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 Language Learning Forum : Specific Languages |  | |
| Marc Frisch Heptaglot Senior Member Germany Joined 6663 days ago 1001 posts - 1169 votes  Speaks: German*, French, English, Spanish, Portuguese, Turkish, Italian Studies: Persian, Tamil | Message 33 of 47 25 November 2006 at 6:03am | IP Logged | ||||||||
You might not be aware of it, but English books ARE frequently translated into American, i.e. they adapt spelling and some words to American usage. Look for the first Harry Potter book on amazon.com and you'll find 'Harry Potter and the sorcerer's stone'. On amazon.co.uk it's 'Harry Potter and the philosopher's stone'. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||||||||
| Captain Haddock Diglot Senior Member Japan kanjicabinet.tumblr. Joined 6766 days ago 2282 posts - 2814 votes Speaks: English*, Japanese Studies: French, Korean, Ancient Greek | Message 34 of 47 25 November 2006 at 6:52am | IP Logged | ||||||||
It seems to me Harry Potter is quite an unusual case. Also, its being "translated" for Americans is highly criticized and seen somewhat as a dumbing-down. Harry Potter notwithstanding, I agree that it's absurd. As a young child, I even read British books in early modern English (full of thees and thous) with no problem. It's all one language. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||||||||
| Chung Diglot Senior Member Joined 7154 days ago 4228 posts - 8259 votes 20 sounds Speaks: English*, French Studies: Polish, Slovak, Uzbek, Turkish, Korean, Finnish | Message 35 of 47 25 November 2006 at 1:34pm | IP Logged | ||||||||
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I'm not sure if you can count the case of Harry Potter as "translation"
Those adjustments anyway do sound absurd and can indeed be seen as patronizing to readers who do not use the Queen's English, and not just Americans. I don't know about others, but when I check a bookstore for copies of works in British literature after 1700 such as Dickens, Tolkien, Pope, Swift, Wordsworth, Austen, Kipling etc., as far as I can tell they are unabridged and in the original. There's no mention about them being "North American", "Australian" or "Indian" etc. editions. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||||||||
| vesna Triglot Newbie Yugoslavia Joined 6596 days ago 1 posts - 1 votes Speaks: Serbian*, Greek, English | Message 36 of 47 25 November 2006 at 7:50pm | IP Logged | ||||||||
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I study languages to understand people. More languages I know - more people I can understand. Then comes other knowledges around particular language - I start to be interested in particular country, about people's mentality, about their history, geografy, etc. etc.
Especially important is history. History explains a lot - not only people and their behaviour but, also, influences of other cultures and, therefore, other languages. So, my advice for today ;) is: learn ALWAYS history when you study the language! And, to the point: if you knew (no offense!) history of Serbian and Croatian people, you would call these two languages AS THEY ARE - SERBIAN language and CROATIAN language. First and BASIC difference of these two languages is that official (also by heritage, tradition and custom) alphabet in Serbia is Cyrillic alphabet (azbuka) and in Croatia is Roman (Latin) alphabet (abeceda). If you are, really, interested in any of these languages - the rest you'll have to learn by yourself (no pain - no gain!) :) But, if anybody needs some small help (especially about Serbian language - as I am Serbian) - I'll be here. :) 1 person has voted this message useful | |||||||||
| salvius Bilingual Diglot Newbie Canada Joined 6582 days ago 22 posts - 22 votes Speaks: English*, Serbo-Croatian* Studies: French, German | Message 37 of 47 28 November 2006 at 8:48am | IP Logged | ||||||||
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Here's the example of the thoroughly absurd translation into Bosnian, Croatian, and Serbian from central bank in Bosnia (note, few diacritics are missing).
CILJEVI I ZADACI Osnovni ciljevi i zadaci Centralne banke su utvrđeni Zakonom saglasno Općem okvirnom sporazumu za mir u BiH. Centralna banka Bosne i Hercegovine održava monetarnu stabilnost u skladu s currency board aranžmanom (1KM : 0,51129 EURO), što znači da izdaje domaću valutu uz puno pokriće u slobodnim konvertibilnim deviznim sredstvima po fiksnom kursu 1 KM: 0,51129 EURO. Centralna banka definira i kontrolira provođenje monetarne politike Bosne i Hercegovine. Centralna banka upravlja službenim deviznim rezervama ostvarenim izdavanjem domaće valute. Centralna banka pomaže i održava odgovarajuće platne i obračunske sisteme. Također koordinira djelatnosti agencija za bankarstvo bh. entiteta, koje su nadležne za izdavanje dozvola za rad i superviziju banaka. ---------------- CILJEVI I ZADACI Osnovni ciljevi i zadaci Centralne banke su utvrdeni zakonom sukladno Opcem okvirnom sporazumu za mir u BiH. Centralna banka Bosne i Hercegovine održava monetarnu stabilnost u skladu s currency board aranžmanom (1KM : 0,51129 EURO), što znaci da izdaje domacu valutu uz puno pokrice u slobodnim konvertibilnim deviznim sredstvima po fiksnom kursu 1KM : 0,51129 EURO. Centralna banka definira i kontrolira provodenje monetarne politike Bosne i Hercegovine. Centralna banka upravlja službenim deviznim rezervama ostvarenim izdavanjem domace valute. Centralna banka pomaže i održava odgovarajuce platne i obracunske sisteme. Također koordinira djelatnosti agencija za bankarstvo be-ha entiteta, koje su nadležne za izdavanje dozvola za rad i superviziju banaka. ------------------------------------------------ ЦИЉЕВИ И ЗАДАЦИ Основни циљеви и задаци Централне банке су утврђени законом сагласно Општем оквирном споразуму за мир у БиХ. Централна банка Босне и Херцеговине одржава монетарну стабилност у складу са "currency board" аранжманом (1КМ : 0,51129 ЕURO), што значи да издаје домаћу валуту уз пуно покриће у слободним конвертибилним девизним средствима по фиксном курсу 1КМ : 0.51129 ЕURO. Централна банка дефинише и контролише провођење монетарне политике Босне и Херцеговине. Централна банка управља службеним девизним резервама оствареним издавањем домаће валуте. Централна банка помаже и одржава одговарајуће платне и обрачунске системе. Такође координирање дјелатности агенција за банкарство бх. ентитета, кoје су надлежне за издавање дозвола за рад и супервизију банака. Edited by salvius on 28 November 2006 at 8:50am 1 person has voted this message useful | |||||||||
| gidler Senior Member Finland Joined 6621 days ago 109 posts - 118 votes 1 sounds Speaks: Finnish* | Message 38 of 47 28 November 2006 at 9:51am | IP Logged | ||||||||
At least it's a chance for machine translation to actually produce high-quality results! :) 2 persons have voted this message useful | |||||||||
| Marin Triglot Groupie Croatia Joined 7057 days ago 50 posts - 51 votes Speaks: Croatian*, English, Italian Studies: German, Russian, Persian | Message 39 of 47 30 November 2006 at 9:12am | IP Logged | ||||||||
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In Croatian "središnja" is used rather then "centralna", "kurs" is not used (in this sentence it should be "tečaj"), instead of "sistem" we use "sustav". :) But these are only details, I think we all agreed that Serbian and Croatian are at least 90% identical. That was never the issue here.
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| Martien Heptaglot Senior Member Netherlands martienvanwanrooij.n Joined 7103 days ago 134 posts - 148 votes Speaks: Dutch*, English, German, Spanish, Turkish, Italian, French Studies: Portuguese, Serbo-Croatian, Latin, Swedish, Arabic (Written) | Message 40 of 47 02 December 2006 at 1:45pm | IP Logged | ||||||||
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First of all I am not up to making any political statement at all and really do not want to offend any Serb, Croat, Bosnian but what I learned about 35 years ago was "Yugoslavian" . I told also in other topics how I learned languages from immigrant workers in the Netherlands, especially Spanish and Turkish and also a reasonable amount of Moroccan Arabic. My "Yugoslavian" was good enough to make myself understood with immigrants who didn't speak enough Dutch or German (even with the community from Kosovo that came to the Netherlands in the sixties). Later I got able to distinguish certain futures of the differences, 1985 I was in Pula and they said that my Croatian was okay, and when I was working for immigrants in the Netherlands as a social worker (I did this job from 1977 to 1999) immigrants said that my Serbian was okay. After 1990 the situation became a little bit more difficult.Refugees came especially from Bosnia and since some of them didn't speak any foreign languages at all, I had to speak with them in the language I learned and often would apologise for using the wrong word and emphasising that I would never use such a word for political reasons. In most countries I will feel a bit disappointed when people switch to English when answering my questions in their local language but to be honest, in the beforementioned Balkan countries I will start in English myself!
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