I wouldn't be discouraged by how long it has taken me to reach B1; I've been learning for three years now, but not very efficiently. I started learning some tourist Croatian for an upcoming trip in 2012, made some progress, let it slip, made some more progress, let it slip etc until I started keeping a log here in 2014 and that inspired me to study more regularly. You can probably achieve a lot more if you are more disciplined and less lazy :) I never intended to learn Croatian but when I went there for the first time in 2012, I immediately fell in love with the country. Also I had been periodically trying and failing to learn a Slavic language for years but Croatian seemed significantly easier to me than the others I had tried so I was able to make good progress with it straight away. Since then I've developed a wider interest in the history and culture of the whole region and I love travelling there :) 2 persons have voted this message useful | |||||||||
| Chung Diglot Senior Member Joined 6943 days ago 4228 posts - 8259 votes 20 sounds Speaks: English*, French Studies: Polish, Slovak, Uzbek, Turkish, Korean, Finnish | Message 107 of 292 25 March 2015 at 5:59pm | IP Logged | ||||||||
Apart from the benefit of internationalisms as outsiders learning a foreign language, I can relate at least partially to Radioclare's point. There are just some loanwords that'll rub a user (native or non-native) the wrong way regardless of their age or length of attestation. It's not always because they're foreign as much as they tend to be used in ways to convey a non-linguistic distinction/barrier that's tied to relative social or educational standing. I'm very aware that languages change and also have noticeable stocks of words from other languages. As it relates to BCMS/SC, I've actually made pointed comments about Croatian language planning and politically-motivated purism (see here) not to mention analyses showing that many items (not just internationalisms) thought to be exclusive to Serbian are also valid in Croatian regardless of how Croatian language planning bodies favor different forms or calques and/or neologisms (see here for an example). 3 persons have voted this message useful | |||||||||
| basica Senior Member Australia Joined 3323 days ago 157 posts - 269 votes Studies: Serbian | Message 108 of 292 26 March 2015 at 12:36am | IP Logged | ||||||||
I understand where you two are coming from, I was just adding my 2 cents into the matter :) As for your other comments, I don't particularly have any strong opinions on the matter and wasn't really commenting on that aspect :) 1 person has voted this message useful | |||||||||
| Radioclare Triglot Senior Member United Kingdom timeofftakeoff.com Joined 4370 days ago 689 posts - 1119 votes Speaks: English*, German, Esperanto Studies: Croatian, Serbian, Macedonian | Message 109 of 292 29 March 2015 at 8:24pm | IP Logged | ||||||||
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Hmm, what have I been up to this week?
I've just finished reading a German Krimi called Herzblut, which is the seventh in my favourite series about Kommissar Kluftinger. Reading in German is fun - and so much easier than reading in Croatian :) I've watched another couple of episodes of 'Budva na pjenu od mora'. The storyline remains extremely exciting and something which is really nice about the third series is that they don't have the five-minute recaps at the start of the programme anymore :D I feel like I understand more and more each time but I really need to find a Croatian series to watch as well, because I don't want to end up with a funny Montenegrin accent :D Something particularly interesting in the past couple of episodes has been the introduction of a second Russian character. There is already one Russian character, who seems to speak Serbian in a fairly neutral way as far as I can tell but throws in the odd Russian word every now and again so that we remember what her nationality is supposed to be. For example she always says "ne znaju" rather than "ne znam", there are a lot of "nyet"s and yesterday she said something which definitely wasn't "čovjek" but which sounded quite similar (perhaps "čelovek"). Without wishing to spoil the storyline, someone from her past in Russia has turned up in Budva and it is clear that he is up to no good. He also speaks Serbian pretty fluently - arguably better as he hasn't been throwing in random Russian words - but with a really funny accent that makes him sound quite sinister. In the first scene where they met a few episodes ago I was a bit nervous because they stood and had a long conversation with each other in Russian and I was thinking "Eek, I hope fluent Russian isn't presumed knowledge for following the rest of the plot!". But actually I don't think we were supposed to understand - I think the viewer was supposed to be empathising with the non- comprehension of a Montenegrin character who was also in the room - and every conversation they have had in Russian since has been helpfully subtitled :) My Output Challenge reading aloud is currently at 177 minutes following the third chapter of 'Sumrak' today. My Output Challenge writing hasn't progressed as I thought I might do some grammar revision this weekend instead in order to ultimately make my writing more accurate. I've been revising some of the earlier chapters of the BCS textbook but struggling to stay focused. Perhaps it wasn't such a good idea. Probably best not to mention Macedonian. I'm really struggling for motivation. It's not that I don't want to learn it but somehow I keep lacking the energy to start. I actually feel more tempted to restart Czech at the moment in preparation for my weekend in Prague in August. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||||||||
| tarvos Super Polyglot Winner TAC 2012 Senior Member China likeapolyglot.wordpr Joined 4494 days ago 5310 posts - 9399 votes Speaks: Dutch*, English, Swedish, French, Russian, German, Italian, Norwegian, Mandarin, Romanian, Afrikaans Studies: Greek, Modern Hebrew, Spanish, Portuguese, Czech, Korean, Esperanto, Finnish | Message 110 of 292 31 March 2015 at 4:15am | IP Logged | ||||||||
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Человек means "human being, person" in Russian, it can by extension also mean "man". If
you're overly sexist of course. 2 persons have voted this message useful | |||||||||
| Radioclare Triglot Senior Member United Kingdom timeofftakeoff.com Joined 4370 days ago 689 posts - 1119 votes Speaks: English*, German, Esperanto Studies: Croatian, Serbian, Macedonian | Message 111 of 292 31 March 2015 at 10:58pm | IP Logged | ||||||||
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Thank you, tarvos :) It sounds like it has the same meaning as čovjek in Croatian then :)
I'm interested to know though, does человек have a regular plural in Russian or is there a completely different word to mean "people"? (In Croatian the plural of čovjek is ljudi) 1 person has voted this message useful | |||||||||
| tarvos Super Polyglot Winner TAC 2012 Senior Member China likeapolyglot.wordpr Joined 4494 days ago 5310 posts - 9399 votes Speaks: Dutch*, English, Swedish, French, Russian, German, Italian, Norwegian, Mandarin, Romanian, Afrikaans Studies: Greek, Modern Hebrew, Spanish, Portuguese, Czech, Korean, Esperanto, Finnish | Message 112 of 292 01 April 2015 at 3:43am | IP Logged | ||||||||
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It does. The plural of человек in Russian is indeed люди. However, after large numerals
(when mentioning the numbers of attendees at a concert or football game, for example), you will often simply see человек used instead: Вчера 3000 человек поучаствовали в митинге за права человека в центре Москвы. "Yesterday 3000 people attended a demonstration for human rights in the center of Moscow". Edited by tarvos on 04 April 2015 at 4:57pm 2 persons have voted this message useful |
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