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When you meet target-language speakers... | ||
Tags: Native Speakers | Speaking | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Cultural Experiences in Foreign Languages |  | |
| shk00design Triglot Senior Member Canada Joined 4441 days ago 747 posts - 1123 votes  Speaks: Cantonese*, English, Mandarin Studies: French | Message 17 of 22 01 December 2014 at 8:49am | IP Logged | ||||||||
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In the Chinese community people tend to be forgiving for someone's lack of language abilities. In the past, every
Chinese province has a main dialect and half-dozen related sub-dialects. People from 1 region of the country have trouble understanding another. Now most people tend to be able to speak either Cantonese or Mandarin because of education and improved communications. People who are Mandarin-speakers normally assume Cantonese-speakers are not fluent in their Chinese dialect. I've come across dinner parties where Cantonese-speakers would sit quietly while Mandarin-speakers had their discussions. The Chinese normally find it cumbersome to translate back and forth so that everyone at the party would be included in a discussion. The ones who are fluent in English would switch to accommodate other Chinese who do not speak their dialect. It is common for Chinese people to introduce themselves in the beginning of a conversion where they or the ancestors came from. There was 1 dinner party 2 people were carrying on a conversation in Mandarin. 1 came from Sichuan China and speaks her native dialect and Mandarin. The other with parents from Shanghai speaks Shanghainese and Cantonese. He studied Mandarin for a few years and did a convincing job at it. Shanghainese isn't Mandarin but the pronunciation of certain words & phrases are very close. Depending on the situation and how comfortable you feel about getting into a conversation. The last time I was at a dinner party, a lady from China was talking to a White lady native to Canada about Chinese movies. The White lady with no knowledge of Chinese mentioned the name "Raise the Red Lantern" from the 1980s directed by Zhang Yimou. The Chinese lady turned to me looking a bit confused and I provided her with the Chinese name: 大红灯笼高高挂. A lot depends on the individual whether he/she feels her (lack of) language skills would slow a conversation by constant interruptions where 1 person has rely on translations. 2 persons have voted this message useful | |||||||||
| garyb Triglot Senior Member ScotlandRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 5204 days ago 1468 posts - 2413 votes Speaks: English*, Italian, French Studies: Spanish | Message 18 of 22 01 December 2014 at 10:29am | IP Logged | ||||||||
Yep, this is generally my experience too. I like beano's idea, but in practice, speakers of other languages learning English and English speakers learning other languages are very different situations with different standards. I'm sure it's partly due to the importance and dominance of English: people mainly learn English out of necessity, and other languages out of desire (even when living in-country - we all know the stories of expat bubbles). French and Italian speakers will often ask you with a confused look why you're bothering to learn their language, and are quite confused by the idea of people doing it just for pleasure, while English learners' motivations are so obvious that there's no need to ask. Even when they have praise, there can be a condescending note to it; I know several Italians who will say "oh, Gary speaks great Italian" yet they refuse to actually speak it with me and they see it as some sort of party trick. And indeed the perception that English speakers don't seriously learn other languages doesn't help. People will often just assume that you only know some set phrases ("oh, you speak Italian, what do you know how to say?") and it can take some effort to convince them that you've made a serious effort and have some sort of autonomy in the language, even if you have the level to prove it. And I'm sure it's nothing personal, it's just because it's so uncommon. Maybe if more of us started learning foreign languages the perception would change and people would take us more seriously? :) Of course, I've also had good experiences, and some people have been all the more impressed at the effort I've made and curious to speak their language with me just because it's rare. 3 persons have voted this message useful | |||||||||
| Jeffers Senior Member United Kingdom Joined 4906 days ago 2151 posts - 3960 votes Speaks: English* Studies: Hindi, Ancient Greek, French, Sanskrit, German | Message 19 of 22 01 December 2014 at 11:59am | IP Logged | ||||||||
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I think in general, the kind of people who don't care that I'm learning their language are the kind of people I wouldn't have much to say to anyway. If they only see a utility in foreign languages, we probably don't have much in common.
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| Zireael Triglot Senior Member Poland Joined 4648 days ago 518 posts - 636 votes Speaks: Polish*, EnglishB2, Spanish Studies: German, Sign Language, Tok Pisin, Arabic (Yemeni), Old English | Message 20 of 22 01 December 2014 at 5:25pm | IP Logged | ||||||||
LOL, I get those all the time. Even for my Arabic, which is A1-A2 and in speaking only amounts to basic pleasantries. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||||||||
| liam.pike1 Groupie Australia Joined 3751 days ago 84 posts - 122 votes Speaks: English* Studies: Spanish, Esperanto, French | Message 21 of 22 09 December 2014 at 5:15am | IP Logged | ||||||||
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I just came back from New Zealand, and I stayed at a lodge where everyone spoke foreign languages (or they spoke English in a very foreign accent). I shared a room with a young man who happened to be from New Caledonia. He was here learning English. I only just started studying French a couple of weeks ago, so I couldn't converse with him in French, but I sure wish that I could!
While in Queenstown I ate at a Mexican restaurant, and I said 'gracias' to the waiter who served me. He then smiled and replied 'de nada'. I got to exchange a few words with him in Spanish, and we got talking (now in English) about what we were both doing here and why I am learning Spanish. I later realised that this was the first time that I had talked with someone in their native language. It was a wake up call for me. When I go back to learning Spanish I will definitely focus on the 'speaking' part. So yeah, use your target languages when you can I reckon! Then again, due to my very young age people will more likely find it cute that I'm learning another language... with a 60 year old man, maybe not so... 1 person has voted this message useful | |||||||||
| beano Diglot Senior Member United KingdomRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 4619 days ago 1049 posts - 2152 votes Speaks: English*, German Studies: Russian, Serbian, Hungarian | Message 22 of 22 17 December 2014 at 4:15pm | IP Logged | ||||||||
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There are many stereotypes regarding native speakers' attitudes towards being approached in their language. The Swedish and Dutch will switch to English at the merest hint of a foreign accent. The Germans are more tolerant in this respect but will insist upon English after the first major grammatical mistake. Finns will be rendered speechless by the fact that their incredibly useless language is being learned by someone from another country. The French will engage but will barely conceal their outright contempt for your less than perfect command of their tongue. The American will talk back in English to everyone because all 7 billion people on the planet know English. Hungarians will just flat-out refuse to believe that anyone can string a sentence together in the world's hardest language. Brits will make no effort to simplify their speech and will solve any communication issues by increasing the volume. Italians and Spaniards will be so enthused at your attempts that everyone present will start speaking at the same time. Indians only value maths and computer programming skills so don't count on them sharing their knowledge of Hindi or Punjabi with you. The Japanese are more accommodating but there will be an awkward pause as they struggle to process the fact that a non-native has actually just spoken Japanese.
I largely ignore all these pre-conceived ideas. A warm and friendly approach, with a bit of self-deprecating humour thrown in will easily enable you to strike up a conversation. That's my experience anyway. 6 persons have voted this message useful |
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