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Beginning Russian Advice? | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Advice Center |  | |
| yuriFromRoma Groupie Italy Joined 4713 days ago 48 posts - 69 votes  Speaks: Italian* Studies: English, Russian | Message 57 of 70 12 April 2012 at 11:59pm | IP Logged | ||||||||
I guess you can download it on uz-translations (note: registration is required) or, since is legal, maybe you can just do a little search on some torrent engine. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||||||||
| Марк Senior Member Russian Federation Joined 5056 days ago 2096 posts - 2972 votes Speaks: Russian* | Message 58 of 70 13 April 2012 at 7:57pm | IP Logged | ||||||||
In the modern Russian Щ is pronounced as soft Ш. The Assimil is wrong. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||||||||
| yuriFromRoma Groupie Italy Joined 4713 days ago 48 posts - 69 votes Speaks: Italian* Studies: English, Russian | Message 59 of 70 14 April 2012 at 1:33am | IP Logged | ||||||||
I'm not sure I can grasp the difference with a foolproof reliability. Anyway, if Assimil is wrong, then also FSI is wrong because they teach the very same pronunciation in Russian FAST (link here, page 21):
Edited by yuriFromRoma on 14 April 2012 at 1:41am 1 person has voted this message useful | |||||||||
| s0fist Diglot Senior Member United States Joined 5046 days ago 260 posts - 445 votes Speaks: Russian*, English Studies: Sign Language, German, Spanish, French | Message 60 of 70 14 April 2012 at 8:04am | IP Logged | ||||||||
Pronouncing sh_ch requires changing tongue position from sh to ch rapidly. The Russian Щ like Ш is a sibilant that can be sibilated for as long as you have breath for, without requiring changing tongue position in your mouth. Pretend you can speak parseltongue and practice Щ and Ш as one continuous sibilant sound. 4 persons have voted this message useful | |||||||||
| Марк Senior Member Russian Federation Joined 5056 days ago 2096 posts - 2972 votes Speaks: Russian* | Message 61 of 70 14 April 2012 at 9:13am | IP Logged | ||||||||
Yes, it is wrong. Find such pronunciation somewhere. "Shcha (Щ щ; italics: Щ щ) is a letter of the Cyrillic script. In Russian, it represents the voiceless alveolo-palatal fricative /ɕɕ/, similar to the pronunciation of ⟨sh⟩ in sheep (but longer); in Ukrainian and Rusyn it represents the consonant cluster /ʃt͡ʃ/; and in Bulgarian, it represents the consonant cluster /ʃt/. In English, Shcha is romanized as ⟨shch⟩ or ⟨šč⟩ (with hačeks), both reflecting the historical Russian pronunciation of the letter. This can lead to some confusion, as the ⟨ch⟩ in the transcription may seem to indicate that Щ is a combination of Ш and a strong Ч, which is not true." http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shcha "Historically in Russian, Shcha represented the consonant cluster /ɕt͡ɕ/[citation needed], like in the phrase "fresh cheese." Some Russian language primers still prescribe /ɕtɕ/." Edited by Марк on 14 April 2012 at 3:10pm 3 persons have voted this message useful | |||||||||
| yuriFromRoma Groupie Italy Joined 4713 days ago 48 posts - 69 votes Speaks: Italian* Studies: English, Russian | Message 62 of 70 14 April 2012 at 4:26pm | IP Logged | ||||||||
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thank both of you for the further clarification, I guess this is one of the most common foreign's pronunciation errors! I think I can feel some difference between ш/щ, but yet I'm not sure where it is. I'll try harder. Edited by yuriFromRoma on 14 April 2012 at 4:28pm 1 person has voted this message useful | |||||||||
| Gabriel Anton Diglot Newbie United States Joined 4603 days ago 10 posts - 26 votes Speaks: English*, Spanish Studies: Persian, Pashto | Message 63 of 70 20 April 2012 at 7:13pm | IP Logged | ||||||||
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Seeing so many responses I became excited, only to find pages of native speakers berating students for
not having perfect pronunciation. I'd like to be suprised but this sort of attitude is something I've encountered before - great language, but I wonder if the people are worth the effort. Think I'll give German another look. 2 persons have voted this message useful | |||||||||
| Марк Senior Member Russian Federation Joined 5056 days ago 2096 posts - 2972 votes Speaks: Russian* | Message 64 of 70 20 April 2012 at 7:51pm | IP Logged | ||||||||
I did not understand you. No one is berating students here. I'm arguing against wrong attempts and wrong ideas about Russian phonology. When people say that Щ is pronounced shch or the hard sign is a short pause inside a word or that a soft consonant is a consonant + y, or that soft-hard distinction is not important for understanding. How can I agree with that? 6 persons have voted this message useful |
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