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Why do Koreans speak such good English? | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : General discussion |  | |
| crafedog Diglot Senior Member United Kingdom Joined 5819 days ago 166 posts - 337 votes  Speaks: English*, Spanish Studies: Korean, Tok Pisin, French | Message 17 of 27 01 March 2011 at 12:24pm | IP Logged | ||
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Huh?
As an English teacher in Korea I was very surprised to see this post. Not to be rude but you are completely mistaken. In fact, if I recall, they are the lowest in the world on a particular scale (certain tests) but the highest in spending on English education tragically. 2 major reasons. Korean is very different from English and vice-versa. Articles, plurals, certain tenses, verb collocations, prepositions etc. will frequently be difficult for a Korean speaker of English. A common problem is that English is the only language they tend to learn (especially in school) so they don't get the benefit of learning a slightly more similar language (Chinese - vocab; Japanese - structure, vocab again). Secondly, many Koreans have what's called "foreigner fear" in which they cannot speak in English to a Westerner because they are afraid of making mistakes (this disappears when they've travelled a bit). The lack of confidence is crippling. Also the way they are taught it in school is a bit of a joke. The shoddiness of the public schools methods are a contributing factor to the spread of English 학원 (hagwons, after school classes/commercial institutions). Also the amount of shoddy English workbooks written by Koreans (with no help from a native English speaker whatsoever) that I've frequently seen is truly shocking. I've got a picture of one that mis-spelt English on the front cover ('Englishe' unsurprisingly). During my time in Korea (I have to have taught at least a 1000 students and I've obviously met many Koreans) I've only met about a dozen people I would consider fluent and less than 50 I would even remotely consider near-fluent. Honestly it's not surprising at all to meet a Korean who's been studying for a decade and is still barely past low-intermediate (they're also very busy people so that doesn't help). On the positive side though, they tend to be quite good with the pronunciation due to the diversity of the vowel sounds in Korean (something the Japanese and Spanish languages lack for learning English and Chinese English can be plagued by tones) but due to the Korean prosody, many can still sound quite flat even when their pronunciation is quite good. Also their consonant pronunciation can be much weaker than it should be. I wish Koreans would learn Chinese or Japanese first when they're really young to give them some language experience before tackling something as different as English but that's a pipedream (on a national level) sadly. Oh well, keeps me in a job and I'm always trying to help my students/friends with my own personal techniques, many of which I'm glad to say that I learnt from this forum (thanks everybody). Edited by crafedog on 01 March 2011 at 12:30pm 12 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| russellballard Tetraglot Newbie China Joined 5135 days ago 16 posts - 16 votes Speaks: English*, Spanish, Mandarin, French Studies: Japanese | Message 18 of 27 01 March 2011 at 12:32pm | IP Logged | ||
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I suppose the fact that the people from Korea I know are enrolled in an American university would make them the
exception rather than the rule. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| crafedog Diglot Senior Member United Kingdom Joined 5819 days ago 166 posts - 337 votes Speaks: English*, Spanish Studies: Korean, Tok Pisin, French | Message 19 of 27 01 March 2011 at 12:56pm | IP Logged | ||
Yep. http://www.koreatimes.co.kr/www/news/nation/2008/06/117_2527 9.html http://briandeutsch.blogspot.com/2008/06/south-koreans-not-d oing-too-well-on.html http://www.koreatimes.co.kr/www/news/nation/2009/10/117_4629 5.html Extremely hard-working people but not always the most successful with English sadly. Edited by crafedog on 01 March 2011 at 12:57pm 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Matheus Senior Member Brazil Joined 5082 days ago 208 posts - 312 votes Speaks: Portuguese* Studies: English, French | Message 20 of 27 08 March 2011 at 2:25am | IP Logged | ||
I agree that Koreans aren't good at English, and I think English native speakers aren't good at Korean as well. Why do Dutch, Norwegian, Sweedish, Danish and Israeli are good at English? I've heard that Germans spoke good English. The same happens to Dutch and Swedish people, the ones I have met always had a fluent level and also an idiomatic English. I did envy their level. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
 jeff_lindqvist Diglot Moderator SwedenRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 6910 days ago 4250 posts - 5711 votes Speaks: Swedish*, English Studies: German, Spanish, Russian, Dutch, Mandarin, Esperanto, Irish, French Personal Language Map | Message 21 of 27 08 March 2011 at 10:45am | IP Logged | ||
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I quote myself:
"The level of English (and foreign languages) is probably overestimated. The knowledge of English is generally good, and basically everyone under 40 (50?) has studied it since at least third grade. Swedes probably speak better English than those who never hear the language in movies and on TV (there we have a real advantage). Decent conversations - yes. Swedish accent - oh yes." One can't assume that Swedes, Germans, Dutch, Danes, Norwegians...Israeli (?) generally are "good" at English. Who is saying this? The native English speakers? Other foreigners? What's the definition of "good"? Stringing together sentences? Having a native accent? Top grammar? Maybe speakers of other languages might think that the above group speaks super-English “since they don’t sound as bad as us”. (Some languages produce very thick accents in English, and some are not that chique). 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| jazzboy.bebop Senior Member Norway norwegianthroughnove Joined 5419 days ago 439 posts - 800 votes Speaks: English* Studies: Norwegian | Message 22 of 27 08 March 2011 at 12:39pm | IP Logged | ||
I suppose the definition of "good" could simply be the ability to actually converse in English and to do so without constantly stopping to think of how you want to say what you want to say and essentially be functionally fluent. I have been going to Norway every year since I was a baby and always found it difficult to find someone who doesn't speak English to a decent functional level, at least adults under 50 anyway. I think that a big part of the reason why they generally speak good English in Norway (and probably the same in other aforementioned countries) is down to exposure. If I go into a Narvesen in Norway (general newsagent), there are many English language magazines, perhaps a quarter to a third of all the magazines are in English. Then around half of the films shown on TV are in English with subtitles. The sheer amount of exposure to English makes a massive difference, paired with the similarities to English of the native language of the learner and the general interest in learning English. I expect there is a similar situation in all the aforementioned countries. As a native English speaker, I would say people in those countries, or at the very least in Norway, are "good" at speaking English but only because of the big advantages of their situation. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Darklight1216 Diglot Senior Member United StatesRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 5101 days ago 411 posts - 639 votes Speaks: English*, French Studies: German | Message 23 of 27 08 March 2011 at 8:33pm | IP Logged | ||
I saw a blog written by a Norwegian who said that they normally learn how to speak English well there because they know all the jobs are in the UK --- his words (paraphrased) not mine. I think that Nicklas Backstrom (Washington Capitals center) alluded to Swedes speaking English well... maybe. That was a long time ago though; I might be mistaken. Regardless, I've noticed that the Caps Swedish players are fairly proficient in English although Backstrom probably shouldn't teach it. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=797XKNJrGa8 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Arekkusu Hexaglot Senior Member Canada bit.ly/qc_10_lec Joined 5382 days ago 3971 posts - 7747 votes Speaks: English, French*, GermanC1, Spanish, Japanese, Esperanto Studies: Italian, Norwegian, Mandarin, Romanian, Estonian | Message 24 of 27 08 March 2011 at 8:46pm | IP Logged | ||
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I just got an email from a Korean needing pronunciation help:
"I'm freaking out my pronunciation nowadays because nativies don't understand one." Somehow, she is not exhibiting the same level of confidence as you are willing to bestow upon her. 1 person has voted this message useful |
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