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Iversen’s Multiconfused Log (see p.1!) | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Language Learning Log |  | |
| Ellsworth Senior Member United States Joined 4958 days ago 345 posts - 528 votes  Speaks: English* Studies: German, Swedish, Finnish, Icelandic, Irish | Message 2769 of 3959 20 January 2012 at 12:36am | IP Logged |
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I love following your log and I am excited that you are working more on Irish! I will be
interested to follow your progress. Also as far as I know, "do" isn't required to form past tense except in certain dialects like Munster. I thought you could just form it by "bhuail mé" for I hit or struck. Edited by Ellsworth on 20 January 2012 at 12:44am 1 person has voted this message useful | |
 Iversen Super Polyglot Moderator Denmark berejst.dk Joined 6704 days ago 9078 posts - 16473 votes Speaks: Danish*, French, English, German, Italian, Spanish, Portuguese, Dutch, Swedish, Esperanto, Romanian, Catalan Studies: Afrikaans, Greek, Norwegian, Russian, Serbian, Icelandic, Latin, Irish, Lowland Scots, Indonesian, Polish, Croatian Personal Language Map | Message 2770 of 3959 20 January 2012 at 1:10am | IP Logged |
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Thanks for the tip. I have to admit that I just read what the textbook had to say without checking it (even though I know that there are other regional differences).
However on the internet there are impressive sites like Gramadach na Gaeilge - Die Irische Grammatik (in German), where I found this explanation: die Vergangenheits-Partikel do (..) * Sie wird nur mit unabhängigen Verbformen verwendet * Sie tritt nur in den Vergangenheits-Zeitformen (aimsirí stairiúla) Präteritum, Imperfekt und Konditional auf * *: do vor Konsonant ist nur mehr in Munster gebräuchlich und auch dort im Rückgang. Sonst nurmehr Lenition geblieben, ohne Partikel. So "do" mostly in Munster and mostly before vowels (with contraction), but there is still lenition/aspiration in the two past tenses and the conditional. I have a grammar from Teach Yourself, but it has always irritated me because it is half drills, half information - and some of the most important tables are relegated to an appendix. "Gramadach na Gaeilge" is much closer to my idea about a wellwritten grammar. I use my TY textbook to get rolling in Irish, but once I'm through this fairly slim book I'll base my studies on real texts. One reason that I have decided to return to Irish is that it has occurred to me that it doesn't matter that I pronounce this mistreated language like a duck with a spoon down its throat - chances are that I never will have a chance to use it in practice. Edited by Iversen on 20 January 2012 at 1:24am 1 person has voted this message useful | |
| Ellsworth Senior Member United States Joined 4958 days ago 345 posts - 528 votes Speaks: English* Studies: German, Swedish, Finnish, Icelandic, Irish | Message 2771 of 3959 20 January 2012 at 3:14am | IP Logged |
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Haha well unless you seek Irish speakers out, they are hard to find I imagine.
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| Iversen Super Polyglot Moderator Denmark berejst.dk Joined 6704 days ago 9078 posts - 16473 votes Speaks: Danish*, French, English, German, Italian, Spanish, Portuguese, Dutch, Swedish, Esperanto, Romanian, Catalan Studies: Afrikaans, Greek, Norwegian, Russian, Serbian, Icelandic, Latin, Irish, Lowland Scots, Indonesian, Polish, Croatian Personal Language Map | Message 2772 of 3959 20 January 2012 at 2:28pm | IP Logged |
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And now for something different from the discussion in the wake of the untimely and sad demise of Cainntear. At 8.45 this morning I woke up by the sound "dingdong". It transpired that a postman was outside my door with a package from Saxo Books, containg 4 item: Lonely Planet's guide to Taiwan (to be used at a suitable moment), a Hippocrene dictionary of Philippine (idem), a Greenlandic grammar in Danish (just for fun) and the fabled book "Babel no More" by Michel Erard. I had a train trip today and used it to read the first 100 pages and perusing the rest. I'll comment on the concrete content in the relevant thread.
One observation: "dingdong" is not only the sound of my doorbell, but apparently also a common name for bus stations in Taiwan, according to my new guide thereto. 2 persons have voted this message useful | |
| aloysius Triglot Winner TAC 2010 & 2012 Senior Member SwedenRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 6241 days ago 226 posts - 291 votes Speaks: Swedish*, English, German Studies: French, Greek, Italian, Russian | Message 2773 of 3959 20 January 2012 at 9:35pm | IP Logged |
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Another observation: Ding Dinge Dong was the original Dutch title of the 1975 ESC
winner Teach-In's Ding-A-Dong (according to Wikipedia), here with a Spanish introduction. Actually, I didn't know what a Teach-In was. Again, according to the same source: A teach-in is similar to a general educational forum on any complicated issue, usually an issue involving current political affairs. The main difference between a teach-in and a seminar is the refusal to limit the discussion to a specific frame of time or an academic scope of the topic. Teach-ins are meant to be practical, participatory, and oriented toward action. /aloysius 1 person has voted this message useful | |
| Iversen Super Polyglot Moderator Denmark berejst.dk Joined 6704 days ago 9078 posts - 16473 votes Speaks: Danish*, French, English, German, Italian, Spanish, Portuguese, Dutch, Swedish, Esperanto, Romanian, Catalan Studies: Afrikaans, Greek, Norwegian, Russian, Serbian, Icelandic, Latin, Irish, Lowland Scots, Indonesian, Polish, Croatian Personal Language Map | Message 2774 of 3959 23 January 2012 at 3:02pm | IP Logged |
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Da (Synn.) Æ hae wæt i Synnejylland i weekenden for å besøj mi moe å mi søste, å æ haj "Babbel it mer" i mi task tesamls mæ noe uskrifter - å noe a de siist wæ o synnejysk! Mi skrewen synnejysk æ ett ræjte standardisert, men æ tror it a synnejysk hår en standard. Mi forbilt æ æ hjæmsid synnejysk.dk å det a hår hørt fra æ folk derne'a - men ett mi æjn familj - vi snakke it synnejysk noen a wos (å det æ helle it o æ språchlist ue te æ venster her).
Så her æ et rejti echt eksempel (blanne mæ en smuul tysk) fra Nr. Hostrup: Den tysk præst - selfølle i fuld ornat - stoi frem fo'æ olte. Slau op å Johannes kapittel 4 ves 4 tæ 8 og sku lich tæ 'o løis. "Da kam eine Möve" en måch flyven ind øve fra Helgoland o ind øver æ plads, å så laut den en stoe klat, lich ne'e i æ biffel! Der Pfarrer - æ præst vo it sorn o slå ue. Han follet æ hinne o så op i æ hemmel! "Ich danke Dir Gott, dass die Kühe nicht fliegen kann". Æ tække de'gui tæ æ køe it ka flyv! I visited my mother and my sister in Southern Jutland in this weekend. None of us speak Southern Jutish, but even though they live near the outer limits of Synnejylland (the area that was returned to Denmark after WW I) you do hear a fair amount of Synnejysk dialect in the countryside, so I have some idea about it. And when I read the homepage synnejysk.dk - which is entirely in dialect - I can imagine how it should sound. And that's good, because there are no textbooks available, and although there probably are big expensive scholarly dictionaries written long ago stored at our libraries (plus a couple of short wordlists at this homepage) you are basically on your own if you try to learn such a dialect - so I don't. It's like doing field work on New Guinea. The spelling I have used is based on things I have seen at the homepage plus the pronunciation I have picked up from the real world. In 'Rigsdansk' the passage above would look like this (please notice that synnejysk doesn't use postclitic definite articles - 'æ' = 'the' in English): Da: Jeg har været i Sønderjylland i weekenden for at besøge min mor og min søster, og jeg havde "Bable no more" i min taske (til)sammen med nogle udskrifter - og nogle af de sidste var på sønderjysk! Mit skrevne sønderjysk er ikke rigtigt standardiseret, men jeg tror ikke at sønderjysk har en standard. Mit forbillede er hjemmesiden synnejysk.dk og det jeg har hørt fra folk(ene) dernede af - men ikke min egen familie - vi snakker ikke sønderjysk nogen af os (og det er heller ikke på sproglisten ude til venstre her) Så her er et rigtigt ægte eksempel (blandet med en smule tysk) fra Nørre Hostrup: Den tyske præst - selvfølgelig i fuldt ornat - stod frem foran alteret. Slog op på Johannes kapitel 4 vers 4 til 8 og skulle lige til at læse. 'Da kam eine Möve' Da kom en måge flyvende in over fra Helgoland og ind over pladsen, og så lagde den en stor klat, lige ned i Bibelen! Præsten var ikke sådan at slå ud. Han foldede hænderne og så op i himlen. 'Ich danke Dir Gott, dass die Kühe nicht fliegen kann'. "Jeg takker dig Gud, at køerne ikke kan flyve". The German pastor - of course in full vestments - stood before the altar. (He) opened the Bible on John chapter 4 verse 4 to 8 and was about to read. Then came a gull flying in across from Helgoland and into the square, and it let out one big blob, right down into the Bible! The priest was not easily fazed. He folded his hands and looked up into the sky. "Thank you God that cows can't fly." Edited by Iversen on 23 January 2012 at 3:06pm 1 person has voted this message useful | |
| Iversen Super Polyglot Moderator Denmark berejst.dk Joined 6704 days ago 9078 posts - 16473 votes Speaks: Danish*, French, English, German, Italian, Spanish, Portuguese, Dutch, Swedish, Esperanto, Romanian, Catalan Studies: Afrikaans, Greek, Norwegian, Russian, Serbian, Icelandic, Latin, Irish, Lowland Scots, Indonesian, Polish, Croatian Personal Language Map | Message 2775 of 3959 24 January 2012 at 1:24pm | IP Logged |
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My home computer wouldn't start yesterday so I spent the whole evening in my armchair, doing oldfashioned paperbased studies in a number of languages.
DU: Ik las een aanzienlijk deel van mijn Nederlandse gids naar Rome, die ik in de Vaticaanse Musea heb gekocht. Al eerder heb ik het gebruikt voor de studie van woordvolgorde in het Nederlands bijzinnen met samengestelde werkwoordsvormen, en ik begon ook met een passage over de Vesta-tempel in het Forum Romanum te kopiëren. Maar er zijn andere talen die meer nodig hebben van de behandeling. Dus in plaats daarvan begon ik alleen te lezen. BA I: Lalu aku melakukan daftar kata bahasa Indonesia dengan kata-kata dari artikel yang saya telah mempelajari baru-baru. Ini termasuk sebuah artikel tentang sintaks dari Wikipedia ... tapi di sini adalah pengamatan kecil yang menyenangkan! Aku harus menemukan link ke artikel oleh Google, jadi saya mencari kutipan "selain aturan ini, kata sintaksis juga". Ada banyak referensi untuk tempat-tempat web yang memiliki konten mereka dicuri dari Wikipedia. Yang menunjukkan bahwa dunia membutuhkan lebih Wikipedia daripada perusahaan-perusahaan yang telah perdaya atau bayar beberapa politisi kongres untuk upaya serangan pada bagian bebas dari Internet. RU: Потом я изучал небольшой отрывок из книги Спивака на полиглотом. Но об этом я уже давно писали. ESP: Post ĉi tiu mi kopiis la priskribojn de du ekskursoj de la informa broŝuro sendita la partoprenantoj en la Esperanto Universala Kongreso 2011 en Kopenhago. Parenteze, estas nuntempe diskuto en mia ĵurnalo pri Esperanto. Iu kun akademia titolo esprimis sin en degnantaj terminoj pri Esperanto, kaj ekde tiam kelkaj legantoj nesameideanaj provis klarigi iujn bazajn faktojn pri ĉi tiu lingvistino. Ekzemple ke Esperanto eble estus la kreo de unu viro, sed li lasis ĝin cirkaŭvagi en la mondo, kaj hodiaŭ ĝi funkcias ĝuste kiel iu ajn alia lingvo kiam vi klopodas lerni ĝin. Kaj ĝi havas denaskajn parolantojn. EN: And finally I studied yet some pages from my TY Irish - until page 47. GER: Darüber hinaus benutze ich "Irische-Gälisch Wort für Wort" vom Verlag Kauderwelsch als Bus-Lektüre - und dieser Name sollte man bitte wörtlich Nehmen. Das Büchlein hat oft 4 Zeilen pro Beispiel: die irische Originalversion, eine deutsch-freundliche Ausspracheanleitung, eine hyperbuchstabliche Übersetzung und eine gewöhnliche irreführende Standard-Hochdeutsche Übersetzung. Zum Beispiel: Is fuath le hElilís caife. is fuė lė hailiisch kafė (ė = Schwa-Laut) ist verhaßt mit Eilís Kaffee Eilís haßt Kaffee The program of the evening included these elements: I read a good deal of my Dutch guide to Rome, which I bought in the Vatican Museums. I made Indonesian wordlists from recently studied articles from the Indonesian Wikipedia I copied and studied a snippet of Spivak's Russian polyglot book I copied and studied a couple of excursion descriptions from the materials for the universal congress 2011 I continued my studies in my antique Teach Yourself Irish (and besides I use the booklet about Irish from the German editing house Kauderwelsch as bus reading) Edited by Iversen on 24 January 2012 at 5:08pm 1 person has voted this message useful | |
| Iversen Super Polyglot Moderator Denmark berejst.dk Joined 6704 days ago 9078 posts - 16473 votes Speaks: Danish*, French, English, German, Italian, Spanish, Portuguese, Dutch, Swedish, Esperanto, Romanian, Catalan Studies: Afrikaans, Greek, Norwegian, Russian, Serbian, Icelandic, Latin, Irish, Lowland Scots, Indonesian, Polish, Croatian Personal Language Map | Message 2776 of 3959 25 January 2012 at 3:09pm | IP Logged |
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I tried to start my home computer, but just as yesterday everything went well until it without warning shut down. First time it happened I made enough experiments to show that the error almost certainly lies in the power supply and built-in battery, not in a virus or external unit. The harddisk as such seems to be OK, but that doesn't help me. So I'll have to buy a new computer, reinstall all my programs and the data from my ackup, and that takes time which could be used on better things.
Until that new addition to my furniture is ready I'm studying in the oldfashioned way from the safe haven of my armchair ... the only electronical element was my TV, but yesterday I mostly watched programs in English. However after 23.00 I watched TVE in Spanish: SP: "Hemos cambiado" es un programa donde se visita a inmigrantes en España. Desafortunadamente a menudo con música fea de fondo o canto producido por las personas retratadas -, pero de vez en cuando se oye bastante auténtico español informal. Después de España, visitaron la ciudad más fría del mundo en Siberia, Oymyakon, donde hube una vez una temperatura de 72 grados bajo cero. Oh, oh. En el hecho conozco a alguien que ha visitado el lugar - algunas personas gozan de un clima frío, pero yo no. Ni siquiera hago el esquí. RU: Затем я прочитал об Иване III в моей русской истории книги (как утечки из книги Спивака). Но почему-то я пропустил Спивака, так что я прочитал отрывок, где он впервые упоминает 7-языках правила. ESP: Poste mi studis refoje trairejon de la broŝuro de la kongreso en Kopenhago, ĉifoje pri ekskurso al la Carlsberg Bierfarejo kun la elefantoj ĉe la enirejo kaj biero post la ĉiĉeronata vizito. GR: Έχω πολλές φορές πριν αναφέρει ο οδηγός για την Αθήνα, αλλά χθες μελετούσα ένα πέρασμα για το Bούλη και το Κήπος πίσω από αυτόν. Αθήνα διαθέτει πλέον ένα πρόστιμο νέο ζωολογικό κήπο κοντά στο αεροδρόμιο, αλλά για μεγάλο χρόνο το μοναδικό ζωολογικό κήπο της χώρας ήταν σε αυτό το πάρκο. EN: And finally I spent some time with my TY Irish. Edited by Iversen on 25 January 2012 at 3:45pm 1 person has voted this message useful |
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