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Listening-Reading system | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Learning Techniques, Methods & Strategies | ( Topic Closed) |  |
| Zhuangzi Nonaglot Language Program Publisher Senior Member Canada lingq.com Joined 7029 days ago 646 posts - 688 votes  Speaks: English*, French, Japanese, Swedish, Mandarin, Cantonese, German, Italian, Spanish Studies: Russian | Message 241 of 489 31 July 2007 at 10:13am | IP Logged | |||||||||||
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lloydkirk,
Don't worry about siomotteikiru. In amongst her kook rants you will find some good advice on language learning. 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||||||||
| lloydkirk Diglot Senior Member United StatesRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 6414 days ago 429 posts - 452 votes Speaks: English*, French Studies: Russian | Message 242 of 489 31 July 2007 at 11:14am | IP Logged | |||||||||||
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I very much respect her knowledge and methods regarding language learning, but she could try to be more courteous and avoid the rants, it detracts from the purpose of the thread. However, I have found some problems with her method.
1.) I don't think it works for a beginner. You need to have a foundation in the basic grammar and vocabulary of the language. Why? Because, depending on the novel, you'll be exposed early on to obscure/advanced literary tenses and vocabulary before you have mastered the basics of the colloquial language. I find it would be wise to do assimil or fsi before. 2.) Parallel texts are hard to come buy. While browsing on amazon I could find maybe 2-3 english-German short stories. Making parallel texts is tedious at best. Lastly, it won't suit everyone's learning style. If you dislike assimil, you'll dislike this. 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||||||||
| Zhuangzi Nonaglot Language Program Publisher Senior Member Canada lingq.com Joined 7029 days ago 646 posts - 688 votes Speaks: English*, French, Japanese, Swedish, Mandarin, Cantonese, German, Italian, Spanish Studies: Russian | Message 243 of 489 31 July 2007 at 11:59am | IP Logged | |||||||||||
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I think beginners need easy material.
We will experiment with this approach at LingQ by having parallel beginner texts in several languages. I did something similar in Russian. We have a simple story in English divided into 27 30-60 second segments of audio complete with transcript. I had it translated into Russian.One of our programmars is Russian and he and his wife recorded the dialogue. I listened to it at first while reading the English. Then I listened to the Russian alone a least 50 times, while jogging and doing other things. It was there that I found that interlaced text did not work for me. Some of the phrases that come most often to my mind in Russian are from this content. We have now translated this text into Spanish and French,(our learners did this) and this is available in the LingQ library. We hope to have more translations of this and other material. 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||||||||
| siomotteikiru Senior Member Zaire Joined 6362 days ago 102 posts - 242 votes | Message 244 of 489 31 July 2007 at 1:50pm | IP Logged | |||||||||||
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It does work for beginners, the text should be translated in a special way.
I know a six-year-old girl who is listening-reading to fairy tales by Andersen. She's learning English. Censorship has a lot to do with parallel texts. I've been enraged time and again - I wanted to make parallel Spanish-English-Russian-Italian texts of Lolita by Nabokov and 1984 by Orwell, Italian-English-Polish-Russian of The Name of the Rose by Umberto Eco, and I couldn't. The books were censored in one language at least. It happens time and again, I buy books, audiobooks, just to waste the money and time and trust. They censor everything, even H.C. Andersen. 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||||||||
| FSI Senior Member United States Joined 6360 days ago 550 posts - 590 votes Speaks: English* | Message 245 of 489 31 July 2007 at 3:26pm | IP Logged | |||||||||||
If you use a text that's too complicated for your level with the language, you may have trouble. Anna Karenina is an intermediate-to-advanced level text in any language. In contrast, The Light Princess is an excellent read for children and adults alike. The method works best when you use a text that is already easily understandable in your L1.
You don't have to use a novel. If you do choose a novel, choose one you can easily understand in your L1. Fairy tales and childrens' stories are excellent choices. In addition, there are plenty of short stories one can use the method with.
I don't use parallel texts, or make them. A book in the L2 plus a translation in the L1 (plus the audiobook in L2) has enabled me to fit the method to my own style, with success. Perhaps you could try a similar approach.
Of course. No style fits everyone. But for people looking for a cheap and effective means of learning languages, this is surely one to consider. 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||||||||
| siomotteikiru Senior Member Zaire Joined 6362 days ago 102 posts - 242 votes | Message 246 of 489 01 August 2007 at 12:25am | IP Logged | |||||||||||
frenkeld
Vertical side by side texts are much easier to use. You can check the meaning or the spelling instantly without stopping the audio. Echoic and iconic memories are very short (less than one second), so you get lost when you use printed books. Once you've prepared a bilingul parallel text, it is easy to make multiligual ones, you just copy one side and paste it to another version. You can translate easily using vertical texts, you just cover one side. You can see what is missing and wonder why it is so. There should be a law enforced by God Almighty: All translated texts should be published as parallel ones, there would be less cheating and bungling. And censorship would be more difficult. If you'd rather use a printed version, you can print an e-text, and a computer is an excellent tool for printing. 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||||||||
| siomotteikiru Senior Member Zaire Joined 6362 days ago 102 posts - 242 votes | Message 247 of 489 01 August 2007 at 2:34am | IP Logged | |||||||||||
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Here's an unabridged parallel text of "Alice's Adventures in Wonderland" by Lewis Carroll, prepared by me (Phi-Staszek=siomottekikiru) for Polish learners of English.
It's for complete beginners, the text is translated word for word, if necessary. Grammar codes are included, too. www.stultorum.pochta.ru\Eng\AliceP-A-Gr.7z One day is enough to listen-read to the whole book three times. Warning: Do not try to learn Polish using the texts. 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||||||||
| asad100101 Diglot Senior Member Pakistan languagel.blogspot.c Joined 6456 days ago 118 posts - 137 votes Speaks: Hindi*, English | Message 248 of 489 01 August 2007 at 7:08am | IP Logged | |||||||||||
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I am reading and listening crime and punishment novel. My mind wanders away too many times in the middle and it is difficult for me to give full 100% concentration on doing this. Any remedy to counter this. I dont know how people can listen to something straight for 12 hours(or even 3/4 hours for that matter). To me it seems impossible to do that at best I can listen to 4 hours a day and that is even into small chunks of one hour each throughout the day.
Edited by asad100101 on 01 August 2007 at 7:11am 1 person has voted this message useful |
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