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Listening-Reading system

 Language Learning Forum : Learning Techniques, Methods & Strategies (Topic Closed Topic Closed) Post Reply
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HTale
Bilingual Diglot
Senior Member
United Kingdom
Joined 4455 days ago

164 posts - 167 votes 
Speaks: English*, Arabic (Written)*
Studies: French

 
 Message 161 of 489
25 July 2007 at 2:34pm | IP Logged 
fanatic wrote:
I don't think the last word on language learning has been written yet.


Nor will it ever be, I guess. The beauty of learning a language is that someone can take a beaten path or pave their own, and almost always reach the same destination: fluency. The condition in which you arrive in is another question altogether.

Edited by HTale on 25 July 2007 at 2:35pm

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Iversen
Super Polyglot
Moderator
Denmark
berejst.dk
Joined 4780 days ago

9078 posts - 16470 votes 
Speaks: Danish*, French, English, German, Italian, Spanish, Portuguese, Dutch, Swedish, Esperanto, Romanian, Catalan
Studies: Afrikaans, Greek, Norwegian, Russian, Serbian, Icelandic, Latin, Irish, Lowland Scots, Indonesian, Polish, Croatian
Personal Language Map

 
 Message 162 of 489
25 July 2007 at 6:23pm | IP Logged 
I have learnt two things from this thread.

The most unexpected is how easy it is to follow the reading of a text in a totally unknown language, if you just have a fairly literal translation. I have for some times used this technique with Greek and Russian (it has no meaning to do it with languages where you already understand almost everything), though not for as long time as intended by siomotteikiru. Today I tried to do the same thing with a couple of Persian texts from the GLOSS collection, and yes, it is possible to follow somebody speaking a totally unknown language, just with intonation, the word Esfahan and a few guesses as a help. But I still feel that it helps to know a fair number of words and some grammar beforehand.

The other thing I have learnt is that it is both fun and easy (but time-consuming) to construct interlaced bilingual texts, using the technique I proposed earlier in this thread. You can't make the separations inside sentences unless you already know quite a bit of both languages, but you certainly don't have to be an expert. And because you have to compare the two versions all the time you do in fact learn a lot during the process.

So even if I don't follow the five steps laid down by siomotteikiru her method has certainly had an impact on my study habits, and that's no mean feat.

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Zhuangzi
Nonaglot
Language Program Publisher
Senior Member
Canada
lingq.com
Joined 5105 days ago

646 posts - 687 votes 
Speaks: English*, French, Japanese, Swedish, Mandarin, Cantonese, German, Italian, Spanish
Studies: Russian

 
 Message 163 of 489
25 July 2007 at 11:29pm | IP Logged 
Iversen,

The test of different ways of learning is how long you continue to find them useful.Initial enthusiasm can sometimes peter out as one finds little return in terms of learning. I tried interlaced bilingual texts for easy Russian content when I started Russian. I eventually found them annoying and discontinued.

On the other hand listening to one language and reading in another is something I am continuing to enjoy. To each his own (or her own).
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siomotteikiru
Senior Member
Zaire
Joined 4438 days ago

102 posts - 240 votes 

 
 Message 164 of 489
25 July 2007 at 11:36pm | IP Logged 
More on "listening-reading" and learning in:

www.stultorum.pochta.ru\aaaa\!siomotteikiru_Phi-Staszek_List ening-reading_The gist_in_Polish.7z

If you don't know Polish, hak ci w smak.
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Zhuangzi
Nonaglot
Language Program Publisher
Senior Member
Canada
lingq.com
Joined 5105 days ago

646 posts - 687 votes 
Speaks: English*, French, Japanese, Swedish, Mandarin, Cantonese, German, Italian, Spanish
Studies: Russian

 
 Message 165 of 489
26 July 2007 at 1:31am | IP Logged 
After 80 pages of "listening-reading" to Anna Karenina, I find I prefer to read and listen separately.

I think this "listening-reading" strategy, for me at least, is a means to get into a new book, or perhaps to get into a new language. In the long run when I sit down to dedicate myself to the language I prefer to read in the language, either on the computer if there are a lot of unknown words, or from a book, if I can.

Otherwise I listen when I am on the move and doing something else. And I listen often, repetitively, if I am still not confident in the language.

By the way, has anyone had experience with scanning pens to look up words when reading from a book, and then to upload them to a computer later. Do you know of any that work for Russian?

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siomotteikiru
Senior Member
Zaire
Joined 4438 days ago

102 posts - 240 votes 

 
 Message 166 of 489
26 July 2007 at 1:46am | IP Logged 
Why I think teachers are crooks:


A. S. Neill
    The New Summerhill
    edited by Albert Lamb

Allan Bloom
THE CLOSING OF THE AMERICAN MIND
How Higher Education Has Failed Democracy and Impoverished the Souls of Today's Students

Glenn Doman
Jennet Doman
HOW TO TEACH YOUR BABY TO READ
Silent Revolution
www.stultorum.pochta.ru\aaaa\How_to_teach002.jpg
www.stultorum.pochta.ru\aaaa\A_teacher_For_Phi-Staszek.JPG


Some parallel texts:
www.stultorum.pochta.ru\aaaa\Andersen_The_Little_Mermaid_Eng _Spanish_German_Polish.7z
www.stultorum.pochta.ru\aaaa\Russell_Bertrand_The_Problems_o f_Philosophy_Eng-French.7z



There should be no spaces in the links above.

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siomotteikiru
Senior Member
Zaire
Joined 4438 days ago

102 posts - 240 votes 

 
 Message 167 of 489
26 July 2007 at 2:03am | IP Logged 
When you’ve come to the stage of „natural listening” to fairly difficult novels, “listening-reading” is no longer necessary.
“Listening-reading” is for LEARNING a language, not using it.

When you read without first mastering the proper pronunciation of the foreign language, you’ll pronounce words and sentences in your native way. That is exactly the case with Zhuangzi’s Russian – I listened to his vid on YouTube.

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Volte
Tetraglot
Senior Member
Switzerland
Joined 4516 days ago

4474 posts - 6724 votes 
Speaks: English*, Esperanto, German, Italian
Studies: French, Finnish, Mandarin, Japanese

 
 Message 168 of 489
26 July 2007 at 2:56am | IP Logged 
siomotteikiru wrote:
Why I think teachers are crooks:


A. S. Neill
    The New Summerhill
    edited by Albert Lamb

Allan Bloom
THE CLOSING OF THE AMERICAN MIND
How Higher Education Has Failed Democracy and Impoverished the Souls of Today's Students

Glenn Doman
Jennet Doman
HOW TO TEACH YOUR BABY TO READ
Silent Revolution
www.stultorum.pochta.ru\aaaa\How_to_teach002.jpg
www.stultorum.pochta.ru\aaaa\A_teacher_For_Phi-Staszek.JPG


Some parallel texts:
www.stultorum.pochta.ru\aaaa\Andersen_The_Little_Mermaid_Eng _Spanish_German_Polish.7z
www.stultorum.pochta.ru\aaaa\Russell_Bertrand_The_Problems_o f_Philosophy_Eng-French.7z



There should be no spaces in the links above.


I'd add John Taylor Gatto's "The Underground History of American Education" to that list..

Links made clickable:
www.stultorum.pochta.ru\aaaa\How_to_teach002.jpg
www.stultorum.pochta.ru\aaaa\A_teacher_For_Phi-Staszek.JPG
www.stultorum.pochta.ru\aaaa\Andersen_The_Little_Mermaid_Eng _Spanish_German_Polish.7z
www.stultorum.pochta.ru\aaaa\Russell_Bertrand_The_Problems_o f_Philosophy_Eng-French.7z




1 person has voted this message useful



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