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TAC 2009-2011 Fasulye’s Turkish / Danish | ||
Tags: Study Group | Class Learning | L3 via L2 | Danish | Self-Study | Turkish | Textbooks | Total Annihilation Challenge (TAC) | ||
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 Fasulye Heptaglot Winner TAC 2012 Moderator Germany fasulyespolyglotblog Joined 5840 days ago 5460 posts - 6006 votes  1 sounds Speaks: German*, DutchC1, EnglishB2, French, Italian, Spanish, Esperanto Studies: Latin, Danish, Norwegian, Turkish Personal Language Map | Message 457 of 868 30 January 2010 at 6:05pm | IP Logged | ||
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Cumartesi, 30 ocak 2010
SELF-STUDY TURKISH: Lextra Sprachkurs Türkisch, Bölüm 2, Week 4 I am more sneezing than writing, but anyhow I have managed to work through the whole Unit 2 of this textbook today. What strikes me is that in the grammar explanations they explain very basic German grammar features, which I had already learned in the lower classes at school. This gives me the impression that the authors of this book address people learning their first foreign language. For me it's a bit ridiculous as I read in this book for example: "Wörter wie "gehen", "sitzen" oder "sein" werden "Verben" genannt. "Bin", "bist" und "ist" sind alle unterschiedliche Formen des Verbs "sein". " For polyglots it's a kind of strange to read such explanations on a child's level. But for the rest I don't have to complain about the structure of this book. I would only prefer to have the audios monolingually in Turkish without so many annotations in German. This was better with the other textbooks I used so far. There is no new grammar for me in Bölüm 2, so I will present the new vocabulary: - memur = der Beamte, die Beamtin - memur bey = Herr Beamter - memur hanım = Frau Beamtin - milliyet = die Nationalität - Hollandalı = der, die Niederländer(in) - salep = die heiße Gewürzmilch - İskocalı = der Schotte, die Schottin - sıkıcı = langweilig - şef = der Chef, die Chefin - boyacı = der Schuhputzjunge - geliş (von gelmek) = die Ankunft - gidiş (von gitmek) = die Abfahrt - piliç = das Hähnchen - köfte = die Frikadelle - aynı = das Gleiche - kör = blind - körsün = du bist blind - bir buçuk = 1,5 - iki buçuk = 2,5 Fasulye Edited by Fasulye on 30 January 2010 at 9:13pm 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Fasulye Heptaglot Winner TAC 2012 Moderator Germany fasulyespolyglotblog Joined 5840 days ago 5460 posts - 6006 votes 1 sounds Speaks: German*, DutchC1, EnglishB2, French, Italian, Spanish, Esperanto Studies: Latin, Danish, Norwegian, Turkish Personal Language Map | Message 458 of 868 02 February 2010 at 12:07am | IP Logged | ||
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MY DOUBTS ABOUT LANGUAGE ACTIVATION - TURKISH AND DANISH
Perhaps I should talk about this topic in my TAC log. I have no previous experience with language self-study, so my 6 foreign languages, which I am able to speak and write actively, cannot work as a model. I personally have doubts, whether I can reach the active language level in Turkish and Danish. To activate the languages I need the thinking level in both languages. I have no natural immersion situation in both languages like a conversation group, where I can assimilate. I have really learned my speaking of foreign languages in classes. So I have my doubts about what is possible to reach by doing language self-study. I think in five years of study it has to be possible to activate the languages. (I have now almost two years of Turkish studies behind me.) Otherwise I may have to accept that both languages will only remain passive. On my language learning this will have no influence, I will just continue my language studies for the next 10 years and beyond. Fasulye Edited by Fasulye on 02 February 2010 at 12:12am 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Fasulye Heptaglot Winner TAC 2012 Moderator Germany fasulyespolyglotblog Joined 5840 days ago 5460 posts - 6006 votes 1 sounds Speaks: German*, DutchC1, EnglishB2, French, Italian, Spanish, Esperanto Studies: Latin, Danish, Norwegian, Turkish Personal Language Map | Message 459 of 868 06 February 2010 at 5:47pm | IP Logged | ||
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Lørdag, 06 februar 2010
ZELF-STUDIE DEENS: Les 9 van "Einstieg Dänisch", week 5 Ik ben al wat langer bezig met deze Deense les. Inhoudelijk gaat het om een treinreis van København naar Århus, dus Sandra staat op het station van København (daar ben ik al geweest!) en wil een treinbillet naar Århus kopen. Wat me hierbij opvalt is, dat de Deense taal hier sterk lijkt op het Nederlands. Ik geef maar een paar voorbeelden: DK: et spor = NL: het spoor = der Bahnsteig DK: en ankomst = NL: de aankomst = die Ankunft DK: tusind = NL: duizend En mijn grammatica-highlight: het Nederlandse woordje "ER" heet in het Deens "DER". Bijvoorbeeld: DER afgå et tog klokken syv. = ER vertekt een trein om zeven uur. Hvornår går DER et tog pø lørdag? = Wanneer gaat ER een trein op zaterdag? Voor mij zijn dit de twee enige talen die zo'n woordje ER/DER hebben, het gebruik ervan was in de begintijd van mijn Nederlands voor mij zeer moeilijk te leren. Nu zit dat volledig in mijn taalgevoel, dus zodoende zal ik met het Deense woordje "DER" geen moeite hebben. Nog een paar belangrijke zinnen voor de treinreis (of mijn treinreis naar Denemarken): 1. Jeg vil gerne have en billet til København. 2. Skal det være en enekltbillet eller en retourbillet? 3. En retourbillet til Krefeld. 4. Hvornår går der et tog pa søndag til Hamburg? 5. Skal vi skifte? (Müssen wir umsteigen?) 6. Nej, det skal I ikke. (Nein, das braucht ihr / das brauchen Sie nicht.) 7. God tur! (Gute Reise.) 8. Hav det godt! (Mach's gut.) 9. I lige måde. (Gleichfalls.) Dus dit vond ik een zeer praktijk-georienteerde les van het Deens. Net was ik nog ermee bezig om de laaste twee lessen voortelezen en met mijn memorecorder optenemen en daarna afteluisteren. Ik vind wel dat nu mijn "zachte d" wat authentieker klingt, ik heb me de laaste tijd er zeer op geconcetreerd om deze letter beter uittespreken. Fasulye Edited by Fasulye on 10 February 2010 at 7:19pm 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Fasulye Heptaglot Winner TAC 2012 Moderator Germany fasulyespolyglotblog Joined 5840 days ago 5460 posts - 6006 votes 1 sounds Speaks: German*, DutchC1, EnglishB2, French, Italian, Spanish, Esperanto Studies: Latin, Danish, Norwegian, Turkish Personal Language Map | Message 460 of 868 10 February 2010 at 7:05pm | IP Logged | ||
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Çarşamba, 10 şubat 2010
SELF-STUDY TURKISH: Bölüm 3 of "Lextra Sprachkurs Türkisch", Week 6 (altıncı hafta) This unit contains two dialogues in Turkish restaurant, I was already quite familiar with such dialogues before, but I aprreciate reading and listening to them very much, because this is Turkish of practical use. It might happen to me that sit in a Turkish restaurant in Krefeld and think of "How would I say that in Turkish?". Quite abundant grammar clarifications of topics I already know, so the grammar part is of good quality. This will become relevant for me in the more advanced units of this book. Now I just read through this part and remember... I enjoy so much working through all the language exercises of such a lesson! If there were even more exercises I could do this all day long just for the fun of it. It's a very nice mixture of writing and listening exercises. On this beginner level I understand the dialogues - even without the text - for 100 %. I must smile, because there were two listening exercises, where you had to distinguish between voiced and unvoiced Turkish consonants. As a background I had watched all of Glossika's You Tube videos on the topic of the IPA, where he presents the voiced, unvoiced and aspirated consonants of many different languages, that I find these exercises here a breeze! There is one very interesting feature in this textbook. In every unit there is a photograph of some Turkish signs or posters or leaflets with a Turkish text written on it. So this is authentic use of the language, like for tourists who visit Turkey. The textbook doesn't ask of the students to understand the full meaning, but I have more background knowledge, so I use my dictionary to understand ALL of it. I think that the most interesting part to present here is the new vocabulary: köşe = die Ecke karanlık = dunkel aydınlık = hell mönü = das Menü işte = voilà (en français) kavun = die Honigmelone acılı = eine scharfe Vorspeise karides = Garnelen midye = die Muschel tava = die Bratpfanne, das Pfannengericht kalamar = der Tintenfisch koymak = setzen, stellen, legen Yeter! = Genug! börek = die Pastete tuz = das Salz durmak = anhalten durak = die Haltestelle meydan = der zentrale Platz raf = das Regal düz = geradeaus gemi = das Schiff hareket = die Abfahrt halk = das Volk tekstil = textil dondurma = das Speiseeis canım = mein Schatz Fasulye Edited by Fasulye on 10 February 2010 at 9:09pm 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Fasulye Heptaglot Winner TAC 2012 Moderator Germany fasulyespolyglotblog Joined 5840 days ago 5460 posts - 6006 votes 1 sounds Speaks: German*, DutchC1, EnglishB2, French, Italian, Spanish, Esperanto Studies: Latin, Danish, Norwegian, Turkish Personal Language Map | Message 461 of 868 13 February 2010 at 8:00pm | IP Logged | ||
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Lørdag, 12 februar 2010
SELF-STUDY DANISH, "Einstieg Dänisch" Unit 10, Week 6 I dag arbejdede jeg på lektion 10 fra "Einstieg Dänisch". The topic of today were the forms of the preterite (Präteritum). På dansk: præteritum! I made an Excel-list in Open Office with the irregular forms (Stammformen) of the most important Danish verbs as far as they will be presented in my textbook. I will deal with them regularly to be able to memorize them. The usage of the preterite in Danish is equivalent to Past Tense in English, this is not equivalent with the usage of German and Dutch. But I understood the rule, this is what counts. Let me present the readers of my log some preterite sentences of my exercises of Unit 10: 1. Vi var til fodbold. 2. Han så en handboldkamp. 3. De spillede tennis. 4. Han spisede tre stykker smørrebrød. 5. Hun kom for sent. 6. Vi kiggede på København. 7. Jeg så guldaldermalerne. 8. Vi mødte Lise. 9. Du var til fodbold i Parken. 10. Jeg sejlede med færgen. 11. Du cyklede i Kongens Have. 12. I går arbejdede Lene over. 13. Vi havde meget arbejde i forgårs. 14. Jeg skrev en brev i morges. 15. Hvor var du i går? I have been waiting for long to learn such important verb forms. In the next unit the perfect forms will be presented. From then on I will be able to try to write texts of the past tenses. It's still difficult to formulate anything myself, my vocabulary is far too limited now. Let's see how my Danish knowledge further develops... Fasulye Edited by Fasulye on 13 February 2010 at 8:10pm 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Fasulye Heptaglot Winner TAC 2012 Moderator Germany fasulyespolyglotblog Joined 5840 days ago 5460 posts - 6006 votes 1 sounds Speaks: German*, DutchC1, EnglishB2, French, Italian, Spanish, Esperanto Studies: Latin, Danish, Norwegian, Turkish Personal Language Map | Message 462 of 868 20 February 2010 at 8:08pm | IP Logged | ||
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Cumartesi, 20 şubat 2010
SELF-STUDY Turkish: Bölüm 4 of "Lextra Sprachkurs Türkisch", Week 7 This saturday I worked through Unit 4 of my textbook. There are two dialogues with a typical situation with an European as a customer in a Turkish carpet shop. There are two different types of Turkish carpets: halı and kilim (EDIT). Often it occurs that buyer and seller haggle about the price of the carpet. This also takes place in the the two dialogues. It lies in the Turkish mentality to haggle about prices, whereas it's not typical for Germans. One topic of this unit are the different family members and the Genitive-possessive construction, which is already known to me. Fellow Turkish students will know which grammar topic I mean, so I will not repeat it hear. There are mistakes in the book like for example the word "baskant" instead of the correct "başkent" for the capital of a country. Quite often it occurs that words are used in the exercises or dialogues which are not listed up in the vocabulary. This irks me a bit because I always have to take my dictionary with my to my study place (which often is in our mediothek). So let me present the new vocabulary: İsveçli = der Schwede Vallahi = bei Gott Acelem var = Ich habe es eilig özel = besonders kaliteli (EDIT) = hochwertig şaka = der Witz pazarlık yapmak = feilschen (= to haggle) dükkan = das Geschäft kibrit = das Streichholz etsiz = vegetarisch (!!!) Çin = China Çinli = der Chinese, die Chinesin Japonya = Japan Japon = der Japaner, die Japanerin Macaristan = Ungarn Macar = der Ungar, die Ungarin Rusya = Russland Rus = der Russe, die Russin sevgilerle = liebe Grüße girmek = hineingehen müzisyen = der Musiker ilk yardım = erste Hilfe kirli = dreckig, schmutzig tatsız = fade, geschmacklos kuzen = der Cousin, die Cousine torun = der Enkel tam = genau lüks = luxuriös çimen = das Gras havuç = die Karotte turuncu = orange (Farbe) fiş = die Rechnung, die Quittung fişsiz = ohne Rechnung oldu = tamam = peki = OK, einverstanden Fasulye Edited by Fasulye on 22 February 2010 at 1:40pm 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Hobbema Senior Member United States Joined 5734 days ago 541 posts - 575 votes Speaks: English* Studies: Portuguese, French, Dutch | Message 463 of 868 21 February 2010 at 8:54pm | IP Logged | ||
I myself have only been studying my languages for the last couple of years, so I'm not as familiar with the terms and concepts. "Language activation", and "passive" skills I think I understand, and those terms would be consistent with my concept of fluency, which would be the ability to think in a language? So once a language is activated, am I right in assuming the skill level is to the point where I can think, speak without doing conscious translation, as well as being able to see groups of words and recognize their meaning without having to translate sequentially word by word? In that case I have a long way to go. But you could say that the fun is in the journey, and not necessarily the destination. Edited by Hobbema on 21 February 2010 at 8:56pm 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Fasulye Heptaglot Winner TAC 2012 Moderator Germany fasulyespolyglotblog Joined 5840 days ago 5460 posts - 6006 votes 1 sounds Speaks: German*, DutchC1, EnglishB2, French, Italian, Spanish, Esperanto Studies: Latin, Danish, Norwegian, Turkish Personal Language Map | Message 464 of 868 21 February 2010 at 10:30pm | IP Logged | ||
Hobbema, you give a good definition of what is an activated language. I have had quite some exchange with Iversen on this topic. We both have the opinion that the thinking level of a language is linked to the speaking level of a language. This means for me that, if I cannot think in a certain foreign language I cannot speak it - apart from using some standardized expressions. So for me it means that I need the thinking level of my languages. And I can think and speak freely in 7 languages, but not in Turkish and Danish. What I never do with texts in general is that I translate them into German. I do look up unknown words, which I cannot guess from the context and then I "assimilate" the text. I normally try to avoid translations and to understand foreign texts directly, the hyperliteral translations I make only for the readers, who don't understand my Turkish essays. To define "passive skills": If you can read texts or listen to podcasts, then you don't speak or write, but have passive language knowledge. These are the four key language skills: - reading (= passive skill) - listening (= passive skill) - writing (= active skill) - speaking (= active skill) There are quite a lot of people who speak foreign languages while thinking in their native language, but I would strongly not recommend that, because then the language skills will remain very restriced. If you can't eliminate your native language while speaking, you will never reach fluency. In my case with Turkish and Danish I also have a very long way to go and I give me at least 10 years for it. I learn these languages out of interest and for my own pleasure so I am very relaxed with what comes out of the learning process. For me the learning process of languages is really fun, it's not work like sitting in an office or a chore like cleaning the flat. Otherwise I couldn't coninue it my whole life long. If the learning process is not fun, people get tired of learning languages after a period of time and then they stop doing it. Fasulye Edited by Fasulye on 21 February 2010 at 10:35pm 2 persons have voted this message useful |
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