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Only listen! | ||
Tags: Listening | Learning Strategy | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Learning Techniques, Methods & Strategies |  | |
| Farley Triglot Senior Member United States Joined 6874 days ago 681 posts - 739 votes  1 sounds Speaks: English*, GermanB1, French Studies: Spanish | Message 65 of 90 10 April 2007 at 3:51pm | IP Logged | |||||
I know the feeling. I tried shadowing just after trying Pimsleur and was just as lost. There is defiantly a skill to shadowing or chorusing separate from language learning. It must have something to with aural abilities, at least the ones I don’t have. I’m green with envy of those who can. That gets me to the point I wanted to make, even though listening only brought me to a certain point (and then left me high and dry) it got me past a certain point. Instead of having to work very hard at pronunciation, I just listened until I was able to do the “see it and say it” style workbook exercises and read dialogs. Shadowing comes with practice, but how much, at least for some of us? That is the point of a listen only tactic at the beginning of language study, to give your ear a chance to adapt. Once you are to the point when you can start speaking you will have to change tactics, but at least the listening will move you past the initial pronunciation difficulties. 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
 jeff_lindqvist Diglot Moderator SwedenRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 6691 days ago 4250 posts - 5710 votes Speaks: Swedish*, English Studies: German, Spanish, Russian, Dutch, Mandarin, Esperanto, Irish, French Personal Language Map | Message 66 of 90 10 April 2007 at 4:39pm | IP Logged | |||||
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Something just struck me - shadowing exists in other disciplines than language learning. At least I have "shadowed" a lot when I "learned" thousands of Irish fiddle tunes. I just put on any record and "played along". In the beginning my ears weren't that good but they got better and better. OK, I could never shadow a tune "perfectly" (bearing in mind that they are played at rapid speed - several notes per second), but I developed the skill so I could easily learn a tune after just a few rounds at half-speed (to the amazement of my fellow musicians).
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| frenkeld Diglot Senior Member United States Joined 6725 days ago 2042 posts - 2719 votes Speaks: Russian*, English Studies: German | Message 67 of 90 10 April 2007 at 4:49pm | IP Logged | |||||
Many of us have used Audacity to speed up slow dialogs, but it can also be used to slow down audiobooks, radio broadcasts, etc. Perhaps something to try, although not at half-speed, of course. Edited by frenkeld on 10 April 2007 at 4:50pm 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| Farley Triglot Senior Member United States Joined 6874 days ago 681 posts - 739 votes 1 sounds Speaks: English*, GermanB1, French Studies: Spanish | Message 68 of 90 10 April 2007 at 5:02pm | IP Logged | |||||
The term for that is Audiation. I actually got a chance to meet the Dr Gordon, who coined the term. Rather than give my one off explanation he gave me I'll just quote his own words:
Edited by Farley on 10 April 2007 at 5:03pm 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| maxb Diglot Senior Member Sweden Joined 6965 days ago 536 posts - 589 votes 7 sounds Speaks: Swedish*, English Studies: Mandarin | Message 69 of 90 11 April 2007 at 6:04am | IP Logged | |||||
I see no real disadvantages when it comes to internalizing the intonation of a language. Furthermore nothing prevents you from combining the chorus method with extensive listening. I mostly agree with the listening approach when it comes to that you should stay away from free production in the language until you have internalized a great deal of it. However I am not sure that prounuciation will automatically take care of itself just by listening. Actually it doesn't for children either. The babbling stage that most children go through before they start speaking "for real" is, from what I have read, a way for them to practice and play with the intonation of the surrounding language. The main point about using the chorus method is to internalize the prosody (melody and rhythm) of the language. Many researchers believe that the successful language acquistion of a child depends on how well they have mastered the prosody of the language. Children learn prosody first before they master the individual sounds. Olle Kjellin beleives that if children learn the prosody first, so should adults. Thus the chorus method is a way for adults to master the prosody of the language they are learning, to the level that they have mastered the prosody of their native language. If you spend a couple of weeks on the learning the prosody of the language you are learning the rest of the language acquisition will become so much easier. You will be able to imitate sentences in the language much quicker. Also when you hear an unknown word you will be able to pronunce it right away. 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| Farley Triglot Senior Member United States Joined 6874 days ago 681 posts - 739 votes 1 sounds Speaks: English*, GermanB1, French Studies: Spanish | Message 70 of 90 11 April 2007 at 8:00am | IP Logged | |||||
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Based on the feedback from Maxb, Slucido and others to this topic, it sounds as if that listen, chorusing and shadowing are just logical stages of an auditory process, rather than distinct options for internalizing sound.
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| reineke Senior Member United States https://learnalangua Joined 6229 days ago 851 posts - 1008 votes Studies: German | Message 71 of 90 11 April 2007 at 10:29am | IP Logged | |||||
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Echoing: repeating after the speaker is finished
Chorusing: no written text to follow, you repeat with a split second delay after the speaker. It's possible to do with audio tapes. Shadowing - following a tape mentally? He edits the tape for gaps. Then "I then shadow this tape repeatedly until I begin to grow familiar with the pronunciation and intonation, and until I have figured out as much as I can of what is being said on my own. Then I turn to the book and shadow while reading the teaching language so that I understand globally what I have been saying. Slowly I switch to shadowing while reading the target language so that I learn to read it. Each day I go through the notes of several lessons to catch the fine points. When I have done them all, I then write or type out the target language lessons in their entirety, sometimes several times. In other words, I thoroughly internalize the contents of both books and tapes. I know that I am "done" when I can successfully "play" the advanced lessons through my brain while I am taking a shower." The first part would be very difficult to do aloud in the very beginning. Shadowing somehow suggests silence. Edited by reineke on 11 April 2007 at 10:34am 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| mjcdchess Diglot Groupie United States Joined 6729 days ago 46 posts - 48 votes Speaks: English*, Spanish | Message 72 of 90 11 April 2007 at 3:07pm | IP Logged | |||||
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It sounds like if you listened enough you would become familar with the words and phrases but not actually know what they all mean. That perhaps would make actual vocabulary learning eaiser.
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